SailNet Community banner

1 - 15 of 15 Posts

·
moderate?
Joined
·
1,000 Posts
Discussion Starter #1
Thought some of you would appreciate a follow up to the grounding/wreck of the Gypsy Dane off Cape Hatteras a few weeks ago. The boat is off the beach now but not yet to the yard. A real shame to have such a pretty boat with her back broken.


"<small>If you’ve driven through Avon in the past week and a half, you’ve probably noticed something a little strange—namely, the large sailboat hogging the Ramp 38 parking lot.

The boat is the Gypsy Dane, a 50-foot sailboat that crashed into an Avon beach, about a mile south of the pier, on Saturday, Nov. 15.

After sitting on the beach for more than a week, enduring bad weather and even worse luck, the Gypsy Dane, at the behest of the Park Service, was finally moved off the beach by Steve Steiner, a licensed house mover and owner of Steiner and Daughters House Moving and Raising in Pantego, N.C.

Steiner agreed to move the boat in exchange for ownership. The owner of the boat, Yves Oger of Toronto, who was sailing the boat to Charleston, S.C., apparently had no insurance and lacked to funds to pay for the salvage operation. He has refused media interviews since he washed up on the beach, after, he reportedly said, he went below deck to make a sandwich.

Steiner dug the boat out of the sand, lifted it onto steel beams on a massive trailer, hauled it down the beach, and over Ramp 38. According to the National Park Service, which issued a special use permit for the move, the ramp had to be widened slightly and sand had to be added and packed down to make the trip up and over the ramp possible with the big boat and massive trailer.

Steiner parked the boat in the NPS parking lot until he could remove the masts and move it to dry dock at Steve Crum’s stables in Buxton.

Now, a week and half later—and almost three weeks after its arrival— the boat is still sitting in the parking lot, and the permit, required by the Park Service, that allows Steiner to take the necessary measures to move the boat off Park Service property, has expired.

Even though Steiner has not yet moved the boat off Park Service Property, which he was required to do under the conditions of the permit, NPS is willing to work with him.

"We will allow him a reasonable amount of time to move the boat," said Hatteras Island District Ranger John McCutcheon. "However, if it isn't moved in two weeks or so, I am going to be unhappy."

Initially, his main concern was making sure the boat didn’t break up on the beach, but McCutcheon now sees safety issues with the steel beams that extend past the sides of the trailer, and says he wants the boat off the parking lot before the holiday visitors arrive.

Steiner is confident that he and his crew can get the boat moved within the Park Service’s time frame, but they still have quite a bit of work to do.

First, Steiner will have to acquire permits from the North Carolina Department of Transportation in order to pull the trailer down the highway.

“They should issue the permits within a day, two days tops,” Steiner said, adding that he anticipated sending his paperwork to Raleigh by Friday, Dec. 5.

Once he receives his DOT permits, Steiner will have to arrange for a highway patrol escort from the parking lot to the stables, and, given the width of the boat, the move will most likely require closing down both lanes of traffic on Highway 12.

But perhaps the biggest challenge for Steiner, and the task most likely to put a kink in his timeline, will be removing the masts, which must be done before the boat can be moved. This will require tedious labor, careful maneuvering, and a really big crane.

He had originally planned on contracting with Murray Clark, better known as “Frisco Mo,” to tackle the project, and had hoped he would start Thursday or Friday, Dec. 4 or 5, but by Thursday night, Dec.5, their plans had fallen through because of business disagreements.

In spite of the challenges, Steiner doesn’t seem too worried.

“We’ll get it figured out,” he said with confidence. “There’s nothing we can’t move.” "

The Whole Story...Here:

Island Free Press ...Local News
</small>
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,607 Posts
I've worked with house movers several times, a real bunch of cowboys. Everything takes 5 times as long as they say it will and never goes as planned
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,680 Posts
Steiner agreed to move the boat in exchange for ownership. The owner of the boat, Yves Oger of Toronto, who was sailing the boat to Charleston, S.C., apparently had no insurance and lacked funds to pay for the salvage operation. He has refused media interviews since he washed up on the beach, after, he reportedly said, he went below deck to make a sandwich.
This quote has me confused, on many levels. It was a 50-footer -- and appeared to be in good condition. Why would somebody who could afford that boat, forego insurance, if they couldn't afford to self-insure?

