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Reforming Stinkpotter
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Discussion Starter #1
So I spent a solid 8 hour day with the surveyor today. A good six of them on the boat. So someone either talk me in or out of this thing.

Things that I was pretty sure needed attention (now I know they do):

Major Cleaning, Buffing & Waxing.
Running and Standing Rigging.
12 Volt Electrical Panel (original toggle switches).
110 Electrical Panel (crazy square D home panel a few outlets and a shore charger as well as a dead or about to be dead 110 fridge)
there is a separate 12 Volt fridge unit that is only 6 years old.
Bimini needs re sewn and new zippers.
Mainsail cover needs a few patches and new snaps around the mast.
Cables on steering quadrant need replaced.
Bottom needs done. Haul clean and paint last bottom job 2004 prior owner. I have seen pictures and it looked good then.
Log on the shaft needs replaced.
Kitchen counter and sink and faucet and stove look like *#(^$

Things I thought would be a problem and are:

The mast step is done, it is severely corroded and basically unsafe
The crazy steel cross members under the forward and aft bulkheads are corroded as well, the aft one is much worse than the forward one the flange on the hull bottom were it bolts to the keel is toast
The forward one will clean up and survive a while longer

Things I didn't catch the first time out:

The water tanks under the floor are weeping so they aren't long for this world
Every through hull is suspect this is unfortunate as they aren't as old as the boat but have had no maintenance over the last four or five years and most won't close ( have to write them off)
The one that really makes me mad, The two forward bulkheads have serious damage, both inner chain plates that attach to the bulkheads have been leaking for a while and there is rot on both sides. There is evidence of a former repair on the port side and serious delamination under the settee were the aforementioned metal cross member bolts through.
The bulkhead repair will require removing both settee's and laminating a new bulkhead (1/2 teak plywood over the old then retrimming it all out with new bolts for the chain plates)
I won't go into the various lights and switches and other little everyday BS that is wrong with the boat.

The good stuff:

A six year old motor that is in good shape.
A boat that sails well.
Serviceable main sail, and jib as well as a nearly new spinnaker.
The boat had the shaft, prop and cutlass bearing replaced in 2002.
It also had and additional 20 or so grand spent on it between 2001 and 2002 by the owner before last. I have gone through the receipts and with the exception of the motor and refrigeration most of that good will has been used up.

So here is were I am with the boat and the budget:

The boat is $18000.
It will likely cost $3000 to $4000 to do the rig.(including the new step).
It will cost me $3000 to do the bottom.
It will cost me $2000 to do the running rigging. (Lines blocks, Traveler)
It will cost me $1000 in materials and a lot of my time to do the repairs to the bulkheads and reconfigure the salon berths the right way, and refinish the interior.
It will cost me $1000 in material and a lot of my time to fix the electrical panels.
It will cost me $300 to replace the head and straighten out the plumbing there.
Steering quad will cost $500 in materials and my time.
Canvas repair $500
Shaft log $500 including labor to replace.
Through hulls $500 and my time.
Materials for counter, sink and faucets $500
New lights fans etc $500
Stove $1500
Water Tanks, steel cross members and floor repair?
Does the fiberglass liner under the floor provide any serious structure or can this be reconfigured?

Just because someone will ask. My skills include, fiberglass and gell coat repairs as well as lots of west system work.
I used to be a general contractor and finish carpenter in a former life. So the wood work doesn't scare me. I also have wired whole house and I have don't some pretty extensive wiring work on boats as well. I also work in the charter business and have good contacts for the things I can't handle.

So is the boat worth it the money and the time or should I move on? My guess is that I will end up north of $30000 and closer to $40000 with the repairs and that is before we get into wish lists and might as wells. Like solar panels and stereos and plotter oh my.
Jay

PS here is a link to the pictures for anyone that didn't see them in the other thread.
 

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Unfortunatly I don't think anyone can really answer this big question for you as everyone buys a boat for different reasons. As an example when I was looking two years ago I went through about 200 boats before I bought mine and I did buy it because it was turn key with over $20k invested in it by a meticulous previous owner so I didn't really have to do a thing. On the other hand a good friend of mine bought his boat for 1/3 the usual cost but then spent a year and close to $25k doing tons of work to it just like you would have to do on yours. He likes doing the work though and it is part of the reason why he bought the boat where as for myself I would not like doing all that and would prefer to pass and look for a boat with minimal work as I did.

So what I am trying to say is as long as you know what is invlolved with fixing her up and especially with the costs, then ask yourself is that something you want and are prepared to do. Otherwise if it is not pass on this one and I am sure you will find another. There is no wrong or right answer but only the answer that will suite you best and make you most happy. Goodluck!
 

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It always takes more time and money than you think. For that price, there are a lot of boats which require minimal work and/or upgrades, all for the price you have already budgeted for purchase and repairs. Would you rather sail or work?
 

