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Remember you're a womble
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Lots of places in a similar situation, the oceans are becoming more acidic everywhere. Of course it's nothing to do with humans, nope, not our fault at all. Up here of course it's not helped by Harper closing research libraries and destroying much of their contents, nor by him massively cutting and fisheries and oceans budgets. That's one for the politics section though.
 

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bummer....we are losing what little coral reefs we have here....bunch of issue related to that though not just global warming
 

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Yes, oysters, starfish and scallops are dying off rapidly. We have dead starfish on our beach in front of our house and they have no idea why this is happening.
Our Prime Minister has stifled our scientific community in an effort to push through the Northern Gateway pipeline from Alberta to the BC coast. Although it has yet to be approved, millions of tax dollars have already been spent to make this pipeline happen without the publics consent.
Worse, the seagulls, eagles, ducks, crows, sealions, seals and pretty much every other creature that goes past our beach are eating the dead starfish and scallops. It's the collapse of our food chain is what it is and our Government could care less.
All our Government wants to do is sell more oil to China.
Recently our Minister in charge of our fisheries shut down our herring season but the fisherman took it to court and won. Now we have Judges deciding when our fish will be harvested or not.
What's the next species to die off, salmon? dolphins? whales? birds? Us?
What's it going to take for our Government to realize that this is the bottom of our food chain, that we all depend on to survive, that is dying.
It's an absolute disgrace how our Government is dealing with this.
 

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Acidic ocean deadly for Vancouver Island scallop industry - British Columbia - CBC News

CBC news reported this today. Just wondering if similar ocean deterioration is occuring elsewhere or just peculiar to the British Columbia coast.

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Why the article does not give any information on the actual pH changes (as in real numbers) that supposedly are the root cause of this problem? Here on the East Coast the biggest problem for mussels are various parasites, mostly all from invasive species. Maybe some parasites got to the NW from the Japanese tsunami?
 

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Courtney the Dancer
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Seems like they're not really sure what the problem is yet.

"The company is launching a research program with the federal Department of Fisheries and Oceans where researchers will try to determine if acidification is to blame or if other factors are at play."
 

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"The company is launching a research program with the federal Department of Fisheries and Oceans where researchers will try to determine if acidification is to blame or if other factors are at play."
pH is very easy to measure and there is no excuse for not listing the actual pH change observed in these waters in an article clearly blaming sea water acidification for what looks like a massive environmental problem. Very poor journalism.
 

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I was in 4th grade back in the sixties. I remember my teacher distinctly telling us that our future as a species lies with the ocean's bounty. That the oceans have limitless resources. I remember this because I was not a fish eater and was a little panicked about what I was going to eat.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
The local paper here Comox Valley Echo quoted scallop producer official as saying "....we were caught off guard at carbon dioxide levels in the ocean at 1400 parts per million causing ph levels to drop so low they are hazardous to scallops. I have never seen Ph's like this".
 

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We went to a talk on Wednesday by a Marine Biology Professor, who explained that it appears that in the last 50 years fish populations have declined 90% from what they were. The fish that are caught are smaller, and there are fewer of them. On the East Coast we've seen the crash of the cod catch along with many other species.
 

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its amazing just reading sailing books like kon tiki or the roths etc or others mid 20th century...on how much wildlife and sea life existed before, even only 50 60 years ago

I mean people fished and caught shark, ate it...rays...even birds...whales of all types, there was just so much of it it wasnt considered taboo or anything the india ocean for example nowadays is devoid of life in certain areas that its rare to catch even one fish on passages...we didnt

sad really
 

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I have been told that one of the changes for the pipelines is that the enviromental studies for river and stream crossings only have to consider (marketable) fish...
 

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Discussion Starter #14

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I have been told that one of the changes for the pipelines is that the enviromental studies for river and stream crossings only have to consider (marketable) fish...
marketable? thats sad

see this is part of the issue

we overfish whatever someone call good fish and then other fish species are left to do whatever...

I hate when people got all crazy with chilean sea bass, then no salmon form chile, then only atlantic species, then no specific tuna etc...

very burocreatic at least in the states when I was cooking up there

and fishing up there well it just turned me off
I mean I had to have a permit to have a pole on a pier...then someone had to measure all my fish...say what I could keep or not

even if the fish was already dead...and throw it away or get fined


just so against common sense...now Im not saying its right to just fish whatever ALL the time...I think its that because a few did so, the inmense majority now have to suffer the consequences...:)
 

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Courtney the Dancer
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Ocean acidification is obviously a huge concern globally, it would be interesting to know if this huge commercial scallop farm is experiencing a local ph drop or if it is all the waters of BC? From the article it sounds more like a local phenomenon in their own shellfish farm waters where they grow their cultured variety of scallop. I haven't heard of any other die off of shellfish, the Dungeness crab population is actually increasing annually in our area (app. 75 mi. south of Island Scallops Ltd.) and the salmon run last summer was huge.
 

