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-   -   Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs. (https://www.sailnet.com/forums/general-discussion-sailing-related/325696-learning-mistakes-ours-theirs.html)

Minnewaska 09-20-2018 01:25 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Maybe I’ll frame tschmidty’s point a little differently.

Do you want the flight crew on your next trip to take chances with known defects that probably won’t kill everyone, but could. Stuff can still go wrong, despite doing everything right. Witness Captain Sully. However, would you feel the same, if they had taken a pass on basic safety protocol.

It’s not the failure itself that damns the decision to take a risk. It’s the failure to carry out your known and agreed upon risk mitigation that does.

krisscross 09-20-2018 01:58 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Minnewaska (Post 2051554136)
Maybe I’ll frame tschmidty’s point a little differently.

Do you want the flight crew on your next trip to take chances with known defects that probably won’t kill everyone, but could. Stuff can still go wrong, despite doing everything right.

I might not have been clear. I would not gamble with other people’s lives just because I chose to be sloppy in the execution of my responsibilities. But I can take a risk with my own life if I find that risk to be manageable. I have done that many times. I paddled my board in gator country quite a few times, for example. Some else might consider that to be a very dumb idea. I went to sea with people who I knew were less than qualified. Again, to some it would have been a dumb idea. For me it was just a manageable risk taken in exchange for an adventure and opportunity to learn.

Capt Len 09-20-2018 06:02 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
When I was younger several school friends were lost with their dad's fishboats. Storms,fires, explosion ,Things go wrong. With this background, I never avoided a possible bluewater adventure with a variety of total strangers, From starving backpacker to a bunk and sorta fed, What's not to like? Learned a bunch, came back, at 32 built my boat ,sailed 40 yrs more. If I could do it again ,,, probably with more panache,, but caution?? Naw!

Arcb 09-21-2018 07:43 AM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Challenge + travel + interesting companions + unknown outcome = adventure ;)

tomandchris 09-21-2018 05:11 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Saw a quote a week ago that kind of shows how many of us learn.

"Good judgement comes for experience, and Experience-Well, that comes from poor judgement.
-Winnie the Pooh-

I don't want to count the ways that I have gained experience and survived.

Krisscross, good read. Thanks!

Bird Dog 09-22-2018 10:07 AM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
As a professional aviator who’s specific line of work involves a niche of flying that involves a reasonable degree more potential risk that say a commercial pilot, the one thing I think is the old aviation truism:

There are old pilots, and bold pilots, but no old bold pilots.

Sure, it is a broad statement, as most such sayings are. Kind of like the saying that in a competiton to fly lowest, you can only tie with the ground.

Two dimensions can be just as risky as three for sure. Mishaps in three dimensional travel just seem to be a bit more abrupt on occasion. I’m no experienced salt. Just a novice coastal cruiser. But when I brought my boat down from the Chessapeake to NC over a 4 day trip that pales in comparison to most of the journeys I read on here, my mate was a fellow aviator and we both crewed with the same sense of purpose as if flying (as in prep, care and maintenance, pre and post flight... I mean saling, etc). A common thread in both disciplines which made it all the more enjoyable.

Said in no way critical. Good sea story of learning. Just being conversational. That said, another old aviation addage is something like:

When you start, you have three buckets. Two are empty: knowlwge and experience. Third is full: luck. Be sure not to empty the third before you fill the first two!

I wonder if that was an old sea addage applied to flying years ago...

Best regards

hasher 09-22-2018 04:38 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Just finished a great read about Virgin Galactic's quest for commercial space travel. They lost a test pilot. It nearly killed the program but didn't. Afterwards the ace pilot speaking to the engineers paraphrased an Apollo engineer: We need to work with thoughtful courage and not be blinded by fearful safety.

overthehorizon 09-22-2018 05:39 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Kriss, You had a great adventure and cram course learning experience and you wound up safely at home to boot. “Boring is good” is a saying for ocean passages but how do you learn if nothing breaks or goes wrong. You learn from heavy weather and adversity not when the autopilot steers the way to exotic ports under blue skies and sun drenched decks. That is like trying to learn music by watching a player piano. But…you got off that boat at the very best spot in the ocean. Read the history books; Christopher Columbus and every sailboat after him had one hell of a time fighting the trade winds and currents to get around that big hump in the area east of Honduras and on to Panama. I have sailed that route and it is not pleasant. If I remember correctly, Columbus named the turning point of land “Gracias Dios”, Thank you God or something like that. Only then can the boat turn off a bit and sail on a continuous heading, more southerly, rather than tacking, tacking, tacking and make little to no headway. You did well. There is a way to have a good ocean crossing experience without too much anxiety. It would be on a strong boat, a Swan, with a very experienced captain. Check out Offshore Passage Opportunities. One of their programs is a charter that leaves Newport, Rhode Island on the first weekend in November, to St. Maarten, with a stop in Bermuda. The trip is part of the North American Rally to the Caribbean. Most crew sign up in anticipation of a heavy weather trip to Bermuda as that is what generally happens that time of year. You must have a satisfactory sailing resume to sign on to the program. www.sailopo.com

RegisteredUser 09-22-2018 05:48 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 

Capt Len 09-22-2018 07:46 PM

Re: Learning from mistakes, ours and theirs.
 
Some of my adventures were enhanced by therapeutic hysterical screaming from the forepeak for days (captain's latest squeeze) while his ex(pregnant by the other crew) hits on me. No engine or electronics and only 55' so not much to go wrong and all the running sheets and stuff had been stolen in Greece so no worry about that. Can't get lost with Africa to the south and Europe to the north.Most of the stores had been eaten by the ex and beau while waiting for the skipper to come back from Holland so food was scarce. .Quit in Sicily,and glad of it. Julia went on to cross the Atlantic as I did in '68.Some of you old timers may have met Mis Turk in Antigua. You'd remember her ,,,nice legs. She wrote this 'adventure 'up for British Yachting World sometime in the '70's .Gotta wonder how much is false news in those mags.'


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