Oh boy.

 

It isn't like I brought up anchors or Hunters :laugh

 

When I was shopping for a used cruiser, I saw a lot of IP 38's that I liked. I called up the factory (8 years ago) and asked if they would be willing to help with the rebuild of one. They told me they were too busy selling new ones to be worried about old ones.
I went on to other boats....

 

Interesting observation and a horrible business model compared to the builder of my boat.

Thanks for the personal anecdote.

 

Perhaps that brings up an interesting question. What does it take, under the current market we live in with regards to sailing, to be a successful boat builder?

Is Island Packet a dying style for the current market?

 

Simple. More boat for "less" money. That's what's selling.

 

That's too bad, if it's true. I toured the Blue Jacket 40 at the New England boat show a couple of weeks back, which I think is made by IP. I thought it a very worthy boat.

 

Small, speciality sailboat builders cannot compete with large, govt subsidized mass marketers.

My prediction; next up, Hinkley will stop building sail and concentrate on picnic boats (like Sabre) and try to make Morris carry on with semi-custom sailboats.

 

I wonder if this bad news will have an effect on the price of their older boats. They seem like nice coastal cruisers.

 

? Does Bene get a subsidy from the French government ?

 

My understanding is bene gets big help in the loan department. After the crash, lenders wouldnt finance boats. The french govt supported boat loans and if you didnt have caah, they were the only game. Bene/Jene grabbed a big chunk of the market that way.

 

Uhu? Anything to support that statement or is it just something you say?

Bene, as you call them, are French. You know, that country in Europe famous for their wines. Europe were not hit in the same way as US by "the crash", Bene was one of the major boat builders, maybe the largest at that time. They did take some hits, as all did, made severe cuts, as all did.
But ... "the french govt supported boat loans"? Would that really save an international boat builder with its main market outside France?

All this said, the french are as protective as many others. It use to land on car industry or farming, both national sports. Then it is the industry that gets the support, not the consumers.

/J

 

I'm sure there are many reasons but the market for new US built sailboats hasn't been good in over a decade.
http://www.cruisingworld.com/sites/...d.com/sites/cruisingworld.com/files/the_sailing_market_2014_with_2013_data1.pdf
This is a couple years old but I think more recent #'s show the same thing. The strong US dollar won't help much either.

Hinckley has been mostly building power boats since about 2000 likely about 90% of production most of that time. They did introduce a new 50' sailboat last year and I believe have sold 3-4 of them so far.

 

Ask your self this question. How many of us want a full to semi full keel boat? The local dealer with a Blue Jacket 40 is now deducted some $100+, not sure a bite has occurred. Meanwhile, they have sold a dozen or so Jeanneau's a year! Including some that are more expensive than the BJ40, they also still have an IP38 IIRC......

PSC IMHO had the same issue. Too old of designs, clobbered by the older models that were reasonably cheap etc to buy. Catalina avoided this issue when they finally started to do some new designs. I am a little worried about Cape George Boatworks that is only building some older Lyle Hess designs. They are rehabbing older ones, so money is coming in the door. Nice folks at CGB but still.......older style boat that is not everyones cup o tea!

marty

 

Seems they have issues? Perhaps restructure or gone forever? Called their numbers and they are indeed disconnected.

The Wikipedia article you cited does not contain the quote you posted.

While there are always surprises in business I don't think this is true. I have Bill Bolin's cell phone number and will call him today at a more civilized time.

IPY recently won a contract to build Seaward Yachts in addition to their own Island Packets and the Blue Jacket. That makes it even harder to believe they have financial stability problems. Think about the due diligence carried out before the award and the infusion of cash as part of it.

IPY did have a rough patch some years ago. They went to a four day work week for a while to protect jobs. In my opinion Bob Johnson and Bill Bolin and their team have done a very good job of business management over the years in good times and bad.

When I was shopping for a used cruiser, I saw a lot of IP 38's that I liked. I called up the factory (8 years ago) and asked if they would be willing to help with the rebuild of one. They told me they were too busy selling new ones to be worried about old ones.
I went on to other boats....

There must be more to that story. IPY has a reputation for outstanding customer service. I have personal knowledge of them hunting through files for drawings and parts lists for old boats.

