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Discussion Starter #1
I've got a leak in the fuel system on my Pearson 39. The engine is a Westerbeke 4-107. After taking off and replacing the copper washers on the injector line I thought was leaking, it appears that the injector pump itself is leaking. It's a 1974 engine and the pump looks to be original. The prices for a new pump are pretty high, so I was wondering if anyone had any experience with repairing a fuel pump or having it rebuilt.

Thanks,
Alex
 

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Discussion Starter #2
One more thing I forgot to ask. Since the leak is just seeping out of somewhere and then dripping from the lowest point on the pump, I'm not 100% sure where the leak is originating. Are there any tricks for pinpointing the location of the leak?
 

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Larus Marinus
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Clean it and puff talcum powder on it, then run it, this might show a trace of where the oil originates.

You need to talk to a diesel engineer - in the US it may be too expensive to refurbish, and it's about the most expensive part on a diesel, in India it might not be.
 

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From bitter experience. Fuel leaks can be as hard to track down as cabin top drips. Don't rule ANYTHING out. Loosen and retighten all connections.Then go back and do it again.
 

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Been there

Axle,

I had to have the I-P on my Perkins 4-108 rebuilt. I finally traced the leak back to the throttle shaft, but that entailed a fairly long stretch with a drop light in one hand, a rag in the other, and my head next to the idling engine (hint -- think abour EAR PLUGS before you get all contorted into position so you can eyeball the pump.)

I found that rebuild kits are fairly inexpensive, but elected to let the pros do the work. It wasn't cheap, but it was still a lot cheaper than a rebuilt pump. I lucked out in that there was a good shop not too far away that did the work.

Something else to think about as long as the beast will be out of commission -- injectors. If they've been in there a while, you may as well throw a little love their way as well. Relatively cheap and easy to have them cleaned and put back into A-1 condition before you try out that new pump.

Best of luck,
PF
 

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Discussion Starter #6
PorFin: I spent the weekend all contorted trying to track down the leak. They certainly like to put things in places that seem pretty impossible to get a wrench on them. I'll need to train my 8yr old to work on the engine. He'd probably fit better :) I think the Perkins 4-108 is similar to the Westerbeke 4-107. Any tips on how to get the injector pump out if I need to? It looks like it's on with three bolts. I can reach two of them, but the third looks like it's buried against the engine.

Before I do that I'll try some of the other suggestions about talcum powder and tightning EVERYTHING. There's one injector line on the far side that I couldn't get too, so that's probably the one that's leaking LOL. How likely is it that the pump itself is leaking, not one of the connections? The engine runs fine as is, but fuel is dripping at a rate of about 1 drop every 3 seconds.
 

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moderate?
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Thanks everyone for the help. I ended up getting the injector pump out and shipped off to TAD. They were very helpful and got the pump back quickly. Got it re-installed and the engine running without leaks right before leaving on a week long cruise over Christmas.
 

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Re: Fuel Injector Pump

My boat is a 1978 Columbia 8.3. I've been boating only 3 years now. The engine is a Universal M4-30. The injector pump is not pumping. Am trying to find specs. online. Everyone says to have an expert rebuild a bad pump, it's too difficult for an amateur. I have the pump off the engine now and pretty much have to repair it myself due to financial considerations. Does anyone know anything about this pump? Where to find schematics if nothing else? Would be very grateful for any info. Thanks.
 

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the pointy end is the bow
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The engine is a Universal M4-30. The injector pump is not pumping
Was this all of a sudden or was there a degradation in performance? Did you troubleshoot the fuel supply lines to make sure it wasn't sucking air somewhere? A lot of fuel delivery problems with diesels are associated with not getting the fuel to the injector pump in the first place. I have my fingers crossed for you that you injector pump is not the problem.
 

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There was a degradation in performance. I knew air was being sucked in but could not find the source. I had replaced all fuel lines some 8 weeks previously and all was well, and then uneven revving up and down for some time and then sudden death. No restart. Found I had good fuel pressure up to the pump, but none after the pump. In removing injector lines I discovered number 3 fitting (don't know the proper term, but it was the 3rd fitting north that line was attached to) was loose, not screwed down tight. Vibrated loose, maybe? That's where air was being sucked in. Removed pump yesterday and today learned that of the four cylinders or four pumps that make up the pump, the two center ones are froze up. It's my understanding that if air or water gets in the
cylinder or shaft, the tolerances are so fine, that without the constant lubrication of the diesel fuel, the plunger will become scored and freeze up.
I learned today that I need to clean the housing thoroughly with an air compressor, like pressure wash it thoroughly to remove all grime, work in a dust and dirt- free room on a clean surface (like white freezer paper), remove the side panel and go in and see what I can find and then go from there.
 

