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post #11 of 138 Old 09-23-2019
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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Happy Birthday! Go for as more as you can!

Cap your situation is different of course...
Thanks.
I am extremely fortunate to have this wife now.
Yes, and I guess that's why i just imparted my story and had no advice for you. Dirt dwelling actually terrifies me. I've been out here so long I kinda feel like that boy raised by wolves in the forest, when I do visit the states.
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post #12 of 138 Old 09-23-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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I looked up an 85 Contest. It shows a rudder on a skeg, and it looks like there was a wing keel and fin keel version. SailboatData says that they were originally powered by a Volvo Penta?
There were a bunch of versions of the hull.... it began as a 35' LOA with a plumb transom and then they changed the transom and the LOA increased a foot.

They offered a masthead and a fractional rig. I have the fractional.

They offered 3 different keels... wing, shoal and deep fin. I have a deep fin 6'-3" draft.

The offered with or without teak decks. I do not have teak.

The engine is a Volvo MD17D 36 hp 3 cylinder w/ fresh water cooling factory added.

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post #13 of 138 Old 09-23-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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Thanks.
I am extremely fortunate to have this wife now.
Yes, and I guess that's why i just imparted my story and had no advice for you. Dirt dwelling actually terrifies me. I've been out here so long I kinda feel like that boy raised by wolves in the forest, when I do visit the states.
You are indeed... a good wife is a thing to cherish!

I lived on dirt until I got Shiva at 38 yrs old. Only boats I had been on were ferries!

Once I went on a friend's sailboat I was enchanted and the following year he wanted me to be partners with him on a 48' boat. YIKES. I decided to start learning. Deal fell apart and I bought Shiva a year and a few months after my first sail in '85.

I did live aboard in the Carib and in the Canaries... but the vast amount of time I owned the boat I had a place on dirt. I love (and can hate) NYC. It is such an amazing experience in so many ways... except sailing... so you need to drive to get to a nice place to sail. Such is life. I like the yin and yang....

I fear I may miss it in the future.

pay attention... someone's life depends on it
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post #14 of 138 Old 09-23-2019
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

There may be an owner to fit a transitional ownership thing.
However, I could not think of anything worse than the hell of having the previous owner having any interest whatsoever in my new purchase.
I pay the money and you give me the keys. All the keys.

As for getting a broker to list it to find a needle in a haystack... Well...

So good luck with it but I wouldn't hold my breath.
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post #15 of 138 Old 09-23-2019
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

My wife and I purchased Pinniped this past winter from owners who had decided they were getting older, becoming maybe less capable than they had been, and they didnít want her to sit. They had listed Pinniped on Craigslist, hoping I think to find someone reasonably close by. When I found the listing and talked to them, they invited us out for a sail. It was the second time the boat had been out all season.

Pinniped was especially dear to the couple who owned her. They didnít buy her. They built her from plans in their back yard, over the course of a decade, and then sailed her on the Great Lakes for the better part of 30 years. They designed and fabricated (or had metal shops fabricate from their drawings) every part, fitting, and furnishing on board. They bought the best hardware, rigging, mast, etc. Pinniped was 150% their baby.

We talked over the course of several weeks. We made an offer, negotiated, and exchanged dollars for papers. I think we all understood that this was less of a purchase, and more of a change of caretakers. They spent a lot of time with us going over her, and they continue to answer questions as they come up.

It has been a really positive relationship. I know it had to hurt to step off of her after they helped to deliver her to our nearby marina after launch. They know literally every inch of Pinniped, and they continue to be a vault of knowledge when I have run into problems or wanted advice on how to do something.

I know this doesnít really help much, but maybe it can show that there are some people out there who get it, and will understand your connection and your desire to help them get going on the right foot. I know that when it is time for us to move on, we will be looking for a new caretaker in much the same way.

Jonathan

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post #16 of 138 Old 09-24-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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There may be an owner to fit a transitional ownership thing.
However, I could not think of anything worse than the hell of having the previous owner having any interest whatsoever in my new purchase.
I pay the money and you give me the keys. All the keys.

As for getting a broker to list it to find a needle in a haystack... Well...

So good luck with it but I wouldn't hold my breath.
I think for some buyers buying in over time... with seller financing can make sense. Seller gets his number and buyer can avoid interest.

If I got the dollar amount I want I could walk away and new owner would be left to figure it out and likely call me frequently for help. What would you do? Charge for your time as a consultant? Or give this help away for free?

++++

A friend recently purchased a sister ship to go use for live aboard and sailing south and eventually to the West Coast. He was up against the task of fitting out the boat for that purpose. His decisions were in almost all systems/cases very different from mine. Obviously he wants to sail differently. I like some of his ideas and not others... but all were well executed and work for him and his needs. It shows how the same hull can be "upgraded" differently for similar missions and be successful because different sailors have different ideas. One example... He's a young guy and went with a manual horizontal windlass... and all chain. I was a bit older than him when I installed a reversing electric vertical with a cockpit remote w/ up and down capability. I am very satisfied with how my windlass and anchoring worked out.

The new owner experienced or not... buys the decisions and thinking and sailing approach of the previous owner. An experienced buy likely has very specific ideas of what they want and may be faced with alterations or getting used to the previous owner's decisions.

A fair amount of boats... such as charter boats are fitted for local sailing and designed to comfort it seems. This may or may not suit the type of sailing of someone who purchases a former charter boat...

pay attention... someone's life depends on it
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post #17 of 138 Old 09-24-2019
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

For what it's worth, selling 4 previous boats, most new owners stayed in touch with me for years. I'd get a call with a question, like what does this switch do again? Many of the new owners asked me to go out with them a couple of times for a sail. I enjoyed this. They became friends. Some are still in touch.