 

There must be more to that story. IPY has a reputation for outstanding customer service. I have personal knowledge of them hunting through files for drawings and parts lists for old boats.

Dave, I was looking at the IP 38 after having chartered the IP 40 and was told by Johnson those exact words. I had the one I wanted to buy and all my ducks in a row. Maybe because I was not yet an owner, or they were busy that day or something else, that I was blown off that day. I was not impressed. I went with a Valiant that assured me they would either update my boat at the factory or that I could buy parts from them (at $$$ to be sure). The Valiant shop has since closed down.
I have no problems with the quality of the IP, and a few IP-38's have circ'ed the world. I just felt that they would not help me with their older models, and that was a big deal to me at that time. Not so much now that I do my own plumbing, sailmending, mech, fiberglass, welding, etc....
As for older designs- I think people like PSC make excellent boats and would buy one of those boats rather than a newer model that you cannot get parts for because the design changes every few years. OK, so I get there a few hours later. Bill me.:sailing-pilgrims:

 

The Seattle dealer has had a Blue Jacket for sale for almost three years.

Sorry to see them go.I have not designed a new production boat since the Flying Tiger and that was about 7 years ago. All my work since has been custom boats.

 

The Seattle dealer has had a Blue Jacket for sale for almost three years......

What do you think is the block? I thought it was a decent boat, although, I didn't think the topsides were faired as well as they should have been for a blue hull in an indoor boat show. Sort of the perfect environment to find imperfections.

I was just browsing, so I never even looked at the asking price. I'm not a huge fan of self-tacking jibs, nor the solent rig (unless really going offshore), but I didn't find many objections. Overpriced?

 

We looked at building a new PSC44 but went with the Outbound. Steve Brody is a true gentleman and his shop builds a great boat. Even after the Outbound was in build ( and he knew it) PSC helped me out with my PSC 34 as its sale was in progress.
On another thread noted all the stick built boat builders are in trouble. To paraphrase Smack people want more boat (LWL) for less money. They generally don't appreciate less money buys less boat. Or if they do it doesn't matter given their sailing program. Sailboats are a niche market and owners who want boats to last them decades or the rest of their lives smaller still. New boat market continues to divide into the ultra rich willing to pay huge sums for best practices and ultimate durability and the mass production builders. The middle ( Valiant, Sweden yacht, Najad, IP, HR?, PSC? Rustler?) gets smaller and will continue to have difficulty funding R&D, tooling, molds to stay current and maintain market share.
Outbound has benefited from this market contraction as fewer and fewer new boats are offered at reasonable price for the long term/distance cruising couple. Even then although Outbound offers a great 52' whose deck plan was reworked by the esteemed Robert Perry, NA it is out of the price range of this middle new boat market.

 

Seems like whomever originally posted to Wiki might not have been far off. Is it possible they are just being evicted and their phones are coincidentally shut off too? Unless a gross fabrication of photos and all, this looks bad for IP.

 

Catalina is just up the road....perhaps they need to join forces....

-CptBob

 

On the eviction notice their company name is "Traditional Watercraft"
The problem with that is when tradional boats were being built they were not traditional - they were as modern as the builders could make them.

 

Please note that Traditional Watercraft Inc is the name of the company that does business as Island Packet Yachts. That is not new - it is the name Bob Johnson chose for the company when he released the first Island Packet to the market.

Here is the news I have from extremely reliable sources.

The eviction notice was indeed on the door for 24 hours. It was in place as a result of a change in leaseholder for the buildings from which IPY operates. The company is healthy and in full operation. Not so much as a pencil was moved.

I am told there will be an announcement from the company next week on Tuesday or Wednesday.

My understanding is that some IP owners (a rabidly loyal group) dropped by to visit and posted photos of the notice on the owners' forum. Speculation and rumor spiraled from there.

Bob Johnson and his team continue to exemplify good management and forethought. I firmly believe any buyer or owner can have full confidence in ongoing support for their Island Packet, Blue Jacket, or Seaward Yacht.

 

....The eviction notice was indeed on the door for 24 hours. It was in place as a result of a change in leaseholder for the buildings from which IPY operates.

