[mbianka]

For those who will be putting their boats on the hard over the winter. Ace Hardware here in the states has a good deal on -50 degree Antifreeze for water systems for the next few days. $1.99 per gallon. Limit of two. At least the stores in my area have the special.

 

[HUGOSALT]

Thank you! Hope not to be using for a while but sadly eventually will...

 

[pdqaltair]

If it is Camco Artic Ban, that is an ethanol/PG blend and is a price-point product. Corrosion protection is unimpressive.

Probably false economy for most. Camco Freeze Ban is a better product (all PG, better corrosion protection) more suited to the marine market.

 

[capt jgwinks]

For your plumbing it should be fine if your temps don't go below -30 or so. Use the good stuff in the engine.

 

[hellosailor]

So if I put that -50 antifreeze in my engine, won't that make the engine too cold to run? What kind of oil do I need if the antifreeze makes my engine that cold?

 

[Minnewaska]

Nothing other than -100 is used to flush the raw water cooling system on our motors. That's the burst point, the actual freeze point is much, much warmer.

The freeze point for -50 deg antifreeze is around +15 degs (that's plus 15!) No thanks.

 

[Rhapsody-NS27]

Nothing other than -100 is used to flush the raw water cooling system on our motors. That's the burst point, the actual freeze point is much, much warmer.

The freeze point for -50 deg antifreeze is around +15 degs (that's plus 15!) No thanks.

That may be the freeze point but it still won't expand until a lower temp. Of course, if it's diluted, then the freeze point will be even higher. I just ran 10.5 bottles of -50 through my engine (2GM). Some left over from last year so just wanted to use it. I think my engine will be good this year now my boat is back on the trailer.

Some good points about dilution of anti-freeze: Engine - Winter Freeze Protection Photo Gallery by Compass Marine How To at pbase.com

Here's a video, thanks to Maine Sail

 

[Minnewaska]

That may be the freeze point but it still won't expand until a lower temp. Of course, if it's diluted, then the freeze point will be even higher. ......

Dillution is another reason I do not use -50 in the motor. There are all sorts of nooks and crannies in the exchanger that may not displace, but rather mix with the antifreeze. -50 degrades exponentially.

As for freeze or burst, I don't like the odds in between. Expansion that hasn't yet reached the theoretical size/pressure to burst something?? Again, no thanks.

Antifreeze, should prevent freezing.

 

[newhaul]

Trying to wrap my head around the freeze point being so much less that the rated freeze point listed with a 52% glycol freeze point listed as -40 deg f here's the chart I found FREEZING POINTS FOR SOLUTIONS OF ETHYLENE GLYCOL

GLYCOL
% BY VOLUME
°F
°C
12.5 25 -4
17 20 -7
25 10 -12
32.5 0 -18
38.5 -10 -23
44 -20 -29
49 -30 -34
52.5 -40 -40. Freezing Points of Ethylene Glycol Mixtures

 

[Maine Sail]

Trying to wrap my head around the freeze point being so much less that the rated freeze point listed with a 52% glycol freeze point listed as -40 deg f here's the chart I found FREEZING POINTS FOR SOLUTIONS OF ETHYLENE GLYCOL

GLYCOL
% BY VOLUME
°F
°C
12.5 25 -4
17 20 -7
25 10 -12
32.5 0 -18
38.5 -10 -23
44 -20 -29
49 -30 -34
52.5 -40 -40. Freezing Points of Ethylene Glycol Mixtures

#1 OP is talking about an "RV" antifreeze. A good-50 product will not be a 50% blend but rather much less, usually between 26% and 31% PG. West Marine Pure Oceans -50 and Star Brite Antigel -50 are two of the best -50F products you can buy (Practical Sailor Sept 2014) and they both have good corrosion inhibition packages too.

#2 We are not discussing EG but rather a PG product. Course the one on sale is not at all likely to be propylene glycol but rather a cheap alcohol blend..