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the pointy end is the bow
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This blog gives additional information left out of a similar article written by the Seattle Times about an oyster spat die off at Willipa Bay. They solved the problem by pulling water into their oyster tanks in the afternoon when PH was higher due to the daily photosynthesis cycle, rather than in the morning when PH was lower.

Cliff Mass Weather Blog: Coastal Ocean Acidification: Answering the Seattle TImes
 

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Did anyone happen to notice, the first thing that always seems to happen is someone is going to institute a comprehensive study - which always takes decades to complete, mainly because they are never completed. Those studies never do anything more than create more, taxpayer funded jobs for those in the scientific community that make a damned good living studying things, but never coming up a viable solution to the problems. Some politician always seem to jump in the forefront stating that he will appoint a blue-ribbon committee to study the problem. Now, get ready to shell out some big, taxpayer dollars - that's how these things work.

Acidification of estuaries and oceans is nothing new, and will NEVER improve - you can bank on that. The commercial fishing industry has decimated our fisheries, and continue to do so at an alarming rate. In the process of raping our oceans with draggers using rigs that resemble a chain-link fence, they not only catch and kill the intended harvest species, but in the process destroy various species of coral, shellfish, etc... If you look at a section of ocean bottom with an ROV camera, which I have done, prior to a dragger coming through the amount of sea life there is beyond belief. The variety is incredible. Two weeks after a dragger passes through, the bottom is nothing more than featureless sand, no coral, no anything.

The next thing that will occur in BC and the commercial scallop fishing industry will ask for, and probably get, some sort of compensation for the die off, claiming it caused them irreparable harm to their way of live and ability to make a living. Yes, another government giveaway program is probably in the making as I type this. That's how it usually works. and I've seen this take place hundreds of times throughout the United States.

What I've always found difficult to believe is why one group of people has any more right to a natural resource than any individual. In the U.S., all natural resources are owned equally by the people, yet we allow, under the guise of commercialism, a small industry to totally decimate those fisheries. Of course, those in opposition of this view, mainly commercial fishermen/watermen, claim they are doing what their forefathers did for a living, and they're not harming the resource.

We still eat shark - mainly spiny dogfish, which are frequently used for fish sandwiches at fast food restaurants. Hey, no way to get a fish bone stuck in your throat and sue the restaurant when there are no bones in the species.

We no longer eat whale meat, but there are some small groups that are still permitted to harvest certain whale species.

Many of the shellfish that reportedly succumbed to parasitic diseases would found they could survive just fine if the waters they lived in were not so damned polluted by human waste. Most of the shellfish populations that perished in Chesapeake Bay did so in waters where dissolved oxygen levels were so low that nothing could survive in depths greater than 20 feet. Unfortunately, that's where most of the oysters, clams, and other mollusks resided until the waters were fouled. As the health of the shellfish became more and more compromised from the lack of dissolved oxygen in the water, the parasites were able to take over and decimate what was left.

Currently, our illustrious state and federal governments have decided to wade into the waters where some industrious, out of work, watermen decided to raise and sell shellfish on their own. They were doing just fine until government intervention made it damned near impossible to get into shellfish aquaculture unless you first obtained a very expensive license, then underwent a hearing process that could take several years. This is supreme lunacy at it's very best. How would it be if we had to get an expensive license to grow tomatoes in our back yards? And, these shellfish aquaculture operations really go a long way in cleansing the surrounding waters by the filtration action of the shellfish as they feed and grow. It's a win/win situation for any body of water, but some supreme idiot decided we needed to study the effects, then stick it to the poor slob that was trying to find a new way to make a living and not harm the environment. INSANE!

So, those BC scallop draggers can kiss that fishery goodbye. It's just another part of fisheries exploitation history. Gee, I wonder if those guys would consider setting up a scallop aquaculture farm operation?

Sorry for the rant, but us old guys tend to do that,

Gary :cool:
 

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im not old but I basically agree with everything you said...

I hate it when studies are used and combined with biased organizations or made up bureacratic regulators etc...

btw about tomatoes...I had a friend in georgia who got fined big time simply "trading" produce he grew in his back yard...

made me sick...thinking about the "laws"
 
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