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post #41 of 85 Old 07-24-2019
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Re: Heave To

MUS points out the big failing of sea anchors for many boats be they have balanced spades (modern sail and power) or stern hung. That’s when the boat goes backwards the rudder or its fittings break. With warps or drogues the boat continues to move forward (abet slowly). Loading is gradual and no were as severe as with a bow deployed sea anchor. Although there are reports of windvanes being damaged by jsd to my knowledge not rudders. Hence the current use of jsd or the like in the power passagemaking crowd. This group used to use sea anchors given the strength of their bows and large panes of glass as the entrance to down below. Design has shifted and even old Norhavn or kady krogans are set to survive a pooping without down flooding. Take a look at the blog about passagemaking in the artnautica 58. Although a powerboat they carry no sea anchor but rather a drogue. Think about it. Whether power or sail being held stationary and being struck by the waves means more forces on the boat.

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post #42 of 85 Old 07-24-2019
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Re: Heave To

Whenever hove to in stronger winds the key is to reduce sail area to minimum, while still maintaining proper position to the waves, and minimum movement.
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Re: Heave To

KC is right. Although limited I do have some experience of being in truly snotty weather in prior small boats (24’-34’). He is correct whatever you do to decrease forces involved is to your and your boats benefit. However, the seas and winds are constantly changing. I avidly read Lin and Larry. They were able to go below hoved to making use of that technique and a sea anchor. I never got the skill down to that point and needed to remain on deck. Found adjusting the jib problematic as if you needed to take in the jib sheet after letting it out and that was difficult. So would use rudder angle and main sheet to keep hove to. Found staying hove to be an active process. Found chafe a major issue making there a need to go forward periodically to adjust chafing gear. (Commonly fire hose or flexible plastic pipe or garden hose that had been split). Gave thought to rigging a block placed so the shrouds wouldn’t rub on the jib sheet but never got around to it. Would suggest that those who intent to use this technique hove to and walk the deck. Stainless steel 1x19 cuts through jib sheets quickly.

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post #44 of 85 Old 07-24-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Heave To

For me one concern with snotty weather for a short handed sailor is hypothermia. You don't need storm force winds to be hypothermic. Any kind of cold wet and windy will do the job. One solution: heave to. If you have a cabin or doghouse. Go inside to warm up. If you don't, lay down in the bottom of the boat with something over you.

Of similar concern: exhaustion. You don't need storm force winds to get worn out. The hot sun is enough to do it, but its also a potential in snotty weather. You need to eat, drink and rest. Heave to.

Seasickness. This is very rarely an issue for me and never to incapacitation. However I have seen people incapacitated by it. Can't sail the boat because you're puking. Heave to.

Need to pee in snotty conditions? Heave to.

My original post showed a 17 ft boat heaving to on Lake Ontario. I was sailing a 23 inch wide unballasted boat in 25 knots of wind and building seas. I can asure that those are snotty conditions for that boat. To sail the boat effectively in those conditions I need a hand on my skeg control and ideally one on my sheet. My goal was to have a drink of water and eat a cliffs bar. In order to accomplish that heaving to seemed like the best option.

Heaving to might be less essential for boats with inboards and autopilots, but for the rest of us, I am pretty convinced its a good strategy for dealing with the effects of snotty weather; eat, drink, warm up, pee, puke, rest.
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Re: Heave To

Hove to is also a good way for big boats to wait more or less in place, for example when arriving at night to an unknown harbor or inlet. Simply dropping sails is often not at all comfortable. Boat motion when hove to is much better. I consider hove to a very useful technique for cruising.

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post #46 of 85 Old 07-24-2019
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Re: Heave To

Arcb what you makes perfect sense. Have no disagreement. What concerns me is many people think heaving to is the best option for storms. I have repetitive pointed out I’m speaking about STORMS. I even offered the generally accepted definition of a storm. My concern is that people think heaving to is the best survival technique.
I’ve sailed dinghies but in 25 kts I’m home or on a larger boat. My hat is off to you.
It’s interesting how your mindset changes with cruising grounds. Think for people in SF bay, or Atlantic coast of Portugal or the windwards 25kts is a nice day. 9’ swell is of no concern. Depending upon point of sail and boat maybe first or second reef.
Will say again in heavy weather ( above 10’ seas and 40kts for most boats 35-50’ ) there are other strategies. Was hoping people think about them. Hope people compare use of jsd to heaving to. Look at sources of information from current ocean sailors. Suspect you’ll have less enthusiasm for heaving to as a heavy weather technique.
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post #47 of 85 Old 07-24-2019
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Re: Heave To

When i am expecting a mechanical bull ride, i do a stock of food bars and water in the cockpit and set a board in the compaionway..or close it up, so no need to go below.
Pee bottle lives in cockpit.
I am not shy about running engine
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post #48 of 85 Old 07-24-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Heave To

Quote:
Originally Posted by RegisteredUser View Post
Pee bottle lives in cockpit.
Clear your cockpit scuppers, save a bottle
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post #49 of 85 Old 07-25-2019
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Re: Heave To

In my limited experience most nor’easters last 3 days. Most people can safely helm in storm conditions for a very limited time. Often 1/2 hour is long enough.
Depending upon any technique that requires prolonged active intervention is looking for trouble regardless of number, skills and fitness of the crew.
I have diverted to miss a storm where actively sailing the the boat was required. With 4 aboard change watches to 2 up for 1/2 hour knowing this would be required for 12 hours. This was exhausting. Crew was in 30-40 year old range and experienced.
So think totally passive techniques need to be available. Especially for mom and pop cruisers.

Btw personally favor coke and snicker bars. Caffeine,sugar, electrolytes, water and a bit of protein.

s/v Hippocampus
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post #50 of 85 Old 07-25-2019 Thread Starter
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Re: Heave To

Give the Clif Whey Protein bars a try. No sugar crash. Less of a roller coaster for the body. CLIF® Whey Protein - Peanut Butter & Chocolate Flavour

Since I sail mostly in fresh water (with some exceptions) I can elimnate the need to carry beverages, which saves me a lot of weight. I just scoop it right out of the river and put it through a gravity filter. Went on a 105 km kayak sail this past week end. Left with 2 liters of water, finished with 2 liters water.
Obviously wouldn't work in salt water.
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