But in each case, I sold them the boat. They took full ownership. At least one owner decided to replace dodger, sail cover, etc with a canvas of a hideous color. I refrained from comment. It's their boat now.

I've been lucky to never sell a boat to someone I didn't actually like. I know others who have, so no guarantees, but assuming you don't need an immediate out for some reason, you can be selective with whom you negotiate, and with whom you insist on full ask. I have to admit melting at least once when a young enthusiastic couple clearly couldn't come to my number, I probably gave them too much of a break, but the experience was worth it.

Sailing is an experience. A sail boat is so much more than a thing. The whole thing needs to be right, and fun, including purchase and sale, the lasting experience, the camaraderie of a common set of experiences.

So, IMHO, sell it fully. Transfer ownership. But try to find someone who's the right buyer, and help them out. Sailing self selects people that you are going to like for the most part. Don't deal with someone you don't. They will probably exit the hobby as soon as they find out how it isn't like the movie they saw, it rains sometimes, it gets nautical out there, and stuff breaks. By not negotiating with people like this you are doing them a favor. Hand off your boat to a new owner who will change somethings, but love sailing as much as you do.

Good luck SanderO, I really enjoy your posts and hope you hang in here whatever happen.
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post #18 of 138 Old 09-24-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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Originally Posted by capecodda View Post
For what it's worth, selling 4 previous boats, most new owners stayed in touch with me for years. I'd get a call with a question, like what does this switch do again? Many of the new owners asked me to go out with them a couple of times for a sail. I enjoyed this. They became friends. Some are still in touch.

But in each case, I sold them the boat. They took full ownership. At least one owner decided to replace dodger, sail cover, etc with a canvas of a hideous color. I refrained from comment. It's their boat now.

I've been lucky to never sell a boat to someone I didn't actually like. I know others who have, so no guarantees, but assuming you don't need an immediate out for some reason, you can be selective with whom you negotiate, and with whom you insist on full ask. I have to admit melting at least once when a young enthusiastic couple clearly couldn't come to my number, I probably gave them too much of a break, but the experience was worth it.

Sailing is an experience. A sail boat is so much more than a thing. The whole thing needs to be right, and fun, including purchase and sale, the lasting experience, the camaraderie of a common set of experiences.

So, IMHO, sell it fully. Transfer ownership. But try to find someone who's the right buyer, and help them out. Sailing self selects people that you are going to like for the most part. Don't deal with someone you don't. They will probably exit the hobby as soon as they find out how it isn't like the movie they saw, it rains sometimes, it gets nautical out there, and stuff breaks. By not negotiating with people like this you are doing them a favor. Hand off your boat to a new owner who will change somethings, but love sailing as much as you do.

Good luck SanderO, I really enjoy your posts and hope you hang in here whatever happen.
Great post. Boats mean different things to different people. I expect to continue commenting on SN for the foreseeable future. No worries there.

Sure if some comes to me with my asking price and wants to sail the boat to MD... so be it. I wouldn't turn the sale down.

I also think that there is a market in LIS and a slow hand off may make sense for a long time owner and a new one. I think this is especially true in the case (mine) where the boat has been own fore more than a decade or two and been used for passages, lived aboard in the tropics and cruised locally in NE. It's not a common boat either... especially in the USA. And it's not even well known.

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post #19 of 138 Old 09-24-2019
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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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I think for some buyers buying in over time... with seller financing can make sense. Seller gets his number and buyer can avoid interest.
Advertising seller financing would definitely attract buyers, but maybe not the kind you want.

Many years ago, a friend's wife offered to by an old motorcycle of mine for my friend's birthday. She asked if she could pay me in three installments over 3 months. Of course, I agreed. She stiffed me on the last payment. Months more went buy, until I told my friend that she never paid. He was mortified and paid me himself. Yea, this was with someone I considered a friend, not some stranger. Never assume anything.

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If I got the dollar amount I want I could walk away and new owner would be left to figure it out and likely call me frequently for help. What would you do? Charge for your time as a consultant? Or give this help away for free?
I took you to be a bit more generous than this comment implies. I'm still in touch with PO of my boat, which I bought a decade ago. My questions have slowed considerably, but I had a ton in the first few years. He was glad to reply. He would even send me information unsolicited, as he recalled some things. I still keep him up to date on where we take his former pride and joy, what upgrades we've made and our plans for the upcoming year. He seems to enjoy staying emotionally connected. I'm sure I've mentioned this before, but he shed tears when we pulled away from his slip all those years back.


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Re: Exiting Strategies for Boat Ownership

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Advertising seller financing would definitely attract buyers, but maybe not the kind you want.

Many years ago, a friend's wife offered to by an old motorcycle of mine for my friend's birthday. She asked if she could pay me in three installments over 3 months. Of course, I agreed. She stiffed me on the last payment. Months more went buy, until I told my friend that she never paid. He was mortified and paid me himself. Yea, this was with someone I considered a friend, not some stranger. Never assume anything.



I took you to be a bit more generous than this comment implies. I'm still in touch with PO of my boat, which I bought a decade ago. My questions have slowed considerably, but I had a ton in the first few years. He was glad to reply. He would even send me information unsolicited, as he recalled some things. I still keep him up to date on where we take his former pride and joy, what upgrades we've made and our plans for the upcoming year. He seems to enjoy staying emotionally connected. I'm sure I've mentioned this before, but he shed tears when we pulled away from his slip all those years back.
Of course I would provide support to the new owner. And this would have to involve a few full days of going over every system. They would have to take notes because too much to commit to memory.

++++

If I felt OK to sail and operate the boat... the final turnover would be very difficult. However I am anticipating that my mobility will gradually decline to the point where it will be too difficult and I will have to face reality and let go. I will not be the first. I thin the slow transition will reveal this... and make it physically and emotionally easier.

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