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Help for clueless newby

7K views 67 replies 15 participants last post by  runner 
#1 ·
I purchased a 16 foot long by 64 inch wide aluminun sailboat this weekend to restore. The basic boat is all there for the most part, but it is not rigged. I don't know anything about sailboats except what I have read in the last few days. I have a few questions!!!

Since there are no markings to identify the boat, I will attempt to describe the boat as best I can. I apologise for not being up on the correct lingo yet. The boat is 16 feet long and 63-64 inches across. It has an aluminum mast with an adjustable foot position. The mast is 20 feet with a track for the piece that the main sheet attaches to to hoist the sail. It does not provide for an internal line. The boom slides up the same track. There is one cleat at the bottom rear of the mast that I assume is for a downhaul on the boom. It has a jib sail that is a few feet shorter than the main. It attaches with bronze clips to the front mast support cable and I am not sure where it cleats down yet. There are two cleats on the front edge of the cockpit that could be used to move it from one side of the mast to the other. The bottom mast corner is controled by the line only The boom has a sheave at the mid point and near the end both. There are cockpit cleats at the midpoint of the boom on each side of the cockpit and one on the rear of the centerboard well. There are two line eyes mounted on the deck outboard and a little to the rear of the front corners of the cockpit. Other than the rudder mounts and the motor mount brackets, those are all the attachment points on the boat.
If I use the two cleats at the front of the cockpit to hold the jib sheet and the lower corner of the sail, then I have to move the sheet around the mast by hand each time, but the jib sheet is the only line really needed. If I use two ropes snapped to the eye on the sail, and then run thru the eyelets on the deck and tied at the rear cleats, all I have to do is ease one and tighten the other to move the rear of the jib from side to side. That is simple. Rigged that way, the sheet that hoists the sail would be cleated at the front of the cockpit and two separate lines would actually control the sail. That would allow about 4 feet of side to side movement of the back corner of the jib. I don't know if that much is needed or not. I am guessing that is the way it was rigged before.
That leaves one cleat open on the back end of the board well to control the side to side on the boom. The boom has two pulleys. One middle and one to the rear to control the boom. It also has a smaller pulley to pull the sail taut mounted on the boom itself. The main sheet and the rigging for the boom are gone. Looking at the pictures and diagrams online, I don't have the hardware for a rig like most I have seen. If the center pulley connects to the cleat on the back of the board well, Then what is the back pulley for? I need some help!
That is the first of my many questions! Thanks in advance for any help given!
 
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#2 ·
Runner-

Go to the song chain and post eight posts so you can post links to photos and then link to some photos. Also, read the post in my signature, since it has a lot of useful information for new users....including how to post photos.

Photos would help a lot on a post like this. :)
 
#3 ·
Read up too

Runner,

I suggest you also get a good basic book on sailing and sailboats so you can study up and familiarize yourself with the terminology. You'll learn quickly that everything on a sailboat has a specific name and using the correct names will make communicating with other sailors much easier. Best of luck with your project.

Gary
 
#4 ·
For books, I'd highly recommend Dave Seidman's The Complete Sailor. About $17 at Borders or Barnes & Noble. A bit less on-line.
 
#5 · (Edited)
Thanks!

I was told this boat dates back to the forties. If it had any kind of identification, I have not found it. It is still possible I will find something as I strip the many layers of paint.
As far as the lingo goes, I will pick it up. Still have not seen the name of the sliding piece that is on the end of the main sheet and slides in the channel of the mast. That is the only piece I don't have that is needed to rig the boat the way it used to be rigged that I know of.
Right now the boat is upside down with paint stripper being used on one side. I am posting between scraping sessions. I don't know if a shot of the bottom is going to help, but I will get one if you think it would help. I will get pictures of the boat upright as soon as I can.
The hull is around 200 pounds, but I am gonna scrape 10 of that off at least.
Does that book describe or diagram small boat rigging in any way?
Again, thanks in advance! Have a beautiful day.
 
