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Well, good luck. My brother worked as Cheif Engineer and I Captain together in the passenger buisiness for several years. We did booze cruises and deliveries together. We had bigger plans, but then I had kids and he had kids. We had some fun though.
 

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Discussion Starter · #62 ·
Well, good luck. My brother worked as Cheif Engineer and I Captain together in the passenger buisiness for several years. We did booze cruises and deliveries together. We had bigger plans, but then I had kids and he had kids. We had some fun though.
Ya know that could be an option. Justoffer some cruises and handle some deliveries to some of the villages. That sounds like a cool business to be apart of with your brother.
 

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Discussion Starter · #63 ·
Well, good luck. My brother worked as Cheif Engineer and I Captain together in the passenger buisiness for several years. We did booze cruises and deliveries together. We had bigger plans, but then I had kids and he had kids. We had some fun though.
If you don't mind me picking your brains a little, you seem very knowledgeable. Looking at ships right now there are many luxury yachts, old motor sail schooners for very reasonable prices. Lets say I wasn't worried that everything had to be "green". I'm also a diesel mechanic anyhow. Do you think this could be a more reasonable industry especially if we focused more on passenger expeditions to some of the islands? I'm Sure I could make a small supply business bringing materials to island and coastal villages (that rely on meager air supplies) while taking passengers on a several day cruise. Custom expeditions could also be considered.
 

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Very knowledgeable might be a stretch.

But it is a business I have worked in in both Canada and the US.

My sentiment stated early on is that I think it is very unlikely that you could compete with current freight operations from either a profit or a carbon footprint perspective.

Carrying passengers is a different game entirely. I think there are markets that can be tapped into.

Day tours are just about volume. You need enough people walking the dock that are willing to pay $20, 30, 50 a head to go in a day tour, see whales etc.

But if you can really sell the eco tourism side. Might get some where.
 

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Discussion Starter · #65 ·
Very knowledgeable might be a stretch.

But it is a business I have worked in in both Canada and the US.

My sentiment stated early on is that I think it is very unlikely that you could compete with current freight operations from either a profit or a carbon footprint perspective.

Carrying passengers is a different game entirely. I think there are markets that can be tapped into.

Day tours are just about volume. You need enough people walking the dock that are willing to pay $20, 30, 50 a head to go in a day tour, see whales etc.

But if you can really sell the eco tourism side. Might get some where.
Again more good advice. Thanks again! I actually looked into a ship building company that have contacted me back stating they are working on eco designed ships they will sell for these very purposes and at different stages in the build to offer customers more reasonable prices by allowing them to fit accommodations to it themselves. They are hoping to standardize the design and then begin a mass production system in order to reduce costs. They are trying to build the ships as eco friendly as possible too. Worth looking into further in the future when I hope to start actually looking for a ship.
 

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I may have missed it if you mentioned, but how much open ocean sailing/maritime experience do you have? Or your potential sibling crew? Or are you considering hiring a professionally trained mariner(s)? This could influence the decision of potential shippers.

UnreIated, but since you mentioned it more than once: I expect you‘ve heard this, but you are likely to find the ambition, drive, and discipline to become an Officer of Marines (if thats what you intend, or even in another service) and then the work to become an aviator will be a singular focus for quite a while in order to be successful. Your prior enlisted service will help in some tangible and intangible ways but don't take it for granted or squander it. Having a side dream like this eco-shipping idea is good; that little something always in the back of your mind that you can consistently research, develop, and cultivate. Best of luck on both endeavors.
 

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Discussion Starter · #67 · (Edited)
I've pondered the very same, sail cargo .
I've casually studied sailing cargo operations that are currently working and solvent.
As well as had the opportunity to live on an offshore island that depended on everything arriving by boat.
The issues I found were competing with established diesel freight hauling boats and addressing the reality of unreliable wind conditions and the resulting possible delays and inconsistency in delivery times.
My preliminary conclusions are,
You'll need to determine the vessel choice/ size/ draft, etc. To accommodate the paying freight you've found to haul and the waters you'll be operating in.
For example, if you're planning on hauling in the Chesapeake, shallow draft would be a consideration.
Or if upon rivers or inland, overhead clearance or the ability to lower the mast(s).
But the freight would be the first thing. And then choose the vessel to fit.
[/QU
I may have missed it if you mentioned, but how much open ocean sailing/maritime experience do you have? Or your potential sibling crew? Or are you considering hiring a professionally trained mariner(s)? This could influence the decision of potential shippers.

