[prettyredcars]

So I inherited my father's B24 when I was too young, dumb and broke to restore her. Now that she's sat in the yard being neglected for 5 years, I've decided to take her on.
However, because I left her abandoned in the yard for 5 years without any word or payment my yard owners are being EXTREMELY nice and letting me fix her up this season, but if I don't, I need to sign her over to be destroyed.
So.... Ive got three main problems on my hands and a loose understanding as to what to do about it and need some direction. If anybody out there has fixed these problems or have some advice, please help me!!!

Heres what I got:

1. Taking on water though top of the ballast. Plan to grind and drain keel from bottom. Re-fiberglass interior floor this weekend and add extra pin. No idea where to get said pin. Terrified to drill the hole into my ballast for the pin. No idea how necessary this is.

2. Chain plates. Rebuilding main bulkheads. Setting chain plates in epoxy "boots" as suggested by good old boat. Actually pretty set on this one.... I think.

3. Hull to deck joint and rotting core. The last time Sparrow went out she broke her lines at the dock during a nor'easter and almost lost her. She took a lot of damage from being slammed on top of the dock repeatedly. Because of the awesome steel rib down the bow of Bristols, her hull only took superficial damage. However, the hull to the deck joint was shattered. The top flange breaks away and crumbles like a stale croissant. I'm not sure how to caulk the joint AND build a new flange without doing it in one process, but Im pretty sure applying glass to uncured caulk is a bad idea. There has to be a better solution, right? I want to reinforce the core under my stanchions only while Im at this. If the stanchions at least are reinforced I can repair the rest of the core in the water.

If I can get those three things under control I can be water ready in the very least and motor my shameful stern to a slip where I can tackle my laundry list of restoration projects and not continue to try the patience of kind yard owners with my shenanigans. Anyone have any advice?

 

[Delta-T]

You need 10 posts before you can post pictures. Best to use photobucket to upload, then used the mountain icon tool to post. It would be nice to see pictures of these issues. What year boat? Full keel? Centerboard? In the water now? No, then how do you know she is leaking?

 

[miatapaul]

Being that it belonged to your father it might be worth it. Simply for the sake of memories. On the other hand if they would let you sign it away without paying any back fees you might want to jump on it. I don't want to discourage you but there are quite a few on the market and they are mostly in the $2,000 range and most of those are being actively sailed. So go in with your eyes open, and try not to spend too much, or you could be throwing out more money than you can ever hope to recover. Though you will never make money on a boat it is a shame to see someone put thousands into a boat and they could have gotten one in about the same finished shape for a lot less.

They are a nice looking little boat though.

 

[skink127]

You might want to join this forum...
Sorry, sailnet won't let me post a link so... go to groups.yahoo.com and find your way to the bristolboatowners group
It's the most active Bristol group out there. You'll find lots of B24 owners anxious to help. Some have dealt with the exact issues you describe. I myself have suffered a smashed up hull/deck joint.

Come see us,
Peter

 

[Delta-T]

You might want to join this forum...
Sorry, sailnet won't let me post a link so... go to groups.yahoo.com and find your way to the bristolboatowners group
It's the most active Bristol group out there. You'll find lots of B24 owners anxious to help. Some have dealt with the exact issues you describe. I myself have suffered a smashed up hull/deck joint.

Come see us,
Peter

You need 10 posts to be able to post links and pics.

I got this for you https://groups.yahoo.com/neo/groups/bristolboatowners/info

 

[Barquito]

I would say they yard is being very generous. However, after you fix the boat, they may hit you up for back payments. I would at least pay for the time you will be there working on the boat, with an agreement that you will not be responsible for further payments.

 

[prettyredcars]

You need 10 posts before you can post pictures. Best to use photobucket to upload, then used the mountain icon tool to post. It would be nice to see pictures of these issues. What year boat? Full keel? Centerboard? In the water now? No, then how do you know she is leaking?

She is a full keel with a concrete and lead ballast. She's on the hard but my keel is weeping so I know its taking on water from the cabin sole, I've been widening a grinder area regularly to keep her training until I reglass almost everything in the cabin.

 

[prettyredcars]

I would say they yard is being very generous. However, after you fix the boat, they may hit you up for back payments. I would at least pay for the time you will be there working on the boat, with an agreement that you will not be responsible for further payments.

