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B'Causeican
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Discussion Starter #1
Hi, I am new to this forum. Looking to buy my first sailboat. Have my eye on a C & C 99, 2003 with 6'.5" keel. Does anyone have an opin on this model/boat? Also, wondering why there is no owner comments or forums on this mass-produced C & C? Thanks - Spec
 

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These are nice, performance-oriented racer/cruisers. I've only been aboard them at the shows, but I've read very favorable owner comments in a number of places -- I thought there were some here on Sailnet so it might be worth using the "advanced search" function to see what you can come up with.

I have also read of some "issues", on a limited number of examples of certain newer (epoxy) Tartan/C&C models. You should be able to find more info on that subject if you google "Tartan problems". My understanding is that these problems showed up pretty quickly on the boats that had them, so it is more an issue of warranty remedy than a question of problems that might show up later down the road. Boat/US had a recent article (January 2009?) that would shed some light.

So definitely get a good survey, and have your surveyor review the discussions of "issues" that your research generates, and then check the boat carefully with that info in mind.
 

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Love the 99 and almost bought one but got a new 3400 instead. Love the 3400 but now looking to get a larger Tartan or maybe a 115. I know a few 115 owners and they all have good things to say.

There appears to be a negative feeding frenzy going on in the forums about new Tartan/C&C products but I'm certainly not one of them. Great boats.
 

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B'Causeican
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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks

Camaraderie - I appreciate the detailed info and history you provided. I would be very interested in seeing the complete string you referred to. Can you post here? If [email protected] I knew there had to be something as to why Tartan/C&C info was non-existent in the forums. The C&C 99 I'm looking at is a 2003. It appears to be in very good shape. Do you have insight as to the tell-tale signs of a poorly constructed C & C?

Thanks.

Spec
 

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The link to the complete document is in the link I gave you or you may go to
Trans-Asian Axis

to directly download either the short or long version of the thread.

To be clear...I am only aware of a very few boats out of many hundreds which have claimed issues. There are other significant issues besides build quality which have been my primary focus but I must refrain from speaking of them here.
 

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thread.

To be clear...I am only aware of a very few boats out of many hundreds which have claimed issues.
So net net a couple of boats have had problems and some folks feel they need to pick a part a vendor.

Let's get real - every manufacture has issues.

Spec -- Look at the boat you like -- if it surveys OK and you are comfortable with where C&C/Tartan are at from a corporate standpoint make your own decision.. don't rely on the chat board web hype.. there is lots of that on this mfg on this particular board :hothead

I have no vested interest in any of the manufactures or brands or people.. just a tired observer of watching a vendor flamed for no real documented and provable issue that spans multiple boats..
 

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Jon...you are DEAD wrong. Read the thread. Read the court cases. Read the mfr. lawsuits. Read the Osha and Workmens comp fines and judgements. A company is MORE than its' products alone. Yeah...there are some flames...this is the internet. But there is a pile of documented data and DECIDED court cases that is unprecedented as well. Read the thread...discard anything you think is not factual and digest the rest. Then tell me Spec should simply trust the marketing hype.
 

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B'Causeican
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Discussion Starter #9
C&C 99 owners opinions cont....

I appreciate everyone's info and feedback. Its a bit disheartening to read the string about the mismanagement of this venerable brand. I suppose its no different than Chrysler or GM these days. Purchasing a boat is a difficult decision and I'd hope that a company would be there to stand behind its products. A bad purchase decision made on a boat has great implications and its far more difficult to sell a boat than a car should an owner decide he's made the wrong choice. svsirius makes a good point in his/her response. Its buyer beware. So....I've got more research to do before I go forward. Be back soon with my progress.
 

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cap'n chronic
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Jon...you are DEAD wrong. Read the thread. Read the court cases. Read the mfr. lawsuits. Read the Osha and Workmens comp fines and judgements. A company is MORE than its' products alone. Yeah...there are some flames...this is the internet. But there is a pile of documented data and DECIDED court cases that is unprecedented as well. Read the thread...discard anything you think is not factual and digest the rest. Then tell me Spec should simply trust the marketing hype.
sorry, but what does any of that have to do with buying a 2003?
 

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I have followed this and other stories for the past 6 months.........and also have dealt with the service end of the C&C factory and haven't had any issues to date.

To those looking at purchasing boats, and in particular check out an owners group on sailing networks............I know there is an excellent C&C 110 group and the guys over there will be happy to answer any questions about the boats, there dealings or anything else you might want to know about.

