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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
Adjusting Your Rig, step by step.

Small introductory disclaimer (because you Americans love to sue people):

For the record it is my strong personal opinion and belief that any and all work performed in a boat's rig should be performed and done by appropriate professionals, (that know what they are doing, because I have seen too many "rig professionals" that don't have a clue of what they are doing), do it yourself only if you have at least 3 ounces of brain and if have been around boats long enough and know with a minimal amount what you are doing..If you don't, PLEASE DON'T TOUCH IT, IT's NOT FOR YOU.

If you damage your rigging, your boat and/or hurt yourself or others don't come here blame me..get a life, I wrote this for intelligent people only.

This I write bellow is to help you get by should you not find a rigger near you. IT IS FOR INFORMATION ONLY.


Now the post:

A few months ago, one of our most dear friends here at Sailnet was stranded with a mast down problem, in a location where proper rigging professionals were scarce and the knowledge about rigging of the existing "rig professionals" was par to the local baker, veterinary and dentist…(I think he mentioned they were the same guy)…

So, and since he asked, I wrote him a small letter (sorry for the spelling mistakes and grammar), where I tried to explain to him how to set his rig in a way that would allow him to continue his journey and even get by in the future.

Please note this is my own experience, and other people may have better procedures..like I say, I am not a professional, and do this based on my own experiences. So if you don't like it, write you own and post here. It will only enrich the site. Please keep disagreements to PM level only, and I will discuss with you, should you not like or agree with me. Thank you.

HOW TO ADJUST AND SET YOUR RIGGING:

First you need understand this:

We will do 3 basic adjustment types:

Lateral Adjustment
• Longitudinal Adjustment
• Sailing (done later) Adjustmet


1) Lateral Adjustment.

(NOTE: this has to be done in a day with no wind with the boat perfectly horizontal, shift weight if you have to, to balance the boat).

a) Install the mast, and make sure the intermediate and lower shrouds are lose, but attached.

b) Make sure the stays and back stays are attached but not over tightened. At this point you want the mast as vertical as possible.

c) Remove the boom, or lower it so its not pulling on the mast, we will need the topping lift.

d) If the mast is keel stepped, remove the centering thru deck bushings at this stage.

e) Once the mast is up and vertical by eye observation, take the topping lift or the main halyard and measure the distance from the top of the mast to the boat's toe rail on port side. Repeat on starboard side, make sure the location of measure is symmetrical and at the same distance from the bow.
f) If the distances are not the same, tighten the side with the longest measurement.

g) Tighten the upper shrouds to a snug fit the same number of turns on each side, until the mast is perfectly centered.

2) Longitudinal Adjustment. (Rake)

(NOTE: this has to be done in a day with no wind with the boat perfectly horizontal, shift weight if you have to balance the boat).

Rake will help increase or decrease Weather helm. Aft Rake increases weather helm, improving pointing, forward rake does the opposite.

Normal rake is 1 to 2º degrees aft for cruiser boats and up to 4º deg aft for high performance racers.

a) Install a bucket with water under the boom by the mast.

b) Attach a heavy object to the main sail halyard and dip it the bucket but it should not touch the bottom of the bucket. (The bucket and water are used to dampen the swinging of the halyard.)

c) Measure P, which is the distance from the boom to the top of the mast.

d) Measure the distance from the halyard to the edge of the mast, at the gooseneck.

The distance should be as follows in the table:

Note, if you have a T shaped mast head, for halyard sheaves, add the distance of the T leg to mast to the above calculations.

Here is an example:

Our friend's mast is 42 feet long, or 12,8 meters, therefore for:

0,5º Deg rake = 11,52 cm = 4,33 Inches
1º Deg rake = 22,4 cm = 8,66 Inches
2º Deg rake = 44,8 cm = 17,3 Inches
3º Deg rake = 67,2 cm = 26,3 Inches

He also had a mizzen mast, and in his case, the mizzen mast has 21 feet, or 6,4 meters, therefore, for:

0,5º Deg rake = 5,76 cm = 1,96 Inches
1º Deg rake = 11,2 cm = 4,33 Inches
2º Deg rake = 22,4 cm = 8,66 Inches
3º Deg rake = 33,6 cm = 12,99Inches

e) Measure the distance from the halyard to the edge of the mast, at the gooseneck.

f) Adjust the rake as needed, using the above table, using the stays and triatic also, (should you have a triatic), don't forget that, ok?

g) Once all is where it should be, and the mast is where you want it, I would go with a rake of 1 º Deg for both masts for cruisers and 3% for racers.

h) Later on, once you sail, if you "feel" you need more rake use above numbers and adjust all again.

