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I think we can all agree that educating the youngins, benefits us all, whether they are ours or not. If the 20 and 30 somethings had to pay the whole tab for their kids, more would be on the streets and uneducated. Then we would pay for more police, social programs, etc. However, I also think we can sympathize that our school system is grossly inefficient and wasteful. Schools themselves often agree, as they are required to comply with mandates, when good teachers feel they could do better on their own. The only vehicle that schools have to raised the money to comply with state and federal mandates is property taxes. The system is broken.
 

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I think we can all agree that educating the youngins, benefits us all, whether they are ours or not. If the 20 and 30 somethings had to pay the whole tab for their kids, more would be on the streets and uneducated. Then we would pay for more police, social programs, etc. However, I also think we can sympathize that our school system is grossly inefficient and wasteful. Schools themselves often agree, as they are required to comply with mandates, when good teachers feel they could do better on their own. The only vehicle that schools have to raised the money to comply with state and federal mandates is property taxes. The system is broken.
Plus the number one driver of property values is quality of local public schools. So you get a return on your investment if you are paying school taxes in a location with quality schools by having higher property values.
 

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Paul, the only fly in that ointment is that I've lived in my home for nearly 50 years, so while I was living here, I was paying for my children's education. So, what happens when my children, one of which is 45 and the other is 49 years of age, purchased their homes, they got hammered with incredibly high RE taxes, yet my daughter only has one child and my son has none. So now I'm paying, they're paying, and all that money goes for one child, my grandson, who will soon be entering private school, mainly because he has become bored with public school, mainly because of the dumbing down scenario. He's a very intelligent child, and the PC school system seems to be dragging him down, thus when he enters private school my daughter will be shelling out for the improved education, and still be required to pay those RE taxes to support the public school system.

As for the benefit in increased real estate prices, well, that only applies if you intend to sell the place. I'm not gonna sell! I intend to die here, or on my boat. I'm gonna drink booze, eat bad foods, and hopefully, won't linger in a damned nursing home. My fondest desire is to be shot in the back of the head at the ripe old age of 108 by a jealous husband while leaping from a second story window with my trousers down around my ankles and a 29-year old gal screaming "don't leave me - don't leave me! Hey, we all have our druthers!

Now that I've reached 75 years of age, and I retired this past August because of health issues, I feel as if I've more than paid my fair share of RE taxes, and for that matter, all taxes. I've been working for 65 years, been shelling out taxes for most of that time, and now the greedy bastards want more. Fat chance!

Good luck,

Gary :cool:
 

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Gary interesting argument. I do understand about paying taxes as you age...I have been paying for over 50 years now
...let me extrapolate it some

I don't use the police force...so I don't want to pay for it
I don't believe in $3000 toilets on military ships...so I don't want to pay for it
I don't use the bridge over the Susquehanna on route 95...so I don't want to pay for it.
I don't watch the Ravens....so I don't want to pay for it
I don't smoke tobacco so I don't want my taxes used to subsidize the farmers to grow it

There are a lot of things I DONT WANT TO BE TAXED FOR or want my tax money going towards

Actually way down that list is a real estate tax to fund education for our future. Has nothing to do with how good it is, its the concept of our future children. If you can think of a better way to fund that, let me know.

Listen I propose we legalize marijuana and put all the tax revenue toward education only and win on two counts.
Less money spend police forces, incarcerating people and jails
Huge tax benefits to fund education ( kind of a strange juxtaposition taxing drugs for young kids education)
 

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I completely understand Gary's angst. At some point in time, your tax debt to the local education system should be retired. I have never attended a public school in my life, have no children that have attended public schools, but have paid property taxes for 25 years in my town. The lion share of those taxes goes to fund the local schools. Fine. I also pay for family leave, Unemployement ins. ( never collected a dime).

