Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico - Page 51 - SailNet Community
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post #501 of 620 Old 07-11-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

One things that happens when a battle of words, moves to a battle of words (and hopefully facts) in court ---> It can do nothing BUT drag on


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Last edited by titustiger27; 07-11-2014 at 11:15 AM. Reason: didn't make sense
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post #502 of 620 Old 07-11-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Originally Posted by Minnewaska View Post
What I heard, was "my kid's life was in danger and I had to press the EPIRB because the sat phone stopped working and I couldn't consult with the doc"

The consequence of that is to abandon your boat when they come for you.
And the pararescue guys had a sat phone and brought medical skills and the youngster was stabilized and transferred to an FF...and then the Captain decided to scuttle his boat rather than sail it to safety.

I have no issue with his decision making. Only he knows his full rationale and his skills and the true condition of his boat...but the decision to scuttle was AFTER the medical danger to his daughter had passed and the sat phone's operability was not an issue.

But he is the guy who blogged that the only reason he had the sat phone was it was needed for his work.

And he did have HF equipment that failed due to salt water intrusion (apparently) that could also have been used for off-board advice...and he was responsible for that failure.

So while I don't question his decision making at sea I do question his decision to try to assign all the blame for his outcome on inability to make a sat phone call.

He was the Captain. He made all the decisions regarding that voyage from boat to equipment and equipage to date and time of departure to repair practices to navigation to sail selection and courses to steer to sailing with youngsters and crew who recently required medical attention.

And the inference is that "if only we had an operable sat phone the voyage would have been successful"...which I find ludicrous.

More likely the sat phone failure saved their lives. If it had continued to work they may have continued on their merry way until the boat's deck disintegrated (Elmer's glue as a wood filler?)...the interior of the boat was waterlogged...all electrical power was lost...fresh water was exhausted...and they were impelled to rely on EPIRB and AMVER because they were out of range of the Cal Natl Guard.

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post #503 of 620 Old 07-11-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Quote:
Originally Posted by fryewe View Post
And the pararescue guys had a sat phone and brought medical skills and the youngster was stabilized and transferred to an FF...and then the Captain decided to scuttle his boat rather than sail it to safety.

I have no issue with his decision making. Only he knows his full rationale and his skills and the true condition of his boat...but the decision to scuttle was AFTER the medical danger to his daughter had passed and the sat phone's operability was not an issue.

But he is the guy who blogged that the only reason he had the sat phone was it was needed for his work.

And he did have HF equipment that failed due to salt water intrusion (apparently) that could also have been used for off-board advice...and he was responsible for that failure.

So while I don't question his decision making at sea I do question his decision to try to assign all the blame for his outcome on inability to make a sat phone call.

He was the Captain. He made all the decisions regarding that voyage from boat to equipment and equipage to date and time of departure to repair practices to navigation to sail selection and courses to steer to sailing with youngsters and crew who recently required medical attention.

And the inference is that "if only we had an operable sat phone the voyage would have been successful"...which I find ludicrous.

More likely the sat phone failure saved their lives. If it had continued to work they may have continued on their merry way until the boat's deck disintegrated (Elmer's glue as a wood filler?)...the interior of the boat was waterlogged...all electrical power was lost...fresh water was exhausted...and they were impelled to rely on EPIRB and AMVER because they were out of range of the Cal Natl Guard.
Nailed it. I completely agree.

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post #504 of 620 Old 07-11-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

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Originally Posted by titustiger27 View Post
If I was running Navionics.. and the chart was wrong... I wouldn't sue Apple, but the makers of the app...maybe. First I would have to know that there was something wrong with the program ...
Nothing wrong with the app. My iphone is just crap. So if I rely on it to navigate my vessel clearly Apple would be to blame wouldn't they?

Maybe it's a cultural thing, we are just not as litigous here( becoming so).

This is clearly not about the moral high ground for these guys though. They are not worried about convincing Sailnet. They are being pragmatic, they want a boat, if they do enough media and scare the lawyers they get a quick payday.

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post #505 of 620 Old 07-11-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Quote:
Originally Posted by fryewe View Post
And the pararescue guys had a sat phone and brought medical skills and the youngster was stabilized and transferred to an FF...and then the Captain decided to scuttle his boat rather than sail it to safety.

I have no issue with his decision making. Only he knows his full rationale and his skills and the true condition of his boat...but the decision to scuttle was AFTER the medical danger to his daughter had passed and the sat phone's operability was not an issue.

But he is the guy who blogged that the only reason he had the sat phone was it was needed for his work.

And he did have HF equipment that failed due to salt water intrusion (apparently) that could also have been used for off-board advice...and he was responsible for that failure.

So while I don't question his decision making at sea I do question his decision to try to assign all the blame for his outcome on inability to make a sat phone call.

He was the Captain. He made all the decisions regarding that voyage from boat to equipment and equipage to date and time of departure to repair practices to navigation to sail selection and courses to steer to sailing with youngsters and crew who recently required medical attention.

And the inference is that "if only we had an operable sat phone the voyage would have been successful"...which I find ludicrous.

More likely the sat phone failure saved their lives. If it had continued to work they may have continued on their merry way until the boat's deck disintegrated (Elmer's glue as a wood filler?)...the interior of the boat was waterlogged...all electrical power was lost...fresh water was exhausted...and they were impelled to rely on EPIRB and AMVER because they were out of range of the Cal Natl Guard.
I agree, especially the highlighted parts. In my opinion the going public now is purely to put pressure on the sat-phone company to settle without it going to court.
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post #506 of 620 Old 07-12-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

From what I've been able to dig up - I think we might actually be at rock bottom (with RH) now.


Last edited by smackdaddy; 07-12-2014 at 01:00 AM.
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post #507 of 620 Old 07-12-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Quote:
Originally Posted by chall03 View Post
Nothing wrong with the app. My iphone is just crap. So if I rely on it to navigate my vessel clearly Apple would be to blame wouldn't they?

Maybe it's a cultural thing, we are just not as litigous here( becoming so).

This is clearly not about the moral high ground for these guys though. They are not worried about convincing Sailnet. They are being pragmatic, they want a boat, if they do enough media and scare the lawyers they get a quick payday.
I believe that the ipad app and even chartplotters come up with a disclaimer... This is the garmin one:
Quote:
"WARNING: Digital charts are intended to be used as an aid to traditional navigational charts, not as a replacement. Please read the full disclaimer here before purchasing or using Garmin charting."
This is the iNavX disclaimer:Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico-inavx.jpg


the only system that I know of that claims to allow use without paper charts is an ECDIS certified system... and they still have disclaimers, otherwise they would be responsible for bad stuff like this: US NAVY ON REEF.

Last edited by h20man; 07-12-2014 at 02:37 AM.
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post #508 of 620 Old 07-12-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Quote:
Originally Posted by smackdaddy View Post
From what I've been able to dig up - I think we might actually be at rock bottom (with RH) now.
Don't be silly. Its the Internet! We can go MUCH lower


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post #509 of 620 Old 07-12-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

If Navionics is smart... and I am sure iPhones has this... has a release that you have to 'click' and it releases them from all litigation... you probably read it, it's 70 pages long, which is still shorter than the iTune contract.


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post #510 of 620 Old 07-12-2014
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Re: Ocean baby rescue underway off Mexico

Well that CF thread lasted maybe 10 minutes longer than I thought it would.

So who is going to help me sue Apple??

I just used google maps to try and find the local pizza place and it was way off. We damn well near starved to death.

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