Or are we discussing someone that was uninsurable?
 

·
Telstar 28
Joined
·
1,000 Posts
You'd think that a former moderator would respect his former colleagues enough so as not to spam the forums with multiple posts on the exact same subject... I guess when Cam took off his moderator's hat, he threw it in the head and did his business on it... :) forgetting everything about moderation in the process. :D :p
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,491 Posts
Another story:

N.C. boat rescued, repaired, beached now abandoned | HamptonRoads.com | PilotOnline.com

Some friends of mine from Toronto knew this guy, or knew of him, because he apparently built his boat over years of work just off a major road in the northwest part of the city and I guess was a bit of a landmark.

It sounds like the guy just gave up...no insurance...no will to persevere...and I have to wonder if that "I went below to make a sandwich" was actually missing "and fell asleep for six hours instead". I have to wonder, given that he apparently got into trouble the week before he beached his boat.

Now it's taking up twelve spots in a parking lot...very sad.
 

·
moderate?
Joined
·
1,000 Posts
Discussion Starter #7
Thought some might be interested in the epilogue to all this:
Island Free Press ...Local News

<small>Clark says Oger is a retired metallurgic engineer, who bought the boat for about $150,000 and had “everything he owned” invested in the boat or on it.

“He had very little experience sailing,” Clark says.</small>


What a surprise!! All the more reason to be off in the North Atlantic winter attempting to singlehand a 50+ foot boat!!

 

·
Senior Moment
Joined
·
598 Posts
Geez, are they handing out stupid pills this winter, or is every winter on the east coast like this? Not much sailing experience, 50 footer, North Atlantic, Winter. Pick any two seems like asking for trouble, he apparently went 4 or 4.

Very sad, glad the guy got out with his life, sounds like he might of been lucky at that.

michael
 

·
I'd rather be sailing
Joined
·
1,903 Posts
The one thing I can say from what people have told me, the frontal systems passing along the east coast this year are stronger, more frequent and less predictable. There's not a lot of excuse for going singlehanded when you don't have much experience, but the only way to gain experience is to, well, get experience. We don't have much experience (4 years owning a boat and pretty much only sailing it on a lake, my only experience before that was racing on other people's boats, and my wife just learned a couple of years ago), but we're getting more experience each time we have a problem. I think this guy was a bit insane going out singlehanded on a 50 footer with little experience though...
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,889 Posts
Thanks for the update, Cam.

This is not likely to be the last such misadventure we'll hear about. Tragically, many such ventures end this way....with the loss of a boat, crew, or both. I've lost track of those I know about personally; can't count them all on my fingers anymore.

Interestingly, the "perpetrators" are not all dummies, or clueless wannabees. Many of them are accomplished professionals in one field or another. And, like this one, they've managed to accumulate enough personal wealth to be able to afford really good seagoing yachts.

Typically, they've lived with the dream of ocean sailing and faraway beaches for a very long time while they've been caught up in other careers. Finally, the time comes, they take some or all of their belongings and cash, and turn them into a boat. Often, a very good boat. Sometimes, a very expensive boat.

Then, the moment comes when they can say goodbye to former pursuits -- sometimes hastened by the exit of kids from the nest, or by the death of parents, or by retirement from the job, or .... whatever -- and they set forth on their new life. It's not really new to them. After all, they've been dreaming about it and planning for it for many years.

So what's wrong with this scenario? Isn't it the fulfillment of a lifelong dream? What could be better?

All too often, those I know about have forgotten one key thing: to learn to sail really well, and to accumulate sufficient skills and experience -- with adequate practice -- to support their new life afloat.

I've seen it again and again. Why don't these otherwise intelligent people get it? Folks, you can't just jump aboard and sail off into the sunset. Forget the John Caldwell novel (much of it made up) and other tales you've read about.

You MUST learn to sail and you MUST gain enough experience aboard to navigate the very tricky waters which lie just off your dock. And face the challenges of an ocean voyage during which conditions may range from benign to survival.

