Steel vs Fiberglass - Page 117 - SailNet Community
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post #1161 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Overboard:
Yes, originally the coaming top was sized for Harken 48's and 60's.

We are using Andersen winches. The primaries and two of the house top winches will be powered and the other four manual. Originally we spec'd Harken 60's and 48's. The rewind models were never considered.
We meet with Rusty Rutherford of Harken next week at the yard. Anything could happen but I doubt the Andersens will go away now. I think they have been ordered already. We are trying to arrange matching "satin" finishes for other deck hardware. The Andersens have the advantage in the powered models of having the motor up in the winch base. It does not hang down under the deck.

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Last edited by bobperry; 09-03-2015 at 09:00 AM.
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post #1162 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

"The keel on a boat is the centre around which it rolls. Having two such centres of rotation on twin keelers, they oppose, and thus dampen one another."

Oh I see the keels cancel each other out. Right.

This is classic BS. Clearly BS has no clue how a boat rolls. I'm amazed that he appears to believe his own BS instead of learning the reality.

Maybe Jeff will do some arduous typing and give us all a quick, if possible, tutorial on rolling.

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Last edited by bobperry; 09-03-2015 at 10:44 AM.
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post #1163 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent Swain View Post
Sorry for talking so far over your head , but I find some levels hard to talk down to. I wouldn't want to insult those who are capable of understanding practical realities, by taking down to the lowest common denominator.
I guess I wouldn't make a very good kindergarten teacher..
I'm certainly no expert, but I know enough to realize it and judge that you know too little to realize that you're not one either.

Respectfully
/Joms
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post #1164 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
Overboard:
Yes, originally the coaming top was sized for Harken 48's and 60's.

We are using Andersen winches. The primaries and two of the house top winches will be powered and the other four manual. Originally we spec'd Harken 60's and 48's. The rewind models were never considered.
We meet with Rusty Rutherford of Harken next week at the yard. Anything could happen but I doubt the Andersens will go away now. I think they have been ordered already. We are trying to arrange matching "satin" finishes for other deck hardware. The Andersens have the advantage in the powered models of having the motor up in the winch base. It does not hang down under the deck.
Love Harken gear, but the Andersen winches are just the best.
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post #1165 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

re
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zLRvUhyh2ok

A scene from "Raiders of the Lost Arc. Reminds me of when Perry tried to intimidate me, by talking about his Karate workout, on cruising.stuffiminto.com ( a site he and Smack abused out of existence).
Karate( Perry's answer) is the guy with the long hair. Boxing ( my sport) is the other guy.
This is a good demonstration of comparing style over substance, in terms of which works.
Expensive, stylish, pretentious, teak covered, stock plastic boats are the equivalent of the guy with the long hair, mine are more the equivalent of the other guy.

Last edited by Brent Swain; 09-03-2015 at 01:55 PM.
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post #1166 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Quote:
Originally Posted by bobperry View Post
Overboard:
Yes, originally the coaming top was sized for Harken 48's and 60's.

We are using Andersen winches. The primaries and two of the house top winches will be powered and the other four manual. Originally we spec'd Harken 60's and 48's. The rewind models were never considered.
We meet with Rusty Rutherford of Harken next week at the yard. Anything could happen but I doubt the Andersens will go away now. I think they have been ordered already. We are trying to arrange matching "satin" finishes for other deck hardware. The Andersens have the advantage in the powered models of having the motor up in the winch base. It does not hang down under the deck.
Why would you not consider rewind winches. Have you sailed with them? They are the best thing and make sail handling way easier and way safer. Can be adjusted in or out from the high side . After having them I would not consider anything else. The which can be used the same as any other 2 speed electric winch. you can use a handle, high or low speed switch or the added feature of the sail being trimmed in or out a the push of a button. the motor is mounted at right angles to the winch so it takes very little space below and fits up in the coaming. Harken is the only one making them and if you are going to spend the money on electric then they only are the way to go.

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post #1167 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Over:
Now that you ask, I'm not sure. Part of the problem with the Harken powered winches is that the motors hang down and become head knockers where we don't need them. Yes, powered winches have been available form many years with right angle drive motors but it's still an obstacle right where we need access to the twin engine room watertight doors. In the coaming would work. The Andersens, as I said earlier, have the motor, kind of a "pancake thingy" tucked up into the actual base of the winch. Nothing hangs down. The winch base is slightly taller than a normal unpowered winch. When we do your custom design I promise that you can have any winch your heart desires. That's what custom design is all about. I think given that these four boats will all go offshore eventually, we have made the most reliable choice.

I look forward to gaining some more experience with the Andersen winches. I have only spec'd them once before.

BS is blabbering gibberish again. I suppose that's the best he can do. He sure as hell can't discuss yacht design. I suspect he's no better at boxing.

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Last edited by bobperry; 09-03-2015 at 01:54 PM.
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post #1168 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

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Originally Posted by JomsViking View Post
Love Harken gear, but the Andersen winches are just the best.
Anderson winches are great, especially being made out of almost all stainless, altho most modern winches seem to last forever, and rarely fail. Harken sheet blocks are fragile and flimsy, with a safe working load which is a fraction the strength of the line used on them. You can build far better blocks yourself, for a couple of bucks each, in less time than it takes to go buy them..
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post #1169 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Harken blocks, like any other have to be sized to the loads they will see. This requires math and that lets BS out. It's not about line strength. It's a bout line loads. Only BS would think line size determines load. Good load calcs and good safety factors will result in the appropriate blocks being used. I have worked with Rusty and Don at Harken for many years without problems. Peter Harken is a good friend of mine.
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Last edited by bobperry; 09-03-2015 at 02:07 PM.
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post #1170 of 2951 Old 09-03-2015
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Re: Steel vs Fiberglass

Given that full length keels have far more wetted surface than most twin keelers, when I hear people who design boats with full length keels, critical of twin keelers for having too much wetted surface, I find those designers laughable.
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