Note if you have a mizzen, for the triatic, you need a little help to get up there, but try to do it once with only one climb.

3)Dynamic Adjustment.

This will be obviously done later, if you feel you need more bend or better mast flexibility. See note further down, as at this stage we need to talk about tension in the rig.

The next step is therefore set the right shroud tension.

RIG TENSION​

1) Shroud tension

We now need to tension the upper shrouds, so let's tension them.
The values I calculated for our friend in the example are as follows:

a) All shrouds, including the upper, intermediate and lower are to be tensioned to 15% of the cable breaking load which in his case was:

3/16 cable the breaking load is 4850 lbs, so 15% of that is 727,5 Lbs

1/4 cable the breaking load is 7054 lbs, so 15% of that is 1058 Lbs

5/16 cable the breaking load is 12566 lbs, so 15% of that is 1885Lbs

b) The stays and triatic are to be set at 20 to 25% of the breaking load.

Use the same calculations above, to calculate the setting values, if you have a LOOS gauge, use it to set these tensions.

c) Now for the main shrouds, if you don't have a Loos, or are just a cheap person, you can use a measuring tape. I did for many years.

You will need to attach a tape of at least 2 meters to the shroud, so that the zero or the beginning of the tape starts at the turnbuckle.

The rule is simple each 1mm of stretch means 5% of the breaking load, and that is valid for ANY CABLE IN A SHROUD, no matter what the diameter is!!!

So you want to have at least 3mm of "growing" or 0.11 inches stretch when you're at the right tension, for 15% tension…cool huh??

Simple. Repeat the other side. Don't do all 3 mm in one go. Do 1mm on each side and measure and adjust slowly so you don't throw the mast off alignment.

Once the upper shrouds are tensioned, go to the next step.

2) Mast Pre bend

Once the masts are where you want them to be, and before we tension the shrouds, we need to set the masts curvature, or pre-bend.

For this attach the halyard that was in the bucket so it ends at the mast foot.

Now adjust the baby stay and or forestays so that the belly of the mast goes forward. Takes a few tries.
The max bend at rest should not exceed half of the mast diameter.

3) Max Mast bend (back stay and or triatic if you have one)

Tension the back stay on the mizzen first, (if you have one), so that the distance from the vertical halyard to the mast is half of the mast's diameter (IMPORTANT - DO NOT EXCEED)

The mast bend when the back stay is pulled should never ever be more than 2% of the height of the mast from the top to the deck (not cabin). In our friends case with a 42 foot mast, at full back stay pull the mast top should not move back more than 10 inches. OK?

NOW IN THE WATER!! Dynamic Adjustment continuation of chapter 3 above.

OK so where are you going to set the intermediate and lower shrouds??

LOWERS

Easy. At dock, adjust the lowers so they are just tensile to the finger, use the Loos to set them equally port and starbord, they should be almost flexible at rest. Hard but not too much. These can only be adjusted once you sailed to measurel.

INTEMEDIATES


also at dock, Should have a flex of about ½ inch when at rest.


The lower shrouds adjustment


Now, when you go sailing, on the first tack, see if the mast is vertical and doesn't bend sideways when you are on a tack.
Look from underneath and see if it's straight.

If the mast bends to leeward, kind of like bellies to the low side, the lowers are too flexed.

Go to the lee side lower, and turn it a few turns, and note how many times you turned.

Then tack to the other side and see if its good. If its still bent, go on the lee side one and do the same number of turns plus a few more, repeat tacking and adjusting till all is good and straight.

The Intermediate shrouds adjustment


It's the same as with the lowers, except now it's the top part of the mast that "bends" to leeward if they are lose.

Those only adjust at the marina, ok??? You need to go up there.

So a recap:


1) Tighten by hand the upper shrouds till the mast is straight.
2) Adjust mast rake with stays and backstay/triatic.
3) Tension upper shrouds to 15% breaking load
4) Adjust mast pre-bend
5) Adjust back stay movement to not more than 2% mast lenght
6) Adjust lower shrouds while sailing
7) Adjust intermediates observing while sailing and adjusting at dock

Have fun.
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
Gui,

1. it would help to define the various types of stays on the mast for us non English readers.This to unsure that we correctly tighten the correct stay.

2. At one point you said you calculated the strength to be 15% of breaking strength. How do you arrive at this figure?
Xuraax,

It's GIU !!!! Damn it!!!! (inside joke...don't worry):D :D

Now, for your information, I have learnt the technical english they use in the United States, so that you know I use (with some difficulty) their terms.