To ignore this need is tantamount to stepping into the cockpit of a jet believing you can fly it anywhere in any weather because you've always wanted to and now have the money to buy one (you just forgot about the flying lessons because you were too busy earning money to buy the jet).

Seems so simple. Yet, even very intelligent people don't seem to get it :-(

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,680 Posts
This quote has me confused, on many levels. It was a 50-footer -- and appeared to be in good condition. Why would somebody who could afford that boat, forego insurance, if they couldn't afford to self-insure?

Or are we discussing someone that was uninsurable?
I think we now know the answer to my earlier question.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,607 Posts
All too often, those I know about have forgotten one key thing: to learn to sail really well, and to accumulate sufficient skills and experience -- with adequate practice -- to support their new life afloat.

I've seen it again and again. Why don't these otherwise intelligent people get it? Folks, you can't just jump aboard and sail off into the sunset. Forget the John Caldwell novel (much of it made up) and other tales you've read about.

You MUST learn to sail and you MUST gain enough experience aboard to navigate the very tricky waters which lie just off your dock. And face the challenges of an ocean voyage during which conditions may range from benign to survival.

To ignore this need is tantamount to stepping into the cockpit of a jet believing you can fly it anywhere in any weather because you've always wanted to and now have the money to buy one (you just forgot about the flying lessons because you were too busy earning money to buy the jet).

Seems so simple. Yet, even very intelligent people don't seem to get it :-(

Bill
I don't know if I fall into that last concept! But I do fall into the general category you are describing.
I will have 2 to 3 summers Great Lakes experience on my 42 before we set off coastal cruising. What am I missing? I AM going to do this. I THINK I can be a prudent mariner. What am I missing?

We will watch weather reports.
We will avoid heading south too late in the season and heading north too early.
We will stay inside the ICW when things are questionable.
We will be cautious.
We will study the inlets and only use the good ones.

Are there one or two particular issues you're talking about?

This mess seems to be caused by pushing the limits. Being bold when being cautious would have been prudent.
The trip south along the coast of the US isn't brain surgery. But is does require common sense. What am I missing?

I'm being serious, not trying to be a smart @ss (altho I'm pretty good at it!).

Thanks
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,889 Posts
I don't know if I fall into that last concept! But I do fall into the general category you are describing.
I will have 2 to 3 summers Great Lakes experience on my 42 before we set off coastal cruising. What am I missing? I AM going to do this. I THINK I can be a prudent mariner. What am I missing?
You sound like a serious mariner who's taking precautions and not pushing the limits.

The hard thing is knowing exactly where those limits lie. One can never be sure. But actual experience on the water in many varied situations over time is the antedote.

Is your experience on the Great Lakes over 2 seasons enough? It depends. On you, on how much sailing you've done in those 2 seasons, on the types of weather you've encountered, etc., etc.

All I can suggest is that you take every opportunity you can to actually get out on the water, and not necessarily on your own boat or in your own home waters. Charter a boat in the Caribbean if you can. You'll get more practice sailing there in a typical week than you will in many parts of the U.S. in a whole season. Sail with friends. Nothing, but nothing can substitute for actual time on the water under varied conditions.

Good luck to you. I'm gonna bet you're gonna be fine, as you seem to approach cruising with a healthy respect.

Bill
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
5,491 Posts
Bill, if you sail on Lake Ontario in May and September/October, you will get the experience equivalent to a "fresh" day on the ocean. Winds can kick up to 40 knots here, with nasty, "square" waves, and there is plenty of opportunity to test one's skills. Sadly (to my mind), my wife and I are frequently alone out there when the wind pipes up, even though it's frequently still warm and sunny, if blowing like stink, "Charlie Cobra" weather.

I have it on good authority that Lake Ontario gales are equal to open ocean weather in every respect save duration and total wave height. Here, the fetch from the West makes more than 9 feet unusual, and 12-14 feet from the East is equally rare. The most I've noticed is five metres/16 feet during a 45 knot gale in October. The thing that ocean sailors comment on is the very close wave groupings and the absence of swell to break them up, meaning the ride is as much up and down as side to side. Puke can ensue.
 
1 - 15 of 15 Posts
Top