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· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I will be a first time owner, but not a first time sailor. I've done single handed cruising on the Napa river, in San Francisco Bay, off the coast of South Carolina, in the Chesapeake bay, and I've done a couple seasons of competitive race boat crewing on J 80/30/105 boats in the Chesapeake bay all on other people's boats. So with that said...

With the following cost/construction constraints, I was wondering if anyone could give me some suggestions on likely choices that will answer the mail:

*********

Assuming $0 down… I’d like to keep my monthly payment under $300 if at all possible, but definitely not over $400.

Model year is less important than condition and I'm open to an older boat as long as it’s financeable, (many lenders apparently won’t finance a boat that’s more than 15 yrs old), and as long as it’s a commonly seen builder brand around the Chesapeake Bay area so that future resale won’t be a big problem.

I'm ok with cosmetic issues that I can work on over time. But I want something that’s fully ready to sail on the day it’s purchased. So the hull/sails/rigging/electricals/mechanicals need to be in good working condition and the engine/batteries must be 100%.

Minimal Must Have List:

• 30’-42' (my slip is 40' x 15')
• Wheel Steering
• Fin Keel - 6.5' or less (no shoal draft or bulb keels)
• Spade Rudder
• Fiberglass Hull
• Inboard Gas/Diesel Engine 15 HP minimum (no outboards)
• Spacious cockpit (preferred over a roomy interior)
• Gauges:
o Electronic Depth
• Galley - Stove
• Head – Toilet+Sink
• Tankage:
o Fuel - 15 gal minimum
o Water - 20 gal minimum
o Holding - 10 gal minimum

Wish List - Structural:

• Fractional Rig (The larger main sail preferred for easy single handed main-only sailing)
• Single Backstay (if so equipped), not running/split backstays
• Spinnaker Pole or Bow Sprit
• Galley - Stove+Sink+Fixed Icebox
• Head - Toilet+Sink+Shower
• Inboard Diesel Engine 25+ HP
• Tankage:
o Fuel - 25+ gal
o Water - 80+ gal
o Holding - 25+ gal
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #2 ·
Oh... And I'd like to stay away from any "Hunter" models.

Although I do see lots of them tied up around the bay, there seems to be a pretty large Hunter-hater contingent around the Annapolis area. The general perception seems to be that they're poorly constructed and that they focus too much on creature comforts down below not enough on sailing performance and build quality.
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I can probably pull together 20% (6k on a 30k boat).

I will be spending most of my time in the bay. But I'd like something seaworthy enough to potentially make relatively short cruising runs to places like Block Island and Bermuda.
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #6 · (Edited)
The 10k to 20k rule is kinda generalistic isn't it? Can't the total cost of ownership after purchase be affected in either direction by a whole host of more specific factors like, (but not limited to):

Does the boat model/year have any known issues?
Was the boat raced or used only as a fair weather day sailer?
Has the boat logged thousands of hours or was it a dock queen?
Does the owner have meticulous maintenance records or not?
Does the owner's boat upkeep show attention to detail or not?
Has the boat ever been in any major accidents or not?
What issues show up on the survey and during sea trials?

But to narrow down the original question a little more... I seem to be seeing a lot of the following boats in the over 30' and under 30k range. Based on my original criteria and any known issues. Are there any of these builders that most of you would eliminate from the list of contenders? Conversely, which would you put in your top 3?

Beneteau
C&C
Cal
Catalina
Ericson
Morgan
O'Day
Pearson
S2
Tartan
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
With excellent credit and if I was looking at an under 30k loan with 6k down, wouldn't that give me a drastically lower interest rate than 12% and a subsequently higher purchase price? (I'm seeing 5.99 teaser rates being advertised on the front page of many boat financing websites).

The part I readily admit that I don't understand is how to predict the loan term lengths lending institutions will allow...

The typical car loan is simple, 5 yrs for new, 4 yrs for used. But in boat financing it can stretch up to 30 years on the far end of the spectrum. I know 30 yrs wouldn't apply to a 30k loan, but how far can you stretch it out?

Is there a chart online anywhere that breaks down the price points and boat ages at which you can get a 5, 7, 10, 15, etc year loan?
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #15 ·
I'm well aware that lenders holding onto money with a death grip right now. But I'm from the school of thought that anything that flies, floats, or drives should be financed rather than tying up the total amount that could otherwise be used for investments that aren't guaranteed to depreciate over time.

So I do have the means to put 20% down, but I want to keep the initial outlay into the boat as low as possible. I'm also staying very budget minded in terms of the total cost I want to pay for the boat so that I won't be so boat poor that I can't afford a new set of sails when they need to be replaced.

The reason for my desire to keep 30' as the minimum is that I want something that's got enough cockpit area to actually seat me and 4 guests without everyone needing to sit on top of each other. I also want an inboard engine and wheel steering to keep the cockpit area clear, both of which seem to be rare to see on anything under 30'.

So maybe the answer is to start incrementally bumping up the cost from 30k to see where the criteria I want become available in a boat that isn't 20+ years old and unfinanceable.
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
You must have been reading my mind... I was actually beginning to wonder how many of those boat owners out there with boats that aren't going for chump change, but are too old to be financed, would be willing to strike up similar owner financing deals as long as a proper contract was executed to protect both parties?

I'll PM you with my email address for additional details on the T-30.

As long as we're talking about creative financing, especially when boat loan foreclosures seem to be on the rise just like with everything else... Other than just social networking... Are there any other ways to find people who are in trouble but haven't let their boats actually go back to the bank yet?

I'm thinking of a take over the payments scenario where the owner might have to take a bit of a loss, but who would be willing to entertain a deal to keep their credit from being destroyed by defaulting on their loan.
 

· 1979 C&C 30 Mk I - 2QM15
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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
Doing paper research only... I think I've narrowed the list of racer/cruiser candidates based on the criteria I originally listed. Plus I also limited my search to 30' boats in the under 25k range, and newer than 1980. I'm listing them in the order of precedence of how well they seem to fit my sailing needs/desires best:

1. Ericson 30+
2. C&C 30 Mk I
3. Catalina 30 Tall Rig
4. S-2 9.2A

The ones I ruled out for various factors including Tiller Only available steering or Cramped cockpits or Poor build quality were:

Irwin 30
O'Day 30
Pearson 30
Cal 30
Tartan 30
J-30

I plan on doing the vast majority of my sailing in the Chesapeake Bay. But I would like a boat that can potentially handle coastal cruising and the occasional run out to Bermuda.

Based on the knowledge and experience here... I'm open to any opinions that would re-order my top 4 for the type of sailing I've described. Or if you would eliminate any that I came up with.
 
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