#9 ·
Cam-

On my boat, the Main HALYARD attaches to the Headboard... at the top of the sail. The Main SHEET attaches to the boom. :) Maybe it is a good thing you are taking up RV'ing. :) ;) :p
 
#10 ·
Runner,

Camaraderie misspoke above. He meant to say "main halyard" not "main sheet". A halyard is a line or cable that is used to hoist or lower a sail. A sheet is a line that is used to trim (i.e., pull in or ease out) a sail.

It's a bit tricky to understand how your boat is rigged without seeing some photos. But I think the "pulleys" (by the way, in most cases, we refer to pulleys as "blocks", as in "block and tackle") on the bottom of your boom are for the mainsail sheet ("mainsheet") system.

Probably the mainsheet line leads from the cockpit up to the block hanging from the middle of the boom, then aft to the block at the end of the boom, and from there it more than likely leads down to bridle or other attachment point at the stern where it gets tied off. You would hold and trim from the end of the mainsheet that hangs down into the cockpit from the block at the middle of the boom. Possibly it leads to another block or cleat near the centerboard trunk.

That's a curious boat you've got there if it's as old as you think it is. Photos would be helpful. Good luck!:)
 
#11 ·
Boy you guys are crrrrrruuuuuuull....:p
 
#15 ·
Still-

Most of us are being a bit cruel...but not to the OP...to Cam, maybe a tiny bit... :) But, it is only because we like Cam that we pick on him. :)

Denby... good one... :)
 
#16 · (Edited)
Oh cam deserved it all Im sure....:D...poor little fella

Wasn't meant too include you John.. you were your gentlemanly self as usual..:)

I knew who you were all aiming at...:p
 
#17 ·
My first boat, back in the mid-seventies, was an aluminum 16 footer. I don't recall the beam (width) of the boat. It was a Grumman Flyer.

Some things that might help identify until you can provide a picture: It is a soft chined hull (you'll have to look that one up). The centerboard was about 4 feet long, maybe a little more and was maybe 3/4" thick, solid metal, probably aluminum. The boat was basically open except for a deck at the bow covering about a third of the boat. No seats in the boat...you sat on the edges or down on the flat floor. The track you mentioned for the mainsail was screwed to a mahogany board that went across the middle of the boat. The logo on the sail, if there is one, could be a gull (the Grumman gull), or maybe also a GF (for Grumman Flyer).

Sorry, I could not find a link to a picture of a Grumman Flyer.

That's about all I can think of right now...does your boat conform match this description?

IF you have a Grumman Flyer, you have a pretty nice little boat.
 
#18 ·
This may be kind of like the blind leading the blind, but I'll give it a go...

It has an aluminum mast with an adjustable foot position.
The part where the bottom of the mast sits on some part of the boat is called the mast step.

The mast is 20 feet with a track for the piece that the main sheet attaches to to hoist the sail.
The line that hauls the main up the mast is called the main halyard. The mainsheet is something else. (See below.) Your mainsail will have either a bolt rope along its entire luff or it will have sail slugs every foot or foot-and-a-half. Whether a bolt rope or sail slugs: It or they will slide in the mast track.

The boom slides up the same track. There is one cleat at the bottom rear of the mast that I assume is for a downhaul on the boom.
Hard to say what that's for, w/o pictures.

It has a jib sail that is a few feet shorter than the main. It attaches with bronze clips
Those are called hanks

to the front mast support cable
That is called a forestay or headstay

and I am not sure where it cleats down yet.
Do you mean the tack of the foresail (aka: jib if it's 100% or smaller, genoa if it's any larger)? We'd have to see a picture of your foresail's tack and of the area at the bottom of your forestay.

There are two cleats on the front edge of the cockpit that could be used to move it from one side of the mast to the other.
Maybe. But see below. If my guess below is correct: Then these might be for your main and foresail halyards. There would need to be turning blocks for each at the bottom of the mast, tho.

The bottom mast corner is controled by the line only
Dunno what you mean by this.