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... is as long as you know what is involved with fixing her up and especially with the costs, then ask yourself is that something you want and are prepared to do. Otherwise if it is not pass on this one and I am sure you will find another. There is no wrong or right answer but only the answer that will suit you best and make you most happy....
As long as you can sail her while you fix her up, a project boat can be fun and fulfilling. I just wouldn't buy a boat that I can't even sail until I put a fortune in her.
 

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How much do you love the boat?
I found a Pearson 39 Yawl that called to me. It was rough but with a sound hull and deck. I bought it for about $15k. I put $60k into it. Some say I am crazy, but I have a boat that is like new with everything upgraded or replaced except the hull and deck. Rigging, sails, interior cushions, winches, etc. etc. etc. New engine too.
Could I get my money out of it. NO.
Do I care. NO!
How much do you love THAT boat?
 

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I think your repair estimate is about half of what you would actually end up spending. When you look at everything on your lists - there is not much on the boat that doesn't need to be replaced/repaired. You need to determine if the boat is worth 100K to you.
 

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Reforming Stinkpotter
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Discussion Starter #8
Well after a good nights sleep and thoughts of what a task the boat would be. I am leaning toward not doing it. I will have the printed survey tomorrow with better pictures. I do like the work, that said I do it every day for a living so I don't know how long it would continue to be fun. When I first looked at this boat I thought it would be possible to do some minor repairs to the bulkheads, replace the questionable rigging, tighten up a few odds and ends and sail the boat, knowing that I would have other projects down the road. The mast step and other structural issues weren't on my radar. I also knew that I would have to address the electrical issues as well. In all likely hood someone could do some patching up and live on the boat here and sail once in while but I am just not wired that way. If I can't make the boat right I won't be happy.
Frankly living here does complicate things as well, as yard work and lay days are very expensive here. I do have good sources for parts being in the industry but freight adds to the cost of parts as well.
I do appreciate all of the frank and honest responses.
Jay
 

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Reforming Stinkpotter
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Discussion Starter #10
Well I have officially backed out of the deal. I am out about $800 with the survey and a couple of trips to St John. I did agree to pay for a couple of ads for the seller out of my deposit and expect to get the other four hundred back today. I did make him a counter offer of $8000 based on the report figuring I could get the structural work done for $10000 locally and then I would have been back were I started. He wasn't interested. So we are shoping again.
Jay
 

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I really think you dodged a bullet on this one, some boats are a bad deal if you get it free. And your estimates are WAY low in both time and money, you'd have blown a lot more than $800 in the first minute you owned it.
I paid $300 for a fairly decent head without even considering the $9.00 a foot hose etc. required.
 

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Freedom 39
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Good choice Jay. Keep looking and be patient, when the "right" deal shows up you'll know it and not have so many doubts.
 

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I think you are underestimating the cost of repairs. 8 years ago we purchased a vagabond 42 in comparable need of repair. We are finally prepping to leave and will have spent about $120,000 buying, repairing, and readying her to go. She is my third complete boat restoration. So I knew what we were getting into. We did it anyway because she is one our all time favorite boat designs. We decided to take her on because we wanted to save her. Yes, we could have bought something ready to go, but it would not be anywhere near as solidly built nor as comfortable sailing as she is. All of that said, my point is, whether or not it's worth it depends on your reason for buying it and how much time and money you are willing to spend to make her right and ready. I should add the we have done 99% of the work ourselves.
 

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You are responding to an eleven year old thread, BTW....
:)
 

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You are responding to an eleven year old thread, BTW....
:)
I realized that when I saw CharlieCobra in the thread. It may be an old thread but I still want to see the results of an 8 year restoration.
 

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Looks like a project boat... and not the sort of projects I would want to face in a new to me boat. I'd take a pass.
 

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First of all, take what ever your best estimate of time and money to repair it and add 50% to the cost and double the time, at least. Then the question is, do you want to sail a boat, or just work on a boat. Id pass. To many major items.
 

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Regarding the specific boat that starts the thread, it's all academic all these years later, but still true about how to divide up one's time between working on the boat and sailing it. Still, if you're in this for the 'long haul', taking on a project boat at the right price is about the only way to get a big boat with good underlying quality on a budget.

We bought an Ericson fixer-upper in 1994, and spent a lot of time in '95 doing repairs and upgrades... then sailed it while working away on a list of upgrades for several more years. We still have it, since it was judged large enough to qualify as a 'final' boat.
Presently we are embarked on a restoration/re-fit. The result will be the new 34 footer we will never be able to afford.
This size and quality of boat would cost about $300K new, and that's if you could even find a performance cruiser like this.
(And it's a productive way to get thru a no cruising and closed borders summer due to the pandemic.)

I wonder what the OP did wind up with? Hope he's happy.
 
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