Stays are all cables and/or lines that pull the mast in the longitudinal axis, forward or backwards, such as Fore stay, Stay, back stay, baby stay and Triatic (for mizzen masts).

Shrouds are the ones that are located on the sides, normally attached to chain plates, and pass thru the spreaders.

As far as the 15%, I said I had calculated it, but it was in response to a question my friend had asked. He sails a heavy cruiser in moderate to heavy winds, and 15% seemed like a good all around value for his case.

Shroud tension should vary between 10% and 20% of wire or cable breaking load. and stay between 15% and 30%.

Also the tension settings should vary with the prevailing wind strenghts the boat normally sails in. 10% shroud tension would be better as far as performance is concerned for a boat sailing in moderate winds, 20% should be better for racers and or for boats sailing in heavier winds, where less flexibility is desired.

In your case, and since I know Malta very well, and you want to race, 20% should be the right setting, and 25% for the stay.
 

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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
Again; nice writup Giulietta. I was wondering about the difference between rake and pre-bend. When you measure pre-bend is that in addition to the rake? So first you measure the rake and then you put additional pre-bend on the mast?

I also have a question regarding the wedging at the cabin roof for a keel stepped mast. "Spartite" was installed at the partners so I can't remove and replace wedges. Can I add rake and bend with the Spartite in place or would trying to rake the mast at this point only result in bending? The mast already has a factory taper and pre-bend IIRC; it's a tall rig, the I is 52'. Visually I don't see much rake; but there is bend above the upper spreaders.
Look here:



KH..the bend is mesasured by bringing the halyard you used to set the rake to near the mast foot, so you can measure it, by measuring the distance between the halyard and the mast, and this is obviously independent of the rake, since the halyard starts at the mast head and comes to the mast foot, and that happens even if the mast is lying down on the floor.

technically, the bend should be there independent of the rake, that is why you set the rake first and the bend after. Now the bend can be increased at a later stage by the backstay, if you have one.

As far as the mast thru deck seal..obviously it would be better if it was not there, as the thru deck is creating a "pivoting point" in the mast, thus affecting the ability to properly set rake and bend.

But if you can't remove it, "he that doesn't have a dog, can hunt with a cat", as we say in my country.

The rake can to some extent still be set but I doubt you can get better than 3 deg rake, as it will start bending, yes.. Give it a try..

If you knew how many people I know that complain about boats with excessive or lack of weatherhelm that are sailing boats with wrong rake, you would be surprized....

The tapper is to reduce weight aloft, make the top more flexible and make the mast loom good, and less "tree stump" on the top... the bend is done once on the boat, not at the factory..they ship them straight as a whistle..
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 ·
[/FONT]

Careful... I did some basic calcs on this and yes; for an equivalent diameter and equivalent length the linear stretch is roughly proportional to tensile stress regardless of diameter. BUT if the smaller diameter shroud is smaller in length (which it should be) then the amount of pre-load you apply per mm of stretch is increased. That's because strain = change in length / original length.

Example:

Let's say you have a 50' mast with 7/16 upper shrouds. The calculations I did suggest that you would need 5.98 mm of stretch applied to them to get ~1600 lbs of pre-load.

In the same example; if the shrouds were 1/4" you would also need to stretch them 5.98mm to achieve 540 lbs of pre-load.

But; if you have a shorter mast (as you should) with 1/4" wire the stretch required to get 540lbs of pre-load will be less. If the mast is 30' tall the stretch required will be 3.6mm to get the same 540 lbs of pre-load. If it were tightened to 5.98mm it would have roughly 900 lbs of pre-load or 25% of break load.

So; while the rule-of-thumb is probably OK for a rough tune I would say that if you apply it to taller rigs it will result in shroud tensions that are on the loose side; and on shorter rigs it will result in shroud tensions that are a bit too tight. :)


Thanks for the additional info on rake VS bend. I understand it now; and now I'm not sure if the mast actually has rake or not. I'll do some measuring and adjusting according to your excellent procedures.
KH..I don't know how you did your calculations, but I confess you are puzzling and confusing me a lot...

where did you get the numbers and are you sure about the values you are using for breaking loads?

Normally 7/16 cable which is around 11mm has a BL of 27.815 lbs, roughly (as my tables are metric)..and a stretch of 5.98mm as you suggest is 30% not 6%, as that is the stretch for the 1600lbs you are refering to.

a 1/4 cable that has a BL of 7054 lbs roughly, at 900lbs it is at 13%...
 

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Discussion Starter · #41 ·
Knothead, thanks for the good post, it enriches everyone's expereinces here to have guys like you around, thanks.