Still sounds fishy, but I'm glad to hear you are confident that they remain in business.

I am told there will be an announcement from the company next week on Tuesday or Wednesday.

If you have a close relationship with these folks, you should encourage them not to wait that long. A full week is a brand killer on the internet and they must be aware of the firestorm.

 

Well that is good news hopefully. Odd turn of events to have an eviction notice posted for 24 hours just for a change in leaseholder. Also odd for the phones to be turned off and not functioning. I'm sure it will all shake out in a few days.

- Cpt. Bob

 

Also odd for the phones to be turned off and not functioning. I'm sure it will all shake out in a few days.

I'm told that service providers for the phones are also underway. The time means someone somewhere dropped the ball. I still got through on the mobile numbers I have. Email is working also.

When I was shopping for a used cruiser, I saw a lot of IP 38's that I liked. I called up the factory (8 years ago) and asked if they would be willing to help with the rebuild of one. They told me they were too busy selling new ones to be worried about old ones.

I don't know when it started by IP does now have a refit program. Perhaps it was your call that put the seed of the idea in their mind? I don't know.

However, the Seaward 32RK is my dream boat to buy new. If IP goes down, that greatly reduces my already slim chances of ever getting one.

IP builds Seaward boats for Hake Yachts who own the brand. IP doesn't own Seaward.

 

A reasonable percent of slips and moorings are still occupied by boats from the late '60's - '70's fiberglass boats that are still cared for and sailed regular. Many are still racing weekly. This type of longevity does not seem to occur with cars or R/V's.

I sold my 1972 for a "new" 1988 because I wanted a bigger berth and head. I'm probably be no happier had I bought new as I could have only been let down. If I was just daysailing I might still be sailing the 1972. I'm now in the market for another "new" boat that will probably be made around 1990.

For me, a new boat would be a used boat in a matter of hours. I take friends out fishing, manage to bump a dock and bump the bottom at least once every season, I can't seem to ever change the oil without spilling a drop, invited friends show up wearing black soled boots or whatnot (but they bring a six pack ), then there is the inevitable red wind slosh that doesn't get noticed until the next morning. I spend a hell of a lot more time sailing than polishing and waxing.

Yacht World, Craigs, etc. are loaded with boats built in the 1970's. Sadly they seem to only have one steering wheel and you can't drive a golf ball out the transom

So many reasons not to buy new unless you are flush. Sorry to say I'm not flush.

 

Sadly they seem to only have one steering wheel and you can't drive a golf ball out the transom

HAHAHAHA! Best. Quote. Ever.

 

There remain valid reasons for new boats even when counting the pennies.
You're racing
You're voyaging and don't what to find out about other people's mistakes, mishaps or damage when outside helicopter range.
You're going full time cruising and don't want to spend the first year on rehab and refit issues.
The boat you've set your heart on is not commonly available on the used market or if available not spec'd the way you want or heavily travelled.
You have things you want on the boat not commonly asked for and either much more expensive to do as retrofit or not possible.

 

The local Seattle dealer has a sold sign on the BJ 40. BUT, it is very discounted below 400K vs aboe 500K iirc when it first came out. The ip360 is also well discounted, but not sold per say.

Marty

 

Friend in round the world ARC noted the IP in the group always came in last. But:

They came in.

And

They were happy, smiling and had no significant breakage.



Not my cuppa but says much to be proud of in a cruising boat. Wonder if they made any 520s. Promo literature looks good. Berths look usable without the funky angled placement.
Be sad if IP bites the dust.

 

Well, perhaps reports of their demise have been greatly exaggerated..

I liked a lot of what we saw on the BJ40, except the price (which the market hasn't exactly supported either).. My poison would probably be a J40 in good shape.

btw, I think buying new (for the good reasons you cited, Out,) in 40+ feet means you're beyond counting pennies.. or dreaming.. or hopelessly in debt on a depreciating 'asset'....

 

I have heard that everyone involved is under a full non-disclosure contract and are not even allowed to discuss whatever is going on. News will be forthcoming "in March." Reportedly Bill Bolin, Bob Johnson are to release the official news. I guess we can only speculate. I doubt it's good news.

 

If it is good news, then their PR person should be fired haha.