A family however, gets a federal tax deduction for each kid, tax credits, paid family leave, day care etc. I am all for the common good. But at some point, your kids are your future, not mine. ( though, I've taught them) I just received another property tax increase notice for this year. I'm still about a year away from being able to have them frozen; but, I'll probably end up living on my boat, up here in the summers, and find a low property tax state in a warm climate to spend winters. And hopefully end up paying less ( to tie it back to the op)
 

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Funny how everything turns to politics sooner or later, I will resist. I've paid three Marinas in a little over a year. Marina 1 didn't care what you did as long as you paid, get your own electric service from the local provider. Basically a working Marina with more abandoned vessels than I care to think, one sank while I was there, but it served the purpose. Marina 2 was missing pilings between some slips, a victim of the declining market. They found one for me with green poles and electric included, Bonus!! No rules here either. Marina 3 was where I wanted to be, then the waiting list was fixed for me so again I move. A bit more expensive and live aboards are only considered individually mostly granted by Divorce as it was explained to me. So not the Fee upon Fee of others but not San Francisco or Annapolis either, the story will be different there.
 

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Tempest, at least in NJ they freeze the tax burden at a certain age. In Maryland, they just keep raising it, regardless of your age or income level, and there have been numerous cases where people have been taxed out of their homes. Of course, the liberal Baltimore Sun Papers never seem to get around to covering those kind of stories. I think if I ever got to that point, i would toss a match on the living room floor, and move aboard the boat and head south. The state and county can have what is left after the fire is put out. In most states you really never own your home - the state you reside in owns it. If you think not, see how long you can live there if you don't pony up and pay those RE taxes. :)

Cheers,

Gary :cool:
 

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I didn't realize that about Maryland Gary. Makes it hard to retire on a fixed income. Yes, here @ 65, I can stop the bleeding, but they make you apply for it every year. Maybe I'll see you in the Keys one day!
 

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I have lived aboard three times in my life, on my third time (4 years now) and I miss it every time I leave the water. First time was on a mooring ball off Shelter Island in San Diego (at that time, it was $50/month, you can't beat that with a stick) and you were on your own for everything, but I appreciated it for the almost complete freedom it afforded, pun intended. ;-) Second time was in Channel Islands Harbor in Oxnard, CA, and it was also at the time very cheap, and the community was tight. I don't think I ever locked my boat and I knew every one of my neighbors. This time, I'm in Ventura Harbor, in Ventura, CA, and I think there are differences that are a result of location and climate from what others have posted.

(1) We pay about $200/month more for living aboard and are required to have a liveaboard inspection by the Harbor Police/Coast Guard, etc every year to prevent barely-floating RV's (although somehow there are still a few). This is, of course, if you live aboard legit and don't "sneak-aboard." I don't judge, though. :)

(2) My marina has a 50% liveaboard ratio which is unheard of in Southern California, I don't even think you'll find that in liveaboard-friendly Marina Del Rey. This creates a real community, something I, for one, crave, and have not found many places I have lived. We have events for the whole marina several times a year where the marina gets us food/beer/music and we definitely watch out for each other. When I come in from sailing (which I do frequently, keep my boat to where I can get ready to head out in about 30 minutes), a neighbor will invariably be there to push out my bow as I exit or grab a line when I come in. I "adopted" parents a few boats away as well! :)

(3) We pay property taxes in this County even though we live aboard on the water. Lots of kids here, and they do a variety of things as far as school goes. Some home school, some go to private school (that's what I would choose if I were a parent, public schools suck ass in California in general), some go to the local schools. I don't have a problem paying for other kids' education, myself.

(4) It definitely costs the marina to have folks living aboard. Water (it's California, we have none, I scold people I see hosing down the dock with the hose when there is a freaking ocean right there and brushes to use for all. The birds are going to crap within hours of you wasting water), sewage (we have a plethora of pump outs), trash, bathrooms (we get them cleaned every day, for pete's sake) though there is only heat in one of them and it's pretty damn cold right now, and parking.

Tania
 

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al brazzi
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I have lived aboard three times in my life, on my third time (4 years now) and I miss it every time I leave the water. First time was on a mooring ball off Shelter Island in San Diego (at that time, it was $50/month, you can't beat that with a stick) and you were on your own for everything, but I appreciated it for the almost complete freedom it afforded, pun intended. ;-) Second time was in Channel Islands Harbor in Oxnard, CA, and it was also at the time very cheap, and the community was tight. I don't think I ever locked my boat and I knew every one of my neighbors. This time, I'm in Ventura Harbor, in Ventura, CA, and I think there are differences that are a result of location and climate from what others have posted.

