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I stand corrected that not all C&C 110 have the carbon fiber masts as that was only the PERFERRED option available at the time. Even though the one you see for sale does not, most of my firneds who own 110 or 115 including many in my C&C sailing club have the carbon fiber mast.

In terms of PHRF ratings I will stand by what I posted as I am using the PHRF determined by USPHRF Affiliated Fleets not the local or egional PHRF ratings of your area which can be greatly skewed by a few non skilled racers if there are not many of the type of sailboat ranked. The ratings I quoted are by the United States Sailing association, the sanctioning body for the regional associations which use a broader spectrum that the regional associations. That being said as Mid stated they are very close performance wise. In my small amount of racing on the Chessapeake the C&C 110 or 115 do not take a back seat to many and certainly none of the Bennetaus of comparable size and PHRF ratings. I beleive yhe hardware on the C&C us a small amunt superior.

Here is the link in case anyone ever wants to check their PHRF ratings

http://offshore.ussailing.org/Assets/Offshore/PHRF/Hi+Lo+Mean+Report+September+19+2011.pdf

Mid...I agree the cruising amenities are nicer on the 110 vs the 367 Bene First. The reason I would not look at the newer C&C is the quality control problems they have had since joining up with Tartan as well as their warrenty issues. I love the older ones ( obviously) just as I liked the older tartans ( pre 1998). When they both went to the epoxy process there were structural issues well documented along with a number of lawsuits which we are not allowed to discuss here on Sailnet which caused many reputable Sailnet members to leave this forum.

Dave
 

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I stand corrected that not all C&C 110 have the carbon fiber masts as that was only the PERFERRED option available at the time. Even though the one you see for sale does not, most of my firneds who own 110 or 115 including many in my C&C sailing club have the carbon fiber mast.

In terms of PHRF ratings I will stand by what I posted as I am using the PHRF determined by USPHRF Affiliated Fleets not the local or egional PHRF ratings of your area which can be greatly skewed by a few non skilled racers if there are not many of the type of sailboat ranked. The ratings I quoted are by the United States Sailing association, the sanctioning body for the regional associations which use a broader spectrum that the regional associations. That being said as Mid stated they are very close performance wise. In my small amount of racing on the Chessapeake the C&C 110 or 115 do not take a back seat to many and certainly none of the Bennetaus of comparable size and PHRF ratings. I beleive yhe hardware on the C&C us a small amunt superior.

Here is the link in case anyone ever wants to check their PHRF ratings

http://offshore.ussailing.org/Assets/Offshore/PHRF/Hi+Lo+Mean+Report+September+19+2011.pdf

Mid...I agree the cruising amenities are nicer on the 110 vs the 367 Bene First. The reason I would not look at the newer C&C is the quality control problems they have had since joining up with Tartan as well as their warrenty issues. I love the older ones ( obviously) just as I liked the older tartans ( pre 1998). When they both went to the epoxy process there were structural issues well documented along with a number of lawsuits which we are not allowed to discuss here on Sailnet which caused many reputable Sailnet members to leave this forum.

Dave
Yeah, Tartan certainly hurt themselves pretty badly with the way they handled at least that one problematic boat and perhaps others as well. I haven't heard of the same kinds of issues with C&C's despite the common ownership.

I do hope the current Tartan/C&C ownership is able to repair their reputation and return to turning out quality boats.

I too love the older Tartans (almost bought a 37, crewed on, and would love to own a 40) . Although I like the looks of the new ones, they would not be on my post lottery shopping list, mainly due to what I consider funky interiors (even if we ignore the possiblity of quality issues).
 

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The 367 you do have the potential to race 1d at races like the NOODs, where as the 110 there are not enough boats local to do so. If you want a potential 1d race, get a 115, there are enough of those.
Marty
There is no OD racing on the bay for the 115. I raced on one all last year, not enough boats. Those that have them, don't race too often.

The 367 is a dieing class for OD racing. This past year was evidence of that. OD racing on the Ches bay is growing thin, and its certainly the case for large boats.
 

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There is no OD racing on the bay for the 115. I raced on one all last year, not enough boats. Those that have them, don't race too often.

The 367 is a dieing class for OD racing. This past year was evidence of that. OD racing on the Ches bay is growing thin, and its certainly the case for large boats.

That sucks. I'd love to get 5 or 6 Pearson 30's together for a rumble.:cool:
 

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There is no OD racing on the bay for the 115. I raced on one all last year, not enough boats. Those that have them, don't race too often.

The 367 is a dieing class for OD racing. This past year was evidence of that. OD racing on the Ches bay is growing thin, and its certainly the case for large boats.
As C2S pointed out with the ratings of these boats, things depend upon the area. Neither the C&C 115 or B 36.7 class's have been strong here in puget sound, but both get a race or two ea year, as between boats here in the US side and BC side of the salish sea do get together at times.

But I would agree, bigger 1d racing seems to be dying out, probably due to cost more than anything.