Hope this is helpful, it was for me:)
 

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sorry, but what does any of that have to do with buying a 2003?
Perhaps the transferable 15 year hull warranty would have something to do with it....it still has 9 years left. Perhaps Mr. Vito's experience and Giulietta's personal inspection would encourage one to have the surveyor check a few things extra carefully before investing. I think I went out of my way to say that I think the overwhelming and vast majority are fine...but you should do due diligence in buying one.
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Alymatt...I would suggest that owners groups are often NOT the best place to find out info on a boat as we all tend to love our boats and speak of them highly and overlook or minimize their deficiencies. Some owners groups are supported or hosted by the manufacturer and can really get distorted. Owners groups serve some really good purposes...but I would rely more on independent reviews, forum discussions and FORMER owners opinions when making a purchase of any boat.
 

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I know of 5 C&C boats (seen 2 with my eyes) 2 on a private email, and a new one last week, of the new batch, that have cracked.

That I am aware of, only one was repaired by C&C, but the repair failed too.

Apparently, guarantee issues are dealt by the dealers, THAT don't want to repair the boats..because it's structural. I asked the deaaler in Chicago, in the presence of another memeber here, and he said guarantees are dealt by the dealers..the problem is this is more than cosmetics, and the dealers can't do much..sad but true

TO me, 5 cracked boats is 4 too much on a 200.000 Dollar investment.
 

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B'Causeican
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Discussion Starter #14
Friends.....While I agree there are problems.....there are problems with every manufacturer these days. Dehler, Alerion, etc. I'm not setting the bar too high in terms of dealing with the factory given your comments but I have spoken to Tartan/C&C three times about this boat. They were quite helpful in discussing issues & concerns. I'm going to make an offer on this 99. Its avail at a very fair price (which is in my range) and looks to be in great shape. It'll be pending survey and sea trial of course. Appreciate everyone's comments. Wish me luck!
 

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cap'n chronic
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I think your making the right decision. I think the 99 is an awesome boat.
good luck with the purchase and hope to see some pics of the boat once you get it.

chris.
 

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C&c 99 -

Spec 2 I would like to know your experience so far. I too am looking at a used 99. Seems like a great boat but I came across all the chatter out here. I have read all the posts (even the deleted ones!) and I appreciate the efforts of those who are following this.
The 99 seems to me to be the perfect boat design though I wish it did not have a saildrive. The equipment is top notch - serious sized winches and carbon fiber mast/pole. I am not too concerned about the financial state of the manufacturer - most hull warranties from other manufacturers have expired on a 4 year old boat.
The 2005 I am looking at has a Yanmar sail drive - a new drive the owner replaced last year. It worries me that it failed but that's a Yanmar issue not a C&C issue.
Any comments you can add would be appreciated!
 

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I'm surprised that such a reputable engine builder such as Yanmar are having so many difficulties with their saildrives. I'm with Pearle, I'd go with the shaft drive, too bad its not available on the 99.
 

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B'Causeican
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Discussion Starter #19
C & C 99

Hi Pearle99 - Our 99 is pretty much factory stock. We have the deep 6.5 keel tho. The boat points very well. In a 15kt wind with full sails, she'll heel over which can cause loss of helm. A quick turn into to wind resolves, but that was a bit scary the first few times. She needs to be reefed in anything more. The hardware on the boat is solid. Our boat was on the hard over a year and we had no mechanical issues at all this year. Our Volvo Saildrive is hard to start if it sits for over a week, but beyond that, I really like the system. I've been told the rubber ring sealing the engine needs to be replaced every 7-8 years. I guess I'm due soon. I like the saildrive system vs shaft. No water in the bilge period. Better reverse and no sideways thrust. Re performance....I'm a little surprised the boat isn't much faster given the sail area. We get 7.5-8kts max on Narragansett Bay in a 15-18kt blow. But she is a lot heavier than lets say a J Boat. Probably more stable as well. Down below, fit and finish is just ok. Its not a condo as you're probably aware. The doors on my bulkhead won't close as things have shifted and/or swelled. I'll be fixing that over the winter. Re the company....they were actually quite helpful when I was purchasing. They reviewed the boat with me via pics I provided. They answer the phone, return calls and were helpful with parts when needed. Can't complain. I do hope they can right the ship in Fairport. Its always nice to have a strong manufacturer behind you. I hope this info helps.
 

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Hi Spec2 - glad to hear your received good service. I read in some earlier posts where C&C offered carbon fibre masts to those that bought earlier aluminum models at bargain basement pricing. Makes me think they are a good company facing some challenging times. Thanks for clarifying the performance of the boat - I guess with all that sail area she heels easier than a cruiser. The speed is what I would expect (in fact I think it is pretty good for a 32 footer!) I believe you are at the theoretical maximum hull speed up around 8 - from what little I know you need a bigger boat to go faster.
I too was really happy to see a nearly dry, very clean bilge - in this one a 1/2 cup of rain water was all (it comes in down the mast).
Thanks again for your reply!
 
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