UnreIated, but since you mentioned it more than once: I expect you‘ve heard this, but you are likely to find the ambition, drive, and discipline to become an Officer of Marines (if thats what you intend, or even in another service) and then the work to become an aviator will be a singular focus for quite a while in order to be successful. Your prior enlisted service will help in some tangible and intangible ways but don't take it for granted or squander it. Having a side dream like this eco-shipping idea is good; that little something always in the back of your mind that you can consistently research, develop, and cultivate. Best of luck on both endeavors.
 

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Just fair warning. Nothing can take the romance out of a business faster than a paying customer who has higher expectations than the owner's dreams. Once you involve passengers, you introduce variable expectations for everything from service to accommodations to food and even some who can never be happy. Wake up having a bad day? Too bad, put a smile on and kiss your customers butts all day. Not to mention licenses, insurance, inspections, etc. Just offering this so you plan for it.

I've seen several operations that rely on the charitable approach. Just this past season, I saw a big wooden brigantine, which was used by a fringe church to reportedly teach sailing and repair skills. Another was a big catamaran that was custom built to allow for disabled crew and passengers. A wheel chair would fit down the side decks.

In both cases, their websites made it obvious they had multi-million dollar benefactors.
 
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Discussion Starter · #69 · (Edited)
Just fair warning. Nothing can take the romance out of a business faster than a paying customer who has higher expectations than the owner's dreams. Once you involve passengers, you introduce variable expectations for everything from service to accommodations to food and even some who can never be happy. Wake up having a bad day? Too bad, put a smile on and kiss your customers butts all day. Not to mention licenses, insurance, inspections, etc. Just offering this so you plan for it.

I've seen several operations that rely on the charitable approach. Just this past season, I saw a big wooden brigantine, which was used by a fringe church to reportedly teach sailing and repair skills. Another was a big catamaran that was custom built to allow for disabled crew and passengers. A wheel chair would fit down the side decks.

In both cases, their websites made it obvious they had multi-million dollar benefactors.
 

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Alaska's a different game from what I see
All I'm saying is that customers are not always happy or see things eye to eye, regardless of what they're buying. Not all Mercedes buyers, not all Chevy buyers, not all Used beater buyers.
 

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Discussion Starter · #71 ·
I see what you are saying now about ungrateful customers taking the romance out of the business. I learned along time ago you can't make everyone happy, just have to have tough skin, it's the way it goes.
 

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Just fair warning. Nothing can take the romance out of a business faster than a paying customer who has higher expectations than the owner's dreams. Once you involve passengers, you introduce variable expectations for everything from service to accommodations to food and even some who can never be happy. Wake up having a bad day? Too bad, put a smile on and kiss your customers butts all day. Not to mention licenses, insurance, inspections, etc. Just offering this so you plan for it.

I've seen several operations that rely on the charitable approach. Just this past season, I saw a big wooden brigantine, which was used by a fringe church to reportedly teach sailing and repair skills. Another was a big catamaran that was custom built to allow for disabled crew and passengers. A wheel chair would fit down the side decks.

In both cases, their websites made it obvious they had multi-million dollar benefactors.
Very good point! Cargo doesn't complain, whine or get seasick.
 

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Cargo doesn't complain, whine or get seasick.
Ha! So true. Or “airsick” when it comes to aviation…

OP, not to keep splitting the subject, but keep in mind that regardless of the service, at least for the Marine Corps, you don't earn your commission and your wings and then go right to the reserves. You are going to serve quite a few years back on active duty so that the service recoups their investment in your aviation training. Just keep that in mind as you work your various COAs for life’s timelines. Also, do you have your degree yet or working on it? Your thoughtful ambition seems right for studying business, naval architecture/engineering, or another discipline that might both inform and compliment your idea, given time is on your side as you start looking into this.
 

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Very good point! Cargo doesn't complain, whine or get seasick.

Actually the whine does get seasick... and turns into Madeira! 🤣 😂 🤣 😂 🤣 😂 🤣


Mark
 

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I learned along time ago you can't make everyone happy, just have to have tough skin
That's perhaps the right attitude to start with. However, you'll also need to skills (and tons of energy) to turn them around, as every disgruntled customer will talk ten more out of doing business with you, even if they're wrong.
 

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You might want to visit the San Diego Maritime Museum and visit the Clipper ship they have there to read the story of how the owners tried to survive when the world was entering the age of steam. I admire your spirit but there is much to learn from history.
 

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Discussion Starter · #77 ·
Ha! So true. Or “airsick” when it comes to aviation…

OP, not to keep splitting the subject, but keep in mind that regardless of the service, at least for the Marine Corps, you don't earn your commission and your wings and then go right to the reserves. You are going to serve quite a few years back on active duty so that the service recoups their investment in your aviation training. Just keep that in mind as you work your various COAs for life’s timelines. Also, do you have your degree yet or working on it? Your thoughtful ambition seems right for studying business, naval architecture/engineering, or another discipline that might both inform and compliment your idea, given time is on your side as you start looking into this.
I understand, I know how it works. I'm going active duty regardless. This post was strictly because I had an idea and wanted opinions on feasibility. This is a future project. I will have completed my degree in aviation technology in the spring and hope to have my marine conservation degree afterwards in a few years.
 

