Planting Accident Report-Final - SailNet Community
 4Likes
Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
post #1 of 11 Old 07-27-2018 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
aa3jy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,433
Thanks: 3
Thanked 109 Times in 101 Posts
Rep Power: 13
 
Plantino Accident Report-Final

https://www.maritimenz.govt.nz/comme...eport-2016.pdf
bigdogandy likes this.
aa3jy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 11 Old 07-28-2018 Thread Starter
Senior Member
 
aa3jy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 2,433
Thanks: 3
Thanked 109 Times in 101 Posts
Rep Power: 13
 
Re: Plantino Accident Report-Final

Though there where previous rules in place...these findings now have a significant impact on vessels visiting NZ waters..


After two experienced crew died on the SY Platino (20 meters) in 2016, Maratime NZ is requiring all offshore yachts leaving NZ to pass government inspections.. Read the report here https://www.maritimenz.govt.nz/platino/

On page 56 of the report the new regulations are explained:

“YNZ [Yachting NewZealand] introduces changes to the Safety Regulations of Sailing.
Since the time of the Platino accident, YNZ has made changes to Changes to Safety Regulations of
Sailing with the learnings of the Platino accident in mind. These changes are listed below;
1. All vessels must have the required ratio of crew with an Advanced Sea Survival qualification51 (SR APPENDIX 6). This requirement had previously been applied only to racing yachts. However the requirement is now being applied to cruising yachts which may be lightly crewed but are undertaking a long voyage.
2. All vessels seeking a category 1 safety certificate are to have a written manual available to all crew.
3. Yacht Inspectors who have not attended the last conference or have not completed an inspection in the 12 months immediately prior is to be accompanied by another Inspector.”
aa3jy is offline  
post #3 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Trailer Sailer Moderator
 
Rezz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 256
Thanks: 4
Thanked 8 Times in 6 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

I can understand what New Zealand is trying to do there, but I'm wondering if their requirements are going to push people away from their beautiful country. I can't say I've seen other countries have these same stringent requirements.

Also - your boat could become stuck in NZ, technically speaking, if you don't meet all their requirements. From what I've read, they won't let you leave until you're considered seaworthy in their eyes.
Rezz is offline  
 
post #4 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Master Mariner
 
capta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: somewhere south of civilization
Posts: 6,939
Thanks: 135
Thanked 365 Times in 353 Posts
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

OK, these are the two points that stand out to me.
A) Consider steering manually during periods of heightened risk that cannot be avoided by other means.
B) Position the person on watch so as to facilitate immediately taking control if the autopilot is used during periods of heightened risk. This could mean a crewmember is placed at the wheel, though not actively steering.
A) consider?. Excuse me, but am I mistaken to assume that is the job of the human crew members when conditions dictate? With 5 crew steering would have been pretty light duty and perhaps one of the "experienced and professional" crew would have noticed that the steering was 'mushy' from lack of fluid. All that time and money spent to produce this report and the recommendation is: consider? Bah humbug!
B) I read about this attitude all the time on these forums. Folks tucked up under the dodger far from the helm and literally unable to see around the boat, but all nice and cozy, some even listening on headphones to music or books on tape.
Not on any boat that I'm the captain of! From a 30' yacht to an umpteen thousand ton freighter, if you are on watch, you are at the helm, sitting or standing where you have an unobstructed view of the vessel and the waters around her, never more than a few seconds from taking over from a miscreant autopilot. Comfort and tunes are for off watch, not when everybody on the vessel has put their lives in the watchstander's care!
As for a need to regulate these things, Darwin had a pretty good point, and I don't see the harm in culling the herd from time to time.
jephotog likes this.

"Any idiot can make a boat go; it takes a sailor to stop one." Spike Africa aboard the schooner Wanderer in Sausalito, Ca. 1964.
“Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.” ― Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

facebook.com/svskippingstone
capta is online now  
post #5 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Junior Member
 
aeventyr60's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Indian Ocean
Posts: 3,506
Thanks: 36
Thanked 122 Times in 117 Posts
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

NZ tried this before with disastrous results to the the maritime trades. Won't last more then a season when the hundreds of boats decide to head to Australia instead of the land of the long white cloud.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



"Your dreams minus your doubts equals your net worth"

Life is a short journey, filled with emptiness and pain. Get all the sailing and booty you can.
aeventyr60 is offline  
post #6 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Senior Member
 
Yorksailor's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Florida
Posts: 775
Thanks: 34
Thanked 40 Times in 37 Posts
Rep Power: 10
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

Six years ago off Cape Fear With an experienced person at the helm we were hit by a combination of a big wave and a 40 knot thunder squall wind shift that Gybed the boat violently resulting in a free and potentially thrashing boom...We are only 55 ft and with the main still up the boom was pinned against the spreaders. Over an hour I was able to progressively tame the boom from the front of the boom backwards after I had reefed the staysail to prevent the sheets from flogging. We did have a boom brake that was ripped apart by the gybe and the gybe broke two half inch ss shackles in the main sheet system.

We have a metal toenail that allows multiple points of attachment so that with blocks, pulleys and line I could progressing work the boom back to the midline. It required 4 block and tackle combinations to get the boom midline.

Once tamed we were unable to run the engine because of a separate problem but with jibs we were able to sail 50 nm back to the mouth of the Cape Fear river where we contacted Boat US and got towed into Southport.

