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Discussion Starter #1
Hello!

I have been hesitating to post about this issue since I am afraid I may destroy the couple of dollars of resale value in my boat.

In the photo attached you can see that she floats a lot higher in the bow that at the stern. The lines at the stern end are clearly under water. The scum line at the end of the year also shows that this happens while tied up at the dock.

Is it possible that the previous owner painted the lines at the wrong location? Is the fiberglass so water logged that it is riding this low? Would a lighter engine help? Do I need to go on a diet? I would really like to fix this if possible.

This is a South Coast 23 with a 9.9 HP Honda in an outboard well.

Thank you in advance for any advice!

Faces and registration numbers have been obscured to protect the innocent.

Scott.
 

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In the photo attached you can see that she floats a lot higher in the bow that at the stern. The lines at the stern end are clearly under water. The scum line at the end of the year also shows that this happens while tied up at the dock.
Is there a water tank forward and is it empty or full?
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Thank you for the response.

There is a water tank forward and it is empty.

The previous owner suggested that the boat is designed to sail with the tank full. From what I have seen it appears that keeping the the front tank full only makes the bow lower. The stern still rides as shown in the photo.

Is this normal?
 

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She does look a bit heavy in the tail. I seriously doubt that there is anything wrong with the fiberglass... it's the same stuff above and below the waterline. Perhaps, and it's a big perhaps, there could be some blistering IF the hull below the waterline was barrier coated.

More likely is weight distribution. Smaller boats are extremely sensitive to where the weight is. As an experiment, remove everything aft of the mid point that isn't nailed down and isn't part of the rigging (you, anchor, chain, electronics, bimini). Drain any fresh water & holding tank. If that fixes the problem, start adding back essential stuff (you, anchor, chain) and see where she rides.
 

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks Sabreman,

Let me make sure I reading your post correctly.

I will move everything I can forward and then -- if that does not fix it -- I will need to get a bigger boat, right?

I hope I can explain this to the Admiral properly. :)

But seriously, I will try moving everything I can and see what happens.

Scott.
 

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Saberman has the right advice on weight distribution. Your SC 23 has a moderate overhang in the stern and needs to squat to add buoyancy as you add weight aft. Assuming your Honda 9.9 is a 4 stroke, it would be about 30 lbs heavier than a Johnson/Evinrude 6hp 2-stroke that was probably used when your boat was new. If you are positioning your fuel tank far aft, that would further aggravate the situation.

It sure looks like you've loaded down your cockpit with stuff, based on your photo. As Saberman suggested, you would see a change as you move stuff forward, but you also might consider relocating heavier items that you will keep further forward. You might stow your bimini forward when not in use to reduce the scum line. Keeping your forward water tank, if it is forward of your CG, won't hurt, either.

Overall, given your beam and the aft overhang, you don't seem to have a particularly bad situation.
 

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Actually, I was suggesting removing everything aft of the midpoint (and temporarily putting it on the dock). That will give you a basis for evaluating if too much weight aft is the problem. You can just move gear forward, and that may fix it too. But when I was writing, I was more interested in seeing if you can get the boat light and even keeled, using a systematic approach.

As I'm sure you read in Sailnet, there is a big tendency to load boats up with a lot of gear. I think that Shackleton had less stuff than some people seem to have crammed on their boats. So my interest was in seeing whether you can get your boat floating properly, then add gear systematically. On our boat, "get rid of stuff" is a mantra.

But as fallard observes, the boats with long overhangs have less buoyancy, bow and stern. So while they look lovely, there are limitations. This is why you really want to keep the weight low and off the ends. Of course, an anchor stuffed in a hatch in the middle of the boat's cabin will do you no good, so you have to compromise.

As an aside, our boat is bow heavy. I've removed everything I can forward of the mast (except the anchor) and she's still about 1" lower than I'd like. I have a funny feeling that the mast is leaning a little forward of where it should. 65' of aluminum and rigging a degree or so off vertical would be enough to put the bow down an inch. But when we have a race crew in the cockpit, she floats nice.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Thank Sabreman,

Next time I am out at the slip I will make a renewed effort to remove all the things I can. I have been trying to do that for some time now. That is why I am wondering if I have something saturated with water or something else that I do not see immediately.

Thanks to everyone for the advice. I love sailnet.

juggleandhope - Thanks! I hope to get her all cleaned up a shining some day. I looked hard for a international folkboat like yours, but I could not find one a reasonable distance away. Those are very pretty boats.

Scott.
 