(1) We pay about $200/month more for living aboard and are required to have a liveaboard inspection by the Harbor Police/Coast Guard, etc every year to prevent barely-floating RV's (although somehow there are still a few). This is, of course, if you live aboard legit and don't "sneak-aboard." I don't judge, though. :)

(2) My marina has a 50% liveaboard ratio which is unheard of in Southern California, I don't even think you'll find that in liveaboard-friendly Marina Del Rey. This creates a real community, something I, for one, crave, and have not found many places I have lived. We have events for the whole marina several times a year where the marina gets us food/beer/music and we definitely watch out for each other. When I come in from sailing (which I do frequently, keep my boat to where I can get ready to head out in about 30 minutes), a neighbor will invariably be there to push out my bow as I exit or grab a line when I come in. I "adopted" parents a few boats away as well! :)

(3) We pay property taxes in this County even though we live aboard on the water. Lots of kids here, and they do a variety of things as far as school goes. Some home school, some go to private school (that's what I would choose if I were a parent, public schools suck ass in California in general), some go to the local schools. I don't have a problem paying for other kids' education, myself.

(4) It definitely costs the marina to have folks living aboard. Water (it's California, we have none, I scold people I see hosing down the dock with the hose when there is a freaking ocean right there and brushes to use for all. The birds are going to crap within hours of you wasting water), sewage (we have a plethora of pump outs), trash, bathrooms (we get them cleaned every day, for pete's sake) though there is only heat in one of them and it's pretty damn cold right now, and parking.

Tania


My son lives in Ventura, beautiful place we have visited a few times.
I could live on a boat there.
 

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.....are required to have a liveaboard inspection by the Harbor Police/Coast Guard, etc every year to prevent barely-floating RV's......
I like this idea. Junky liveaboards ruin it for the rest of us, as towns and marina start to limit access.

I suspect some marinas downright prefer non-liveaboards, however. Perhaps those that go home at night pay the marina to do more work. I know I would get marginally more done myself, if I lived at the marina year round. I do a ton today, but often have to pay to have something done I do not have time for.
 

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Discussion Starter #54
Have been visiting some places around here and have found some good options for the coming year. None I have visited or spoken with charge more for liveaboards. I will decide where I'm going soon... at least I have several options.

Come on Spring! :)
 

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Discussion Starter #55
So this weekend I am moving Windgeist to her new home... a couple of my friends are moving there as well I learned. So they charge $60 a month fee for liveaboards, I felt that was fair. That provides clean bathrooms, nice bathrooms, winter water, laundry on site, a mailbox, gym, entertainment area, full length pier, haul out facilities, pool, childrens play area, and more. Plenty of parking too ;) All for less than I was paying!

Sometimes you just have to look around and find the grass is greener on the other side.
 

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A PO box and gym membership would cost more than that. Sounds like you get good value for the liveaboard services. Curious how they provide winter water. You guys may be south of here, but still spend a few months below freezing typically.
 

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So this weekend I am moving Windgeist to her new home... a couple of my friends are moving there as well I learned. So they charge $60 a month fee for liveaboards, I felt that was fair. That provides clean bathrooms, nice bathrooms, winter water, laundry on site, a mailbox, gym, entertainment area, full length pier, haul out facilities, pool, childrens play area, and more. Plenty of parking too ;) All for less than I was paying!

Sometimes you just have to look around and find the grass is greener on the other side.
Shawn, where is this paradise? You didn't say.

Gary :2 boat:
 

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I know of several marinas with winter water - they just use electric pipe wrap that is connected to a thermostat......
Had a lake house many years ago that pumped water out of the lake. It used this method in the winter on the stretch between the water and the house. Didn't work too well, when it was overcast for several days in freezing temps. It was difficult to really get tape over every foot of exposed pipe. Generally, it would just get to a trickle, but would occasionally shut down. The tape did seem to prevent bursting.
 

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It gets pretty chilly down here, but nothing the tape cannot handle, especially when there is a small amount of water flowing through the system constantly. Kinda like the old trick in the barn where you turned on one of the fawcets and allow the water to slowly run on bitter cold nights - no bursted pipes.

All the best,

Gary :cool:
 
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