I do not pretend that with a bigger boat and the problems Platino experienced that I would have succeeded in their situation but at least the general theory of taming the boom from the from the mast backwards can work.

We had similar steering problems because the bimini was squashed down onto the wheel but I check the fluid levels on our hydraulic steering frequently and anytime there is any indication of problems.

Having sailed boats with the main sheet attachment low and forward of the helm I would never buy such a boat. It was that arrangement that cost a life on the Clipper race.

Last edited by Yorksailor; 07-28-2018 at 12:33 PM.
Yorksailor is offline  
post #7 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Master Mariner
 
capta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: somewhere south of civilization
Posts: 6,939
Thanks: 135
Thanked 365 Times in 353 Posts
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

From the original post, I got the impression that this ruling was meant to cover all craft sailing from NZ, but didn't get that impression from reading the report. I do believe it is not legal for NZ to impose their regulations on foreign flag vessels, in this sort of situation, especially those that have arrived w/o complying with the NZ regs.
I laid a shotgun across my legs while sitting at the top of the boarding ladder, when they tried to take my dog with an illegal destruction order, so I'm not sure how I'd respond to their trying to impose their silly regs on us when my boat was suitable enough to get us to NZ, after sailing across the Pacific Ocean from California.
aeventyr60 likes this.

"Any idiot can make a boat go; it takes a sailor to stop one." Spike Africa aboard the schooner Wanderer in Sausalito, Ca. 1964.
“Believe me, my young friend, there is nothing - absolutely nothing - half so much worth doing as simply messing about in boats.” ― Kenneth Grahame, The Wind in the Willows

To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.

facebook.com/svskippingstone
capta is online now  
post #8 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Jackson WY
Posts: 2,075
Thanks: 42
Thanked 75 Times in 74 Posts
Rep Power: 18
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

Quote:
Originally Posted by Resolute_ZS View Post
I can understand what New Zealand is trying to do there, but I'm wondering if their requirements are going to push people away from their beautiful country. I can't say I've seen other countries have these same stringent requirements.

Also - your boat could become stuck in NZ, technically speaking, if you don't meet all their requirements. From what I've read, they won't let you leave until you're considered seaworthy in their eyes.
If that's the case do you get NZ citizenship if you arrive in an un-seaworthy boat?

Jordan
West Wight Potter 14 "Lemon Drop"
Oceanside CA
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.
jephotog is online now  
post #9 of 11 Old 07-28-2018
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Jackson WY
Posts: 2,075
Thanks: 42
Thanked 75 Times in 74 Posts
Rep Power: 18
 
Re: Plantino Accident Report-Final

Quote:
Originally Posted by aa3jy View Post
On page 56 of the report the new regulations are explained:

“YNZ [Yachting NewZealand] introduces changes to the Safety Regulations of Sailing.
Since the time of the Platino accident, YNZ has made changes to Changes to Safety Regulations of
Sailing with the learnings of the Platino accident in mind. These changes are listed below;
1. All vessels must have the required ratio of crew with an Advanced Sea Survival qualification51 (SR APPENDIX 6). This requirement had previously been applied only to racing yachts. However the requirement is now being applied to cruising yachts which may be lightly crewed but are undertaking a long voyage.
2. All vessels seeking a category 1 safety certificate are to have a written manual available to all crew.
3. Yacht Inspectors who have not attended the last conference or have not completed an inspection in the 12 months immediately prior is to be accompanied by another Inspector.”
From what I read(I did not read the whole thing), except for the boat manual this boat met all requirements and would have met the requirements and would have been released to go on their journey.

Does the government pay for the Cat 1 certifications? If not it might be hard to force foreigners to pay for NZ certs just to leave the country. I think the requirement for a manual is a good idea but not a practical one. It seems like the owners of this boat were loaded. They could have payed someone to write a manual for them and never read a page.

Jordan
West Wight Potter 14 "Lemon Drop"
Oceanside CA
To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.
.
jephotog is online now  
post #10 of 11 Old 07-29-2018
Junior Member
 
aeventyr60's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Indian Ocean
Posts: 3,506
Thanks: 36
Thanked 122 Times in 117 Posts
Rep Power: 8
 
Re: Planting Accident Report-Final

The bigger issue is that you can't legislate judgement..or cure stupid.


To view links or images in signatures your post count must be 10 or greater. You currently have 0 posts.



"Your dreams minus your doubts equals your net worth"

Life is a short journey, filled with emptiness and pain. Get all the sailing and booty you can.
aeventyr60 is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Options

By choosing to post the reply above you agree to the rules you agreed to when joining Sailnet.
Click Here to view those rules.

Register Now



In order to be able to post messages on the SailNet Community forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
Please note: After entering 3 characters a list of Usernames already in use will appear and the list will disappear once a valid Username is entered.


User Name:
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.

Password:


Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.

Email Address:
OR

Log-in











Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page



Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Final report on deadly sailboat accident released - abc7news.com NewsReader News Feeds 0 08-06-2012 09:40 PM
Final Report into Collision between Ella's Pink Lady & bulk Carrier Silver Yang Ilenart General Discussion (sailing related) 12 03-02-2012 04:37 AM
NTSB Report on the Delaware River Accident aa3jy Chesapeake / Central US east coast 0 03-07-2011 01:03 PM
TAMU Final Report PROSS General Discussion (sailing related) 0 07-17-2009 01:21 PM

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On

 
For the best viewing experience please update your browser to Google Chrome