They are being very kind. They are the owners of the yard I grew up frequenting and when I am done we will be making a deal. As for everyone else's comments about finances and worth, I realize that i could get multiple other boats for the money I've already spent. Its more about wanting to restore this boat as its been a life long pipe dream. That and I may have already spent my only college savings on power tools and 25 yards of fiberglass cloth so I am somewhat beyond the point of no return at this point.....

 

[prettyredcars]

Well, It looks like other people have shamelessly begun their B24 restoration blogs here and I have a feeling everyone here is far more interested than Facebook so I may as well begin right?

February and January: After two cases of bronchitis, one jeep break down by the side of the LIE and the impulsive decision to chop off the rest of my hair with kitchen scissors, I managed to completely gut my forward cabin, relocated all removable wood work, gear and the water tank in to my living room, and opened up the keel so that it has continuously has been draining. If it wasn't for the fact that I spent most of my teenage winters sporadically homeless on the streets of New York City I probably would have unloaded my flare gun into the bilge, dumped all my gear in the sound and moved to Kansas. So thanks to my misspent youth I have cockroach and twinkie like survival abilities and ample long underwear. I also my friends who are endlessly entertained by supporting my adventures and boyfriend who lovingly ensures that I am always well supplied with good whiskey to thank for the past two months. That all said, grinding fiberglass in 10 degree weather was a character building experience that I would enthusiastically volunteer to be keel hauled from the staten island ferry before ever experiencing again.

March: As we fly through the month I am beginning the first steps of rebuilding in leu of much demolishing. This week I prepped the laz to install building styrofoam trapezoidal strips i cut to become fiberglass reinforced ribs over the area where the jack stands slightly warped my hull. on the outside I will be grinding down the area about 1/8 inch and filling the area with a couple layers of fiberglass and epoxy. Its extremely shallow so its more of a cosmetic and precautionary measure than anything, so I'll probably take my time on that one. The ribs however are being installed next week as long as the weather holds over 40degrees. Both bulkheads are also now removed and the overhead is being supported by a jack post. Next week if I have help coming with my (my friends have been signing up to come out now that the weather is turning) I will create epoxy "boots" around the chain plates. I got the idea from good old boat and will post the article when I can post pictures or find it online, which ever comes first. The actual plates are then going to be installed in heavily reinforced flanges until I can afford ply for new bulk heads and decided where they will be installed as I am debating various alliterative interior plans of my own devising. Pictures all to be added soon.


Questions for you all:

What are your preference for replacing balsa core: epoxy injection or fresh balsa? Is it possible to use building styrofoam? I was looking at what I use for stringers and it looks about the right width but I haven't come across any instance of someone using it.

Is it possible to create to much rigidity to the hull with stringers and interior furnishing? And if it is possible, what should I look out for to know Im going a little to far with the installations?

Has anyone here had to re-bed/reinforce their mast step from below deck and what are your suggestions?

Etc, Etc:

I am pursuing a kickstarter campaign but find myself far more interested and distracted by continuing work so it is VERY slow coming. Hopefully that will start to begin to materialize after I move on to rebidding stanchions and cleats, working forward from the starboard corner of the cockpit and eventually around to port where I have the majority of my core, hull to deck and leakage problems.

Fiberglass dust mixed with sweat makes great hair wax.

I have descended to the point of madness where I explain my technical diagrams to my dog on the drives home and began referring to the crowbar as my best friend Daisy. Also, I've decided that Don Casey is God and rules over the deities PercyBlandfordion, PaulCoblessum and JackWileynues in Classicplastopia on Mount Westsystemus. I have tried to tell him this multiple times but sailing magazine keeps screening my comment as inappropriate.

And on that note, good night all.

 

[miatapaul]

Well, It looks like other people have shamelessly begun their B24 restoration blogs here and I have a feeling everyone here is far more interested than Facebook so I may as well begin right?