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Once known as Hartley18
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Well.. she certainly looks a little tail-heavy in the photo - and that ain't something a bit of paint will fix. ;)


FWIW, when I bought my boat I found the PO (or a PPO or a PPPO, who knows?) managed to "lose" a lead ingot or three down aft. :eek: I found one wedged into the bilge under a pile of crud, another two under the stern gland again buried under more crud and yet another dropped into the bottom of the lazarette (huh?). None were tied down or deliberately placed - "scattered" would be a better description - and she sure handled better once I dug them out and got them off the boat.

I've ceased being amazed at what people find on their boats.
 

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Discussion Starter #13
Thanks for all the replies.

I spent last evening crawling around above the bilge in 85 degree humid weather -- Boating is fun.

I didn't find any lead that shouldn't be there, but I did find a hose that needs some more research to see if it goes anywhere.

I took out some stuff, moved over stuff forward and removed the gas tank from the lazarette. The gas tank was the only thing that made any real difference. It has about 3 gallons in it and moved the waterline in the back up about 1/2 of an inch.

So I think I am looking at two changes.

1. Get a Tohatsu sailpro that weighs around 60 pounds to replace the 100+ pound Honda 9.9 that I have. This will obviously need some investment, but I think getting 40 pounds out of the tail end will probably bring her back up to her lines when the captain is not on board. Anyone want to buy a used Honda 9.9? :)

2. I think the gas needs to move forward, but I am not sure where to mount it. For weight I guess the best position would be forward low below decks, but that does not seem to safe. The lazarette is also not really the 'safe' place for gasoline either.

Does anyone have a suggestion where to store a 3 gallon portable tank on a 23 footer? "On the cockpit floor" will probably cause issues. I have one of the "EPA" tanks and it bulges something crazy when left in the direct sunlight.

The attached photo shows the cockpit scuppers just above water when I am no one is aboard. I guess that much is good, but the green boot stripe is nowhere to be seen.

Scott.
 

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Once known as Hartley18
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FC, gaining a 1/2" is a good start and shows that you're on the right track - but before worrying about what to put back, I'd be fixing the problem..

Key point: In trimming any boat, weight forward can be just as important as no-weight aft.

May I suggest:
  1. Take everything aft of the companionway that is not bolted down off of the boat. Make sure you can see the hull all around inside and that there are no water tanks or anything else back aft that might be adding weight. When it's completely empty - no cushions, boards, ropes, anchors, nothing other than hull and hull fittings back aft, check the lines.
  2. If there's a buoyancy tank back there, make sure it's dry. Check the lines.
Having done all that:
  1. Add some weight (like the outboard perhaps) up front on the centerline of the boat (or as near as you can get) - either in the forepeak or even just on the deck forward of the mast. Check the lines again.
  2. Adjust the position of the weight (eg. the outboard) in the boat to get the water-line approximately right.
  3. Tell us how much weight that is and where it is and we can hopefully suggest where to go from there.
Good luck! :)
 

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Personally, I don't think this is too complicated. Take everything off you can, and put everthing that can't be taken off forward. Remember the effect of weight of an item going from back to front is essentially doubled. It has been suggested that filling the forward water tank on my boat actually makes it punch through chop better (maybe more hobby horsing). And, yes, storing gas in a portable tank below is not safe.
 

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Discussion Starter #16
The part that complicates it, for me, is that I am trying to decide if my engine is way too heavy for the design of my boat. I have not been able to find a manual or anything that tells me about this aspect of the design.

I moved everything except the companionway ladder and the engine into the v birth. I even moved the icebox cover, all the storage compartment covers, the cabin sole insert and the main hatch boards up front.

This definitely made some gains which you can see in the photos. Under power in some chop the boat definitely handles better now.

So what now? I can't keep everything up there. I have to walk around a big hole in the middle of the cabin sole right now.

Thanks again.

Scott.
 

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Once known as Hartley18
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Scott, I don't think there's any question that your current outboard is too heavy for the boat, but it seems to a few of us that you might need more weight in the bow also to get the boat sitting nicely in the water.

Assuming you didn't find anything serious happening back there: with all that gear (incl. the outboard) off of the boat, how far forward of the mast does a heavy weight (say 50 or 100lbs) need to be placed before she is sitting nicely?
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Thanks for all the responses!

With everything moved forward I am fairly happy with the way she floats now.

I think the plan will be to move the battery as far forward as possible, look into a lighter outboard and work out a way to store more things up front.

Thanks again!

Scott.
 
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