For local, if one wants a 1d race, one is better of with a J105 or 109 at times. J30's sometimes get off 1d starts. There is also a level 72 group, which include Express 37's, J35, santana 35's and a few 36.7's squeak in too, as do 115's IIRC.

Marty
 

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beneteau 27.7 first

I deliverd a "beneteau 27 first" from Key West to Columbia and have become true believer in thier blue water capabilities. From Key West to Jamacia we we're taking on water from somewhere. It turned out to be through the rudder post well. The owners had put a five man life raft on the stern, weighting it down so the top of the rudder well was at water line. In heavy sea's, water would splash over the top. I reached in with my left hand and wrapped the well with a sheet of closed cell foam and 5200/ hose calmps and raised the top of the well a foot above the waterline. The vovlo penta water pump crapped out in Jamacia so I sailed from the dock in Port Antonio to the Club Nautico in Cartagenia with no engine. The last 200 miles where 15 to 20 foot sea's with 3 foot chop on top of them. That little boat was right at home in those conditions. If the 27 can handle it, the larger "First's" are only that much better!
 

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Discussion Starter #28
Thanks again to all. These posts have been a great help in my quest to find the right boat for me and my family.
 

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Beneteau 36.7's would be great for cruising. We pass them all the time.
I bet you pass them twice, usually on Sunday's, on your way out to the Bouy's, and on your way back to the marina as they head out to sea. Ofcourse, what do I know, all I've ever raced is the weather and sometimes the tide.
 

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We sailed a tiller 36.7 from the UK to the Med, and then 2500 miles around it last year.There are so many cruising boats in the Med loaded to the gunwhales with so called cruising stuff, but really you don't need it. You need a simple lightweight boat with a big easily reefed rig, 60M of chain and a good anchor winch. A First 36.7 does the job very well. At night when the wind drops to maybe 7kn we could still see 6, we had a good fridge, we had a small pv panel over the companionway hatch and we swam every day.
 

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A good friend and customer has one and I can run down what they like and the what could be better list. It is a really fun boat and what I consider a great value. They run a 110 dacron for cruising but also have a couple full set of exotic race sails.... We cruised with them for almost two weeks this summer so spent a lot of time listening to the likes & could be better's.

Keep in mind their primary purchase decision for this boat was a OD or PHRF boat to race, that could also be cruised. They accept the compromises and much of the could be better points are already being addressed..

Likes:
Great sailing boat with great sail control
Harken MK-IV furler
Lazy Jacks (a recently added must-do)
Layout down below
Good sized cockpit
Draft - Means really great pointing
Speed - great cruiser / racer
Light air performance
Traveler - One of the best main sheet trimming systems out there
Space - For a relatively narrow beam boat a great use of space
Speed, speed, speed...
Aesthetics - She's a nice looking boat in a contemporary way
Ventilation - Excellent ventilation with hatches & opening ports
Ultraleather interior cushions, with kids, makes for easy clean up
Synthetic "teak & holly" sole is very durable

Could Be Better:

Battery Capacity -required custom work to fit a cruising capacity
They do not fit in v-berth he is 6' 3"
Aft cabins are used for adults and v-berth for kids
Hull grid-liner makes keeping bilge dry a PITA
Head Access behind center-line table can be a pita if people are sitting to port.
Draft - The boat has too much draft to bring home in the winter something they had planned on. Requires an additional $800-$1000 to get it home in permits and a special trailer with pads tall enough.
Boom height - They are trying to add a dodger for cruising but it is not an easy option with the low boom height
Keel - the nearly vertical keel has been a pot buoy & weed catcher
Galley - while workable the wife wishes it to be just a bit bigger, especially oven (loves sink though)
Lack of a decent sized lazarette means the starboard aft cabin becomes the "garage"..
No lifeline gate - tough for a mooring sailed boat with launch service
Dinghy access off stern/stern ladder a PITA for the kids
Emergency tiller access is a continual tripping hazard behind the wheel
Tim rubs his head on backstay (adjuster) when standing at wheel
Only 14 DC breakers he wishes he had room for expansion
Holding tank is very small and pick up tube broke off on delivery trip from Nova Scotia making pump out impossible.
Anchor handling / bow roller, as in non-existent.
Storage - on the very light side
Leaks - A few pesky leaks that have not been identified or found yet


I also work on a C&C 110 and find find them pretty comparable boats to the 36.7 with a bit better cruising edge.. The C&C has a better fit & finish, more robust build, more storage, similar hardware a larger galley and bigger aft cabin. It also has an aft head. The C&C 110 I find is a NOISY boat at anchor with hull slap that drives me bonkers just working on her. She is very "echoey" but certainly not to the level of a race boat like the Sydney 38.. The C&C uses 93 Series Mareon seacocks and the cheap ball valve on a thru-hull Beneteau seacocks you could not pay me to have on my own vessel. The C&C also has a better executed electrical system with over 20 DC breakers and at least 6AC breakers. Both boats have Volvo's (really a Perkins/Shibaura) which is a negative for a lot of sailors...
 

