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post #31 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
I see two questionable objects in the water, not clear at all as to what they might be, SW of Ballard Park, but that's about it.
Those two "objects" are day marks for the channel.

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post #32 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

Unless, or until, the OP ever comes back to add a second post, the story leaves me feeling like there is something more to it. Yes, there is Prosecutorial and LEO misconduct, but it's the exception to the rule, despite all the anecdotes.

Assuming all the facts we've read are true (no reason to disbelieve), something has caused the LEOs to go to great lengths to enforce what amount to parking tickets. I am willing to assume they don't just randomly mobilize like that. Why they did is not at all clear. Could be legit reason, could be an influential waterfront owner, could be a local mission to harass the anchorage. Doubt we'll ever know.

The discussion reminds me of a great Ted Talk, given my a head of some health department in the Netherlands, as I recall. It was on what he described as ignorance. He surveyed all sorts of social, environmental, etc questions and most people answered with a bias toward the negative, when the stats showed the answer was actually positive. From memory, they were questions like.... do more or fewer woman get good jobs, do more or fewer people die from catastrophic weather events, and so on. Most people thought things were worse, when they are actual much better. His premise was, if you don't know a broad answer about society, it's probably better than you think. Good lesson.
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post #33 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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Originally Posted by SeaStar58 View Post
Sal - Since we were talking about a situation in Florida where I have served multiple jurisdictions I am considering the facts here and not in NYC. Yes there are small towns in Florida with only a handful of officers which I clearly stated were not as sophisticated but Melbourne, whom I have worked with on some projects, is not really a small town like Mayberry with it having a population of over 82,000 and 169 sworn police officers. Their Marine Patrol division works with the County Sheriff, Coast Guard and Homeland Security. Their City Boating code regulates where you may and may not moor a boat along with allows for abandoned or unprotected boats to be ticketed or removed and destroyed. They are concerned with people mooring boats and leaving them unattended on public waters where they weather, rot and sink to then be abandoned which is a felony offense in Florida.

This is the area in question off of Ballard Park and its not a very big waterway with plenty of room for mooring boats plus it appears there are several sunken vessels already out there so potentially a known trouble spot with a public park, businesses, marinas and yes private homes in the area:
https://www.google.com/maps/place/Ba...!4d-80.6249955
Ok, I got it Seastar. You know, I understand that. I've been around, including to Florida many times. As I indicated in my previous post, " I can read between the lines and I... agree.." Apparently that was not clear enough for you. So -
Since you must go on insisting that you have inside information that the Melbourne police are perfect human beings in every way, and this can never be questioned, then that is the end of our discussion.

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post #34 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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Those two "objects" are day marks for the channel.
Yes there are a couple of markers out in the intercoastal waterway and several more inside the river along with 4 boat shaped submerged objects in the river. If you check the street view from the bridge its not that big a channel with a lot of room for long term storage of boats to be left unattended for weeks or months except at the marinas or planned moorings.
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post #35 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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Ok, I got it Seastar. You know, I understand that. I've been around, including to Florida many times. As I indicated in my previous post, " I can read between the lines and I... agree.." Apparently that was not clear enough for you. So -
Since you must go on insisting that you have inside information that the Melbourne police are perfect human beings in every way, and this can never be questioned, then that is the end of our discussion.
No not perfect just that their not all as bad as you make them out to be. The majority are pretty good and a lot better than many folks out there with an anti law enforcement chip on their shoulders want to believe. Most are just responding to a work load put out by a computer system or dispatcher that tells them take these delinquent tickets and serve them or check out a call for service. I agreed that some are bad but you do not want to be one of them standing before a review board anywhere that I have worked.

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post #36 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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No not perfect just that their not all as bad as you make them out to be. The majority are pretty good and a lot closer to perfect than many folks out there with an anti law enforcement chip on their shoulders want to believe. I agreed that some are bad but you do not want to be one of them standing before a review board anywhere that I have worked.
Honestly, from your posts, it does not seem you are spending enough time on the water around the state of Florida to make this statement. Any association a person might have with law enforcement personnel ashore has very little relationship to a citizen/LEO encounter on the water.
IMO, it seems that most water LEO's are the 'cowboys' of the department and stray as close to or over the line, probably much more frequently than the department as a whole. Perhaps the 'bad apples' end up in the marine department of most departments to minimize their contact with the general public?
But, since I've spent around 90% of my time in Fla on the water, perhaps I have a different view than most.
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post #37 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

In my observation of the local/state LEOs on the water around here, if I could see that they actually did anything useful, I would not have a problem with them. There is a state police boat operating from my marina, same LEO all season long, the boat is well over (if not multiples of) $100k, the LEO is probably in his late 50s, grossly overweight, and I've never seen him do anything but cruise around on nice days, and conduct random safety inspections (but mostly he just cruises around burning gobs of fuel with his twin 250hp evinrudes). He seems like a nice guy from passing in the marina, but talk about a waste of taxpayer money and resources. I get the sense that he landed this sweet gig based on his seniority and he's more than happy to essentially do nothing while earning a nice salary and pension.

I guess this guy is better than the younger aggressive power-tripping not-very-smart cop, which there are plenty of around here on land. Something about the profession just calls to this type.
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post #38 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

OP is a seagull - flew in, crapped all over, and flew away.

I'm as skeptical of law enforcement's intentions as anyone, but his rant has enough vagueness and apparent slant to drive a truck through. I'm even more skeptical of him, and wondering how much of an eyesore his boat must have been. While I disagree with the nasty NY/NJ millionaires with their "get out of my view" attitude toward innocent cruisers, I'm also sympathetic toward legitimate concerns that people have over derelict boats that get plopped down for months at a time with potentially inadequate ground tackle. I wouldn't want to have to fork over my tax dollars for raising these boats from the bottom, or repairing the damage that they cause when they come loose.

More facts need to be known, especially since this guy came to with an axe to grind, and has done nothing to establish any credibility with our online community.

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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

Google composites several images together, what you're seeing are not sunken boats but boats that were in transit in one of the satellite images.

For instance, there isn't really an airplane at the bottom of our local lake:

Why does Google Earth show a plane at the bottom of Lake Harriet?

Here is where my boat is moored. Each boat has multiple images as it swings around the ball:
Lake Nokomis
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post #40 of 92 Old 01-30-2019
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Re: Unlawful boating tickets, government extortion!!!

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Originally Posted by TakeFive View Post
OP is a seagull - flew in, crapped all over, and flew away.

I'm as skeptical of law enforcement's intentions as anyone, but his rant has enough vagueness and apparent slant to drive a truck through. I'm even more skeptical of him, and wondering how much of an eyesore his boat must have been. .......

.......More facts need to be known, especially since this guy came to with an axe to grind, and has done nothing to establish any credibility with our online community.
Yes, he joined yesterday and his one and only post is his rant posted as his "introduction" , and he's not been back since to answer our questions and offer more information.
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