February and January: After two cases of bronchitis, one jeep break down by the side of the LIE and the impulsive decision to chop off the rest of my hair with kitchen scissors, I managed to completely gut my forward cabin, relocated all removable wood work, gear and the water tank in to my living room, and opened up the keel so that it has continuously has been draining. If it wasn't for the fact that I spent most of my teenage winters sporadically homeless on the streets of New York City I probably would have unloaded my flare gun into the bilge, dumped all my gear in the sound and moved to Kansas. So thanks to my misspent youth I have cockroach and twinkie like survival abilities and ample long underwear. I also my friends who are endlessly entertained by supporting my adventures and boyfriend who lovingly ensures that I am always well supplied with good whiskey to thank for the past two months. That all said, grinding fiberglass in 10 degree weather was a character building experience that I would enthusiastically volunteer to be keel hauled from the staten island ferry before ever experiencing again.

March: As we fly through the month I am beginning the first steps of rebuilding in leu of much demolishing. This week I prepped the laz to install building styrofoam trapezoidal strips i cut to become fiberglass reinforced ribs over the area where the jack stands slightly warped my hull. on the outside I will be grinding down the area about 1/8 inch and filling the area with a couple layers of fiberglass and epoxy. Its extremely shallow so its more of a cosmetic and precautionary measure than anything, so I'll probably take my time on that one. The ribs however are being installed next week as long as the weather holds over 40degrees. Both bulkheads are also now removed and the overhead is being supported by a jack post. Next week if I have help coming with my (my friends have been signing up to come out now that the weather is turning) I will create epoxy "boots" around the chain plates. I got the idea from good old boat and will post the article when I can post pictures or find it online, which ever comes first. The actual plates are then going to be installed in heavily reinforced flanges until I can afford ply for new bulk heads and decided where they will be installed as I am debating various alliterative interior plans of my own devising. Pictures all to be added soon.

Questions for you all:

What are your preference for replacing balsa core: epoxy injection or fresh balsa? Is it possible to use building styrofoam? I was looking at what I use for stringers and it looks about the right width but I haven't come across any instance of someone using it.

Is it possible to create to much rigidity to the hull with stringers and interior furnishing? And if it is possible, what should I look out for to know Im going a little to far with the installations?

Has anyone here had to re-bed/reinforce their mast step from below deck and what are your suggestions?

epoxy injection is purely a kludge. It works for a while, but is brittle and if it does flex will crack. Stryofoam will not work as it has little strength. If you want it to last you have to replace it, and epoxy injection will make the eventual replacement hard, if not impossible. There are some alternative cores you can use. Our member Caleb has a nice write up of what he did on his Tartan 27:

2013, May 2nd. Re-core work party. | Odalisque

I am sure if it were stiffened up too much then you might cause stress cracks, and or ridges in the hull. If you just strengthen what is there you should be good.

 

[billsull]

Questions for you all:
...

Has anyone here had to re-bed/reinforce their mast step from below deck and what are your suggestions?

Greetings from a fellow B24 owner - mine is a work [not] in progress at the moment, but I hope get back to working on her soon to get her back to her former glory.

Anyway, I've done a lot of the same projects over the years on my B24 that you are tackling. With respect to the beam that supports the mast step, I was going to go at it from inside, but I was talked into opening it up from above. That meant removing the mast step and cutting through the built up area under the step, but I think it was the right way to go.

There was a soaking wet (and cracked) beam under the deck. I removed that and replaced with a laminated beam that I made to match the curvature of the deck. After that was glassed in, I had to re-build the mast step area and I ended up having a new aluminum mast step made.

I look forward to following your progress (and maybe getting some inspiration at the same time!)

 

[prettyredcars]

epoxy injection is purely a kludge. It works for a while, but is brittle and if it does flex will crack. Stryofoam will not work as it has little strength. If you want it to last you have to replace it, and epoxy injection will make the eventual replacement hard, if not impossible. There are some alternative cores you can use. Our member Caleb has a nice write up of what he did on his Tartan 27:

I am sure if it were stiffened up too much then you might cause stress cracks, and or ridges in the hull. If you just strengthen what is there you should be good.

Oh man, thank you so much for sending that link my way. Thats the most helpful core project account I've read yet. The only one I've found with a time phrame besides this said 5 years!! (too be fair the guy had two kids... or three. Ill haft find the good old boat issue to be accurate on that one.)
Anyway, rambling again.
Thank you. 4 days sounds much more feasible and seriously comforting in the grand scene of things. I lost track of how many more posts I have left before I can post pictures, but as for updates my dog had a little incident this week involving an unknown object of mine that I had the joy of seeing in an X-ray at the vet's, which also then involved my entire gas fund for the week and Sparrow's next material and supply list.