I don't have time to make one, but do you know where one can find the shroud breaking loads tables according to thickness, that shows both metric and imperial?

It would be good to add it here, if someone cares to do it. Thanks

Alex
 

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Discussion Starter · #48 · (Edited)
Xuraax,

I remeber writting something to you about your boat not long ago SEE HERE (I even was criticized a few posts after, when I know the boat, and know what it can do, from being on them, not from reading in magazines or bla bla bla)...

I had told you once that somethings are just the way they are, and must be changed to act differentely.

What happens is your boat may be dressed like a race boat, smell like a race boat, be among racer boats, even looks like one, and sometimes go fast as one, BUT it is not a race boat.

It's a fast normal production boat that can be sailed faster than normal and faster than the others..(but it's limited to a wind envelope)...

It still behaves like a cruiser, even if you add rake, tension, etc. It's a cruiser...designed as a cruiser, has a cruiser keel, and rudder, and hull shape...

You need to modify the keel, modify the rudder, lighten the boat, and make the boat go thru a racing oriented modification for it to handle the winds in Malta..specially when you start getting above 18kts.

There is little you can do without modifying it... you need to have a fast main traveller system, longer and thiner keel, a longer rudder, a different mast, different genoa controls, etc..

Some things are just like they are...your boat was made to sail faster than the other same type boats, but it has many many limitations...

A Ford Focus will never be a Porsche, even if you put stickers and go fast stripes on the doors..

Now, change the suspensions, brakes, engine etc...It will do as a Porsche, go fast as one..BUT it will never be one...

You need to start investing heavily (I know believe me) to make the boat do what you want..THAT boat will not behave good in strong winds, its a low to moderate wind boat...that boat is just a regular fast cruiser, like a Dehler or a Grans Surprise, it will never be a Sinergia or a B&C...

And to be honest...investing in that boat to bring it to do what you want..might as well buy an old IMS off the Copa del Rey in Spain, and then you'll be driving the Porsche...
Sorry
 

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Discussion Starter · #52 ·
Great post, Giu!

Precisely I have a problem with the rigging and I was looking for an expert to help me fix it.

Only one suggestion, I am not acquainted with the cable measurements (1/4, 3/16, 5,16). Do you have at reach the equivalence in mm for you neighbours? (Well, I am not exactly your neighbour because I'm Catalan so we have Spain in between.... :D )

Thanks a lot!
Actually the tables I have are in millimiters. But for the guys here at sailnet I had to covert from KN and Kg to Inches and Pounds.

Here is a tble I made in Excel and took a snap shot, that should make it clear for everyone in Inches and Millimiters, KN, Kg and Lbs.

 

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Discussion Starter · #58 ·
Giu,
There is something wrong with your statement that 1mm of stretch = 5% of breaking load. This has to be 1mm of stretch per 1 meter of length, or some other ratio. I used to build a system that used a 1/4" cable 800 feet long. Proper tension on that system was to stretch the cable 8 FEET!
Maybe it was the way I wrote it.

c) Now for the main shrouds, if you don't have a Loos, or are just a cheap person, you can use a measuring tape. I did for many years.

You will need to attach a tape of at least 2 meters to the shroud, so that the zero or the beginning of the tape starts at the turnbuckle.

The rule is simple each 1mm of stretch means 5% of the breaking load, and that is valid for ANY CABLE IN A SHROUD, no matter what the diameter is!!!
 

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Discussion Starter · #60 ·
Keel, I am not going to argue this anymore.

You surely have heard about Selden masts, right?

Please allow me to redirect you to their shroud adusting manual.

PAge 30

PAge 31

PAge 39

I am sure your calculations are all correct and such..I got this this morning off the net by googling tension shrouds, and found this manual.

There are several more with the same instructions.
 

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Discussion Starter · #62 ·
Everyone I know tightens the turnbuckle with a screwdriver. Why a wrench/spanner?
I'll keep it simple...

That type of turnbuckles are designed to support tension forces only, and has very little torsion strenght, mainly because there are very little lateral efforts they need to support.....it's made that way when the turnbuckle is made, when the metalurgists make sure the grain of metal is more oblong, making it tension resistant, harder, but less resistant to lateral forces.

In using a screw driver, you are stressing the legs of the turnbuckle with lateral forces, (for which the piece was not designed for), and even twisting the turnbuckle legs, wich then get stressed, and the integrety of the intergranular structure gets compromised, possible causing it to fail at a later stage.

For this reason, the turnbuckle manufacturers make 2 flat surfaces, like a nut, to use a wrench, that will in turn provide rotational forces without stressing the legs of the turnbuckle.

Hope it was simple.

Alex
 
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