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I was naive in my vehicle description. The ship I will be looking for or to build would be a cargo schooner capable of at least 50 tonnes that can be used for day tours and long term expeditions all based on A loose schedule..have the cargo holds be able to turn into birthing if necessary. No need to worry about my capitol or how I will pay or if it's a good idea or not. This thread is simply to get ideas on the kind of ship I would look into and if anyone has any ship builders/designers they could turn me onto. Thanks.
I read most of this and skimmed through the rest. Very interesting and most of the advice is good. However, I noticed no one mentioned the Jones Act or anything about inspected commercial vessels. This would definitely have to comply with the US Coast Guard rules for inspected vessels. It is very difficult for a vessel that is being converted from recreational to commercial to meet the rules. It is far easier, and often less expensive, to design and build to the rules from the beginning. Also, If you decide to include passengers, especially if you carry more than six, there are more rules that apply.

The Jones ACT applies to vessels used in coastal trade, that is trade between two ports in the US. The vessel has to built in the US. Simple? Not really. There have been some exception made, but this is another thing you need to look into and talk to the Coast Guard about. You need to contact the nearest Coast Guard Sector, most likely Sector Anchorage and talk to the folks in Marine Safety. You need to do this before you go ahead and spend any money on this because if you wait, afterwards it could become a lot more expensive. https://www.pacificarea.uscg.mil/Our-Organization/District-17/17th-District-Units/Sector-Anchorage/ or you can talk to the Coast Guard Marine Safety Center. https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Our-Organi...ns-standards-CG-5PS/Marine-Safety-Center-MSC/

BTW I think it is a good idea if implemented the right way. There are quite a few people already doing this, especially in the Northeast US. You could fill a niche market that currently no one fills, a relatively inexpensive way to move goods in an area that is woefully underserved, No roads, no trains, very little shipping. Only aircraft. And with fossil fuels getting outrageously expensive and being phased out in some sectors, this is definitely going to be the future. Actually it is the original "green" mode of transport, since sailing vessels have been used for thousands of years.

By the way that's Berthing not birthing. LOL a whole different thing. Your spell check must not be working.
 

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Discussion Starter · #79 ·
I read most of this and skimmed through the rest. Very interesting and most of the advice is good. However, I noticed no one mentioned the Jones Act or anything about inspected commercial vessels. This would definitely have to comply with the US Coast Guard rules for inspected vessels. It is very difficult for a vessel that is being converted from recreational to commercial to meet the rules. It is far easier, and often less expensive, to design and build to the rules from the beginning. Also, If you decide to include passengers, especially if you carry more than six, there are more rules that apply.

The Jones ACT applies to vessels used in coastal trade, that is trade between two ports in the US. The vessel has to built in the US. Simple? Not really. There have been some exception made, but this is another thing you need to look into and talk to the Coast Guard about. You need to contact the nearest Coast Guard Sector, most likely Sector Anchorage and talk to the folks in Marine Safety. You need to do this before you go ahead and spend any money on this because if you wait, afterwards it could become a lot more expensive. https://www.pacificarea.uscg.mil/Our-Organization/District-17/17th-District-Units/Sector-Anchorage/ or you can talk to the Coast Guard Marine Safety Center. https://www.dco.uscg.mil/Our-Organi...ns-standards-CG-5PS/Marine-Safety-Center-MSC/

BTW I think it is a good idea if implemented the right way. There are quite a few people already doing this, especially in the Northeast US. You could fill a niche market that currently no one fills, a relatively inexpensive way to move goods in an area that is woefully underserved, No roads, no trains, very little shipping. Only aircraft. And with fossil fuels getting outrageously expensive and being phased out in some sectors, this is definitely going to be the future. Actually it is the original "green" mode of transport, since sailing vessels have been used for thousands of years.

By the way that's Berthing not birthing. LOL a whole different thing. Your spell check must not be working.
No worries, just a lot of typing and responding as you can probably understand. I think I am going to have a vessel built. I am already looking into it and discussing with a designer who has a design already that we both agree would be near perfect as it is designed as a ketch rigged vessel that carries shipping containers and can utilize pre fabricated shipping containers that are set up as living quarters for guest. They are easily replaced by cargo containers so the ship can be easily converted to fill multiple roles as I would need it to. It would also only require a 2-3 man crew and has room for trainees or more guests.
 
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