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post #11 of 30 Old 07-03-2016
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

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2) running backs are almost always made from rope not wire. I would say always but I am sure there is someone out there with wire runners, I just have never seen it.
I've never seen them with rope. We should swap which sets of boats we observe

Our previous boat had wire running backs attached to fiddle blocks for tensioning. The blocks used standard polyester double-braid. The boat was made in the early 70s.

It looked something like this: Running Backstays | Cruising World
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post #12 of 30 Old 07-03-2016
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

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Originally Posted by Music View Post
Has anyone used synthetic Dyneema line as replacement for the standing rigging. I am planning on replacing my running backstays with Dyneema. Has anyone used Dyneema for shroud replacement?
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Every Gun Boat has Dynema standing rigging. I saw a 150 footer all Dynema (some exotic, anyway), just about every world class light weight racing boat is all dynema.

So not only can you use it for running backstays (which are running rigging not standing rigging arnt they?) you should be using it.


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post #13 of 30 Old 07-03-2016
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

My backstay is amsteel blue, with a cascaded tensioner. Yep can be done (as we said multiple times in this thread)...

Love the link to the lifelines commentary. By the way you can still use it for lifelines too, but it requires very careful work... I've considered doing it myself, just because on my old rust-bucket on inland water lifelines are almost not necessary... Offshore I'd want cable though.
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post #14 of 30 Old 07-03-2016
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

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Originally Posted by smurphny View Post
There Is creep in Dyneema over time but I see no issue in using it for temporary running backstays. I have it on my runners with turnbuckles for tensioning. I also use it for the lifelines, furler, and main halyard. I have no cover on it and am able to use it without slip on winches and in a ratchet block. It would be better, I suppose, with a cover but I've found that simplicity is usually better unless something is actually necessary. I would not use it for regular standing rigging.
Just to be clear, creep and stretch are massively different things.

Creep is the permanent elongation over time from being under load. Typical design creep for standing rigging is .1 inch per year, or about one inch over the service life of a set of dyneema shrouds.

Stretch is the temporary elongation under load that rebounds when the load is removed. Thing of a rubber band.

Normal dyneema has both more stretch and creep than the HSR (heat set). But will be stronger than stainless wire of the same size, and have about the same stretch. But of course wire doesn't creep.

HSR is far stronger that raw dyneema or steel wire, stretches less than either, and has about 10% the creep or regular dyneema. Which is why it is the prefered material for standing rigging.

Running backs.... Are kinda weird. They toe the line between running and standing rigging, and can be properly though of as either. Typical construction these days would be amsteel (or another uncovered dyneema), while racers will use HSR not for the creep reduction but for the strength increase. A HSR line can be substantially downsized compared to a standard dyneema line and retain the same strength.

As an example, for a set of runners that are 35' long each.

......................MBL (kg) ........ Weight (lbs) .... Size
Wire ...............3,220.............. 4.55 .............. 1/4"
Amsteel.......... 3,500 ............. 1.12 .............. 1/4"
D12 Max HSR ...3,000 ............ .522 .............. 5/32"
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

music-
Couple of years ago I was talking to the local NavTec guys about alternatives to rod rigging and a synthetic alternative they offered. Bottom line was that, in their opinion, using synthetic line for standing rigging was absolutely THE premium way to go. Least weight aloft, best performance, sufficiently great durability and all. And, if you didn't have an Amex Black card, it was probably totally out of your budget.
The rest is all details. Whether any particular synthetic moves the compromises around a bit, I don't know, but it will only move them around a bit. If your goal is performance, that's your way to go. If price means anything? We're still in the Iron [sic] Age.
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

A few years back a an ultralight racing Westsail 32 was equipped with HSR rigging. Has anyone heard anymore about this boat and how the rigging has worked out.
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

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A few years back a an ultralight racing Westsail 32 was equipped with HSR rigging. Has anyone heard anymore about this boat and how the rigging has worked out.
I think this was Nigel Calders son's boat. I think he switched from deadeyes to turnbuckles after a couple of years but I may be thinking of another boat.

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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

The Westsail was on the East Coast, IIRC. The Calders definitely would have an in for the latest and greatest. It's probably been long enough in service to get a good idea how the synthetic rigging stands up to UV radiation. The deadeyes sort of fit a Westsail but it was just such an unlikely candidate for lightweight rigging. Not that weight saved aloft wouldn't benefit any boat. Mahalo for the input, Stumble.
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

I just changed out the standing rigging (shrouds and backstay) on my Baltic 38, moving from rod to Dux by Colligo Marine.
So far, I happy with it. Ask me anything.
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post #20 of 30 Old 07-04-2016
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Re: Dyneema standing rigging

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Originally Posted by [email protected] View Post
ultralight racing Westsail 32
Are these words supposed to be used together?

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