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As mentioned we've spent quite a bit of time on a 36.7, and I would agree mostly with MS's assessment above, esp for cruising. It's a shame the tiller version is not available more in North America.. it avoids the clutter and backstay interference issue mentioned above, and also with the optional cockpit 'deck boxes' that fill the "T" cockpit spaces (for the wheel) deck storage is much improved and the lack of a real lazarette less of an issue - although the one we were on did have a pretty good, deep lazarette aft of the stbd aft cabin.. enough to stow an 8 HP outboard vertically along with several fenders.

The plumb bow has presented the biggest difficulty anchoring - or more truthfully - retrieving the anchor. Given that they often do this in tradewind conditions they have to be pretty adept and quick once the anchor breaks the surface to avoid dragging it up the stem itself. They do not use a windlass - which would likely be too slow in any event. They keep some sternway on to keep the anchor somewhat away from the boat during the pickup. They also work very hard to anchor in 7M or less depths...

Agree that accessing the head can be difficult, and despite the 'open transom' the (normally bolted down) stern seat gets in the way for climbing in and out of dinghies. C&C's 'swingaway' stern seat makes more sense. I'm not a big fan of Beneteau's 'Lego' pattern nonskid, esp if spending time barefoot.

Have sailed a bit on the C&C 110 and 115 and found the 36.7 a tad quicker to get up to speed esp. on a beat, but both are spirited performers.
 
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I used to teach on one, and have raced a couple. Great light air boat.

Agree with MS and Faster.

Some additional concerns.

The mid-cockpit traveler left several bruises on my shins - I must be a slow learner.

The shelf storage is poor. The locker door serves as the shelf edge, stuff falls off the windward side when you open the storage shelf.

Boarding is a PITA. Huge wheel gets in the way when boarding from the stern. High freeboard hard on my old knees when boarding from dockside.

Have also some a C&C. It is more comfortable, but the galley sink is a huge disaster - why is it not divided into two sinks.
 

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.....C&C. It is more comfortable, but the galley sink is a huge disaster - why is it not divided into two sinks.
Yeah - that one amazes me too.. it would take 1/3 of my water tank to fill that sink.. crazy and unnecessary.
 

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Two comments. There is a shoal draft version but it's rare. Second, there were two interiors offered - one with a large aft berth and another with two small equal sized aft berths. The first was popular in the US and the second in Europe.

I considered the 36.7 when I was looking for a mid 30-foot performance cruiser. If I had come across a shoal draft version at the right price I might have bought it.

The J109 is another (pricier) competitor to the 36.7.
 

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Hey,

As I was reading MS's review I was thinking how that compares to my C&C 110. Then I chuckled when he did the comparison for me.

The C&C has a great rear swim / boarding platform that makes getting onboard from a dinghy easy. The 36.7 requires you to climb up the transom and step over the seat. Not easy to do and very difficult to get gear aboard. The 36.7 with the two aft cabins seems silly to me. Both cabins are too small to be really useful, unless you have two people who insist on their own cabin. I cruise my 110 for a few days with 4 guys and everyone gets their own berth (but not a cabin) and no one complains about a lack of privacy (how much privacy can you expect on a 36' boat anyway?).

The galley in my boat has a double sink (and hot + cold water, 2 burner propane stove and oven, large refrigerator that runs on 12VDC). I have enough storage, etc.

I think 'cruising' for a week or two would be fine but I don't think it's the right boat for living aboard full time.

Barry
 

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Hey,

As I was reading MS's review I was thinking how that compares to my C&C 110. Then I chuckled when he did the comparison for me.

The C&C has a great rear swim / boarding platform that makes getting onboard from a dinghy easy. The 36.7 requires you to climb up the transom and step over the seat. Not easy to do and very difficult to get gear aboard. The 36.7 with the two aft cabins seems silly to me. Both cabins are too small to be really useful, unless you have two people who insist on their own cabin. I cruise my 110 for a few days with 4 guys and everyone gets their own berth (but not a cabin) and no one complains about a lack of privacy (how much privacy can you expect on a 36' boat anyway?).

The galley in my boat has a double sink (and hot + cold water, 2 burner propane stove and oven, large refrigerator that runs on 12VDC). I have enough storage, etc.

I think 'cruising' for a week or two would be fine but I don't think it's the right boat for living aboard full time.

Barry
And yet.. we know a young couple doing just that, they've lived aboard for years and recently moved up to a 110 from a 32 footer. They are quite happy with it.
 

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I think 'cruising' for a week or two would be fine but I don't think it's the right boat for living aboard full time.

Barry
My C&C 110 customer cruises his pretty extensively as does my friend Bill who has a 36.7 as well as Tim who also cruises his 36.7 with a wife and two kids. It is surprisingly doable on the 110 & 36.7 with the typical idiosyncrasies you'll find on just about any boat.

I would not live on a 36 foot anything as a live aboard but that's just me. :wink
 
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