I was not amused.
:hammer

But my pup is now sleeping it off and I have time to do laundry at least (which I am frequently reminded by my friends and family as kinda important when your life involves disgusting amounts of fiberglass dust.) you live and you learn, so i am told. Hopefully next week I will have some more relevant updates.....

 

[Delta-T]

You have 6 posts out of 10 you need to post links and pictures. It is recommended that you use photobucket and use the picture link tool to post pics. Sailnet's pic upload is not reliable.

 

[prettyredcars]

Time for an update:

Sheesh four weeks and this update will probably be disjointed at best as I sit here half awake watching my dog slowly collect every toy in the apartment and amass them at my feet.

I guess first off, I ran out of gas money for a couple weeks there, which put me behind schedule once again, but i managed to make good time on my return, completing my first fiberglass job (which was graceless) and finally beginning the damn hull to deck joint.

And yes, if you have hear anything about the hull to deck joint it is as absolutely miserable, in fact it is so miserable that everyone on here that warns you it is miserable is sugar coating the extent of its true misery because nobody would ever read any of our post I believe. I am considering skipping removing all the tiny bits of sheared staples and corroded rivets, scraping the nasty green that looks like it was made of chewed gum from under library decks and entombing the whole damn thing in fiberglass. I know, thats probably a terrible idea. But if any one reading this (or my yard owners who I'll probably ask tomorrow morning) happen to know if doing so will nevertheless leave me structurally reinforced enough to withstand rough seas, its happening, and I'll figure out how to make it look ship shape later.

As for the laz, I am proud to say it now sports four fiberglass encased stringers and they don't look that bad either! So for the first two there may have been some screaming, cursing, throwing things, spilling things, hitting other things, and smoking, melting, OMG I THINK ITS ON FIRE things, but my technique has improved. I will be beginning the same process on my overhead possibly as soon as tomorrow since I removed all the hardware and filled the screw holes with epoxy today. (which is another long winded story that ends in "my technique will improve" and "%&#@!!!! GET THE ACETONE!")

Anyway. Its been a long day. And like everything else since October, I know its just part of time and the process which I am thoroughly enjoying despite all (though Im amused to realize I miss the era of my crowbar. Goof that I am thought rebuilding would be the easy part.) Last but not least, I thought it would be easier to begin replacing deck core by attacking a less rotted area under a cleat on my cabin top. Not sure if I chose to wide an area with intact balsam underneath or WTF but I cannot get the skin panel I cut peeled off for the life of me. I am using a heat gun, two screw drivers as prying tools and a spatula, but clearly I am doing something wrong. Anyone have any advice? I need to get it under control by tuesday morning when I report back to the schooner I work on in the city for spring maintenance. I know once rain gets in the grooves where I cut it Im gonna have a lot bigger problems than a stubborn patch of fiberglass skin......

I made a photo bucket account last week but don't have time to really figure it out tonight. In the meantime though Ive been posting videos of my progress throughout the winter. You can find them on youtube under prettyredcars or Miranda J. Holman. Sadly sailnet will not yet let me post links. Although, I could fix that if I get better about posting more regularly... we'll see.

But for now, it is time for me to take a break from this adventure for six slightly itchy and somewhat aching hours, better know as sleep.

 

[desert rat]

I know nothing. I am only an electronic tech. Cut all the deck open on top, clean out everything, cut balsa, pour in polyester, vacume bag. very difficult, but the best solution.
The vacume pump should be the most expensive part.

 

[prettyredcars]

I know nothing. I am only an electronic tech. Cut all the deck open on top, clean out everything, cut balsa, pour in polyester, vacume bag. very difficult, but the best solution.
The vacume pump should be the most expensive part.

Going with construction styrofoam instead of polyester resin. Ive hear a lot of arguments on whats the best material but I've never heard styrofoam so I figured its got almost the same qualities as balsam so why not.

This is pretty silly, but: I know its probably the most foolish thing to have a problem with over the whole process, but I actually can't get the skin up after cutting it. So far I just have one square foot Ive sliced and tried everything today to pull it up......