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Ray, thank you for your response. I am also communicating with a shrimper who knows diesels and am learning as I go. I see the problem as a challenge and as an opportunity to become a better sailor. It's my first serious issue with the engine in my boat, and I want to learn everything I can so that I can keep my engine running well and can get it running again when it stops. There is much to learn.
 

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Tartan 27' owner
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You can try rebuilding the pump but Erps doesn't think that you will have much luck. I hope you do.

You can also look up the Kubota engine block # as in: History of the Universal Motor Company 4

From the link: "The Model M4-30, also called the Atomic Four diesel, a 52 cu in, 25 hp, 4 cylinder, based on the Kubota Y-850 block, was built from 1988 to 1997. Approximately 470 were sold. The Model M4-30 was offered as a diesel replacement for the original Atomic Four gasoline engine. It was similar to its namesake, since it was a 4 cylinder model weighing slightly less (122 kg / 270 lb as opposed to the original’s 150 kg / 330 lb with reduction drive - the M4-30 was only offered with a reduction drive) and generating slightly less power (18.6 kW / 25 hp at 3,600 rpm as opposed to the original’s 22 kW / 30 hp at 3,500 rpm) with a smaller displacement (850 cc / 52 cu in as opposed to the original’s 1,065 cc / 65 cu in)."

The point I am not making is that with the Kubota engine block number AND a tractor model you can find the same pump for a lot less at a Kubota dealer. Maybe not the same exact pump but it will work for a good while.
 

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the pointy end is the bow
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There was a degradation in performance. I knew air was being sucked in but could not find the source.
I just went through something similar this spring. My motor was taking a long time to get started. It was losing its fuel prime. I also had fuel weeping around the top of the injector pump. It turned out to be the o-rings around the fuel injector nozzles. I was able to repair it without removing the pump by just pulling each fuel injector barrel, replacing the o-ring and a little copper washer gasket. I got lucky. We have a very knowledgeable diesel pump repair shop in the area who told me it was a common problem with old Volvo diesels.
 

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Thanks to you both for the great information. Am about to begin dismantling the pump. If no interruptions I hope to know more soon.
 

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The pump is pretty much dismantled and in pieces. Found 3 broken springs in 3 of the 4 chambers, and still have the head pieces of one of the plungers still up in the chamber, stuck. Will have to find tiny needle-nosed pliers to get a hold of it and try to pull it out (tweezers don't grab tight enough to get a good hold). Soaking in diesel now. Wanted to give update to those interested. Am thinking that if I can find the proper replacement springs, and if the head pieces of that stuck plunger are not damaged, and if I didn't score or scar the chamber walls removing the parts, and a few other "ifs", then I just might be able to put this thing back together and make it work. Any information on replacement parts or rebuild kits, etc. would certainly be welcome. Thanks.
 

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Dwight,

You may want to think about first using compressed air instead the needle-nosed pliers -- much less likely to scratch/score the bores...
 

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Thanks, Erps. I got the plunger unstuck by removing top of chamber and going in from the top. I placed a socket on the stuck plunger head and tapped it lightly and it dropped out the bottom of the chamber. Order four new springs from a diesel injection specialist shop, who informed me that my particular pump does not have a rebuild kit. He said he could not quote me a price to rebuild it because he would have to take it apart and see what all it needed. I replied that I've already done that and there are 3 broken springs. He said he would have to do it himself in order to quote me a price. He said I was asking for trouble because the pump would have to be calibrated after being rebuilt. I asked how much that would cost, and he said he couldn't say because he would have to rebuild it himself in order to calibrate it. He said I would have to take certain measurements according to the specs (which he said there was no way I could get) in order to attempt to calibrate it. I can't see where any measurements of any kind are called for. All the pieces go back together again in only one way, the way they came out. I don't see anything to measure or calculate. Am I missing something crucial? I ordered four new springs from him anyway which were 8 dollars apiece, and freight was $20.00 more from Wisconsin to Florida. Am I asking for more serious engine damage, as he said, if I put the pump back together and reinstall it without paying him an unknown figure to rebuilt & calibrate it?
 
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