The boom has a sheave at the mid point and near the end both.
Both on the bottom?

There are cockpit cleats at the midpoint of the boom on each side of the cockpit and one on the rear of the centerboard well. There are two line eyes mounted on the deck outboard and a little to the rear of the front corners of the cockpit.
I'm guessing those two cleats are for your foresail and the eyes are fairleads for the foresail sheets. I'm guessing the one at the rear of the centerboard well is to hold up the centerboard?

If I use the two cleats at the front of the cockpit to hold the jib sheet and the lower corner of the sail, then I have to move the sheet around the mast by hand each time, but the jib sheet is the only line really needed.
As I said above: I suspect the two forward cleats are for halyards and the two aft cleats for your jib sheets (note: plural). You'll attach two sheets to the clew of the jib, and haul in and cleat the appropriate one depending on your tack.

If I use two ropes snapped to the eye on the sail, and then run thru the eyelets on the deck and tied at the rear cleats, all I have to do is ease one and tighten the other to move the rear of the jib from side to side.
Bingo! But you won't be "snapping" anything to the clew of the jib. You'll be tying the jib sheets to it with bowline knots. The clew of a foresail is no place for snap shackles and the like.

Rigged that way, the sheet that hoists the sail
Sheets don't hoist sails. Halyards hoist sails :).

That would allow about 4 feet of side to side movement of the back corner of the jib. I don't know if that much is needed or not.
You don't trim the jib in tight from one-side-to-the-other all the time. The only times you'll have the jib trimmed in all the way is when you're close-hauled (aka: beating [short for beating into the wind] or on a beat).

If the center pulley connects to the cleat on the back of the board well, Then what is the back pulley for? I need some help!
I'm kind of lost, myself, at this point. We need pictures. And I suspect there's some missing hardware. I suspect the rear block on the boom is for the mainsheet, but I'm clueless about how it's rigged from what you've given us.

Hope this helps and isn't a load of hooey! :D

Jim
 
#24 ·
Huh... who me??? What'd I do... I'm innocent...I was framed... damn mods... ;p
 
#21 · (Edited)
Runner if you can, go to a sailing club or marina and look for boats about the same size. I'm thinking most boats in the size range will have end boom sheeting.. (controls on the transom, blocks and line to the boom) I was sailing on a precision 16.5 last week. it had a boom that went in the track, the sail had a bolt rope the slid in the track too. the jib sail was just real simple and light lines to contol it. the blocks on the boom.. if they are on the side it may be a reefing setup. Good luck!
Do you have a rudder with tiller also? hope you get those pics soon.

ck this link for a free online book by Glen L It has all the info you will need to rig even build what you need. Rigging Small Sailboats - Title page
 
#22 · (Edited)
The main halyard is gone and the lug that slides in the mast groove is gone also. The boom has a track, but the mast side of the sail has a top eye and that is it. There is a 3/8ths rope sewn into that side of the main. Canvas sails. It appears that the lug was sized so that it hit the sheave in the mast head before coming out of the top. The rope is simply draped over the sheave in the masthead. There is no provision for running the halyard back down the inside of the mast.
I will get pictures somehow tomorrow. Thanks for all the help!
I have 4 cleats around the edge of the cockpit. Two right behind the mast and two midway back in the cockpit. There is one additional cleat on the centerboard well and another on the back bottom of the mast. There are two line guides on the deck. There are no attachment points on the rear of the boat except for the rudder and the motor mount. Like I said, I will get pictures.
 
#31 ·
There is a 3/8ths rope sewn into that side of the main.
You will find that hoisting a bolt rope main is hard. I had that type of sail on my SolCat. We used to spray PAM into the grove in the mast to make it easier. There may be a more high tech solution today such as Team McLube SailKote.
 
#27 ·
After dark.

I did not get home until after dark. Here is a quick picture of the cockpit in the dark. Will get better when I have time, camera battery, and better light! The wooden floors are in place in that picture. If there is a proper term for them, please let me know!

More later! Have a good one!
 
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