#3 Regardless of what you use for a PG you need to ensure it has not been diluted. The best way to know this is by physically testing what comes out the exhaust or faucets with a refractometer.

 

[lancelot9898]

This year I used both EG and PG when I winterized the boat this past week since I did have a gift card from West Marine that I wanted to use up and they have the more expensive PG stuff. I would use neither in the salt water side of the engine. I made sure to use the PG stuff on the toilet bowl, wash down pump, sump and bildge pumps considering that the cheaper alcohol blend might be more harmful to the gaskets. There is always a little bit of water left in the tanks and not sure of how much so the actual freezing point will be a lot more than the minus 50. I'm not really sure of how much lower than 32 F that I've gained by dumping that stuff into the tanks plus mixing the two blends in the tanks is another unknown. I did make sure that the water lines were blown out completly and filled with the undiluted stuff.

 

[JimsCAL]

Mainesail is correct about the ACE product. Its ethanol, not propylene glycol. I have a gallon left from last year. Clearly says for water systems. Not a good choice for winterizing your engine.

 

[Minnewaska]

.....I did make sure that the water lines were blown out completly and filled with the undiluted stuff.

If you blow the lines out, why add antifreeze, which then has to be purged in the spring? I blow ours out and leave them. Certainly a little bit must remain in low spots, but to date, never enough to do harm.

 

[lancelot9898]

Two reasons for adding the antifreeze to the lines after blowing out.
1. Have extra antifreeze anyway so why not use it considering that there is already antifreeze in the tanks and the system needs to be purged in the spring regardless.

2. I would rather have the lines filled rather than being exposed to air and possible contamination.

 

[mbianka]

I've got two gallons of the stuff in the car at the boatyard. I expect to row back there tomorrow to pick up mail and do some laundry. I'll try and get the particulars of the product if I can remember to do it.

 

[newhaul]

#1 OP is talking about an "RV" antifreeze. A good-50 product will not be a 50% blend but rather much less, usually between 26% and 31% PG. West Marine Pure Oceans -50 and Star Brite Antigel -50 are two of the best -50F products you can buy (Practical Sailor Sept 2014) and they both have good corrosion inhibition packages too.

#2 We are not discussing EG but rather a PG product. Course the one on sale is not at all likely to be propylene glycol but rather a cheap alcohol blend..

#3 Regardless of what you use for a PG you need to ensure it has not been diluted. The best way to know this is by physically testing what comes out the exhaust or faucets with a refractometer.

OK now it makes sense I was not thinking of the potable water system here most ppl never even winterize beyond draining tanks and blowing lines doesn't freeze that hard here don't ever see any sub 0 here and rarely any ice in your he marina unless close to a creek average water temp in the sound I have observed in my marina was 42 deg at my keel and constant motion I was not awake was thinking engine winterizing.

 

[mbianka]

OK now it makes sense I was not thinking of the potable water system here most ppl never even winterize beyond draining tanks and blowing lines doesn't freeze that hard here don't ever see any sub 0 here and rarely any ice in your he marina unless close to a creek average water temp in the sound I have observed in my marina was 42 deg at my keel and constant motion I was not awake was thinking engine winterizing.

Yeah I should have made it clear it is for the water system in the OP. Oh wait I did. One of the nice things about converting to electric propulsion is that winterizing now only requires doing the water system. All this talk of winterizing the engine is bringing back memories, bad memories of chilly November evenings with messy oil changes and filling buckets with gallons of antifreeze with cold hands and the smell of diesel, oil and antifreeze in my clothes.

 

[mbianka]

I rowed ashore and looked at the antifreeze gallons. It is Camco's Artic Ban. Label says: "A blend of Ethyl Alcohol, Glycol, Denaturants, Colorant and Water used for -50 burst protection in potable water systems." I have not checked it on my refractometer but, think it will be fine for my needs. Avg temperature here in winter is 33 F and rarely goes down into the single digits. YMMV.