Bavaria 47 abandoned off Bermuda. - Page 3 - SailNet Community
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post #21 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Having seen a spade rudder break off right in front of me, I have an inherent dislike for them.

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post #22 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Were you swimming at the time??
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Having seen a spade rudder break off right in front of me, I have an inherent dislike for them.



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post #23 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Maybe it's time to start a "Broken Rudder" thread? It could be the repository for all reports concerning boats with broken rudders while sailing off-shore.

It would be interesting to do a small amount of analysis on the designs, e.g spade, skeg, keel-hung, to see which have the greater propensity for problems. I think we know the answer ( ), but it would be useful to have a thread we could point folks to with hard evidence, rather than just our anecdotal comments.


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post #24 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Quote:
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Were you swimming at the time??
No - racing on the boat just behind it all.

We were under spinnaker and bowling along. This giant "sailing dinghy" with crew of eight sped past us like we were stationary. It then proceeded to broach in front of us. Up came its stern, showing the spade rudder hard-over opposing the broach. As the rudder climbed about half way out, it snapped. The broach was then perfect, mast in the water, chaos everywhere. Our helmsman did a wonderful job of avoiding joining in the mess.

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post #25 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnRPollard View Post
Maybe it's time to start a "Broken Rudder" thread? It could be the repository for all reports concerning boats with broken rudders while sailing off-shore.

It would be interesting to do a small amount of analysis on the designs, e.g spade, skeg, keel-hung, to see which have the greater propensity for problems. I think we know the answer ( ), but it would be useful to have a thread we could point folks to with hard evidence, rather than just our anecdotal comments.
I agree John. I'm especially interested in this as I continue to research drogue techniques in all these crazy heavy weather books I'm reading. I continually see a bias toward a drogue/chute off the bow (Pardey-style) over heaving-to or running with stern-secured drogue/warps. Someone in another thread mentioned the danger of rudder breakage with the bow-secured approach if the boat slid back on a wave - but the books I've been going through cite no evidence of this.

Is it running/broaching/pooping that's breaking rudders? Or something else in the bigger seas. Very interesting stuff. And it still seems to be a live debate in the sailing world.
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post #26 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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On spade rudders your hanging a BIG hunk of rudder on a pretty small shaft that has a lifetime of less than till it breaks

I am sure there were cracks in all of them a good long time before they failed


Because i have lost count of how many SS mixer shafts i have replaced when they snaped

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post #27 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Remember that Airbus that crashed in New York just after September 11, with a lot of fatalities. The crash was blamed on a rudder failure caused by the pilot maneuvering the rudder too sharply so that it exceeded its design strength, and it broke causing the crash. The rudder was made of composite materials. I was pretty distressed at the idea that a commercial airplane would not have safeguards against this, but if that is the case I am not surprised we don't find it in sailboats. There have been a number of similar Airbus rudder failures since then. What made an Airbus rudder snap in mid-air? | Business | The Observer The case Idiens mentions sounds like a boat rudder that was suffered the same kind of an overstress, and it makes you wonder if the material science is as far advanced as we like to think.
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post #28 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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All well and good, but Panache's owner said in a private email that the rudder was fine...it didn't break. We don't know what caused the "loss of steering".
Yet.

See similar discussion on CruisersForum.

Bill
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post #29 of 29 Old 11-18-2008
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Bill, thanks for posting that. I met Mark through Annapolis Yacht Sales and watched him work on their boat at Jabins. I had only met his wife and daughter a couple of times. We had several visits about their upcoming journey... they were so excited. Mutual friends from Jabins phoned me today to share the news... thank goodness they are all ok. I know they lived aboard and Mackenzie was like a little monkey on the boat. I can only imagine what they went through trying to keep her safe.

"The God's do not subtract from man's
(or woman's) allotted time the hours spent in sailing."



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