I need help as I am at a loss. I have searched all over the internet and cannot find anything. I want to mount an outboard bracket, I have a Garelick, and am not sure of some things. I have gone to Garelick's instructions page which is helpful but I have questions. The boat has a diesel inboard and the motor is backup. The bracket will sit off to the side. On a sailboat how far should the prop be below the waterline/hull? The boat is a Fisher 25 and is a Motorsailer. The Garelick instructions seem to be for flat bottom boats because if you follow their directions the shaft length would make no difference as the bracket would just be mounted 5"s higher for a 25" than a 20". Also the Mount has a 9.5" "drop" when lowered. Any info. Thanks.
Mounting Outboard Bracket
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You're lucky that it's a Fisher 25 with it's flat transom - the double enders would be a real problem to fabricate a mount adapter.
I'd mount it in the best compromise height that gets the lower end well into the water while still allowing you to reach it for control and retraction from the cockpit. I suspect that might be the limiting factor, actually.
If you can mount it so that the bottom of the bracket is a couple of inches clear of the water at rest when lowered, and use a long shaft, I'm sure it will work as well as you could expect.
Another consideration is the angle of the transom itself.. the engines' trim adjustments seem meant for a mostly vertical transom.. you may want a 'wedge' to plumb up the actual mount so that you can use the trim pin to good effect.
Whether or not it's workable from that height is something you'll have to investigate carefully.
Do you have good access to the internal side of the transom for adding a good strong backing plate? How big an engine are you planning on installing?
I do find it interesting that of all the images available online I've not found one with a bracket installed...
I'd mount it in the best compromise height that gets the lower end well into the water while still allowing you to reach it for control and retraction from the cockpit. I suspect that might be the limiting factor, actually.
If you can mount it so that the bottom of the bracket is a couple of inches clear of the water at rest when lowered, and use a long shaft, I'm sure it will work as well as you could expect.
Another consideration is the angle of the transom itself.. the engines' trim adjustments seem meant for a mostly vertical transom.. you may want a 'wedge' to plumb up the actual mount so that you can use the trim pin to good effect.
Whether or not it's workable from that height is something you'll have to investigate carefully.
Do you have good access to the internal side of the transom for adding a good strong backing plate? How big an engine are you planning on installing?
I do find it interesting that of all the images available online I've not found one with a bracket installed...
Thanks for the reply.
To answer your questions.
I have access to the interior of the transom so a backing plate should not be problem and I will use a wedge to make the transom plumb. I am thinking about a Tohatsu 9.8hp w/ 25" shaft and electric start (92.5lbs) but I would rather go with a 20". And also if a 6hp could be used I could use it on my dinghy also but it probably would be too underpowered even though it would only be used for an emergency backup.
I have looked all over for how a mounting bracket works but no one not even the manufactures has posted any videos. I have never seen one in action i.e. mounting, travel up and down and so forth. Thanks again for the reply.
To answer your questions.
I have access to the interior of the transom so a backing plate should not be problem and I will use a wedge to make the transom plumb. I am thinking about a Tohatsu 9.8hp w/ 25" shaft and electric start (92.5lbs) but I would rather go with a 20". And also if a 6hp could be used I could use it on my dinghy also but it probably would be too underpowered even though it would only be used for an emergency backup.
I have looked all over for how a mounting bracket works but no one not even the manufactures has posted any videos. I have never seen one in action i.e. mounting, travel up and down and so forth. Thanks again for the reply.
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It will be difficult to operate without a motor on it.. you'll have problems fighting the springs without the weight of the engine..
It might be worth your while to build a plywood mockup, mount it on that so that you can get an idea of how it works, how far it actually swings down - it would assist in planning the actual install, I'd think.
It might be worth your while to build a plywood mockup, mount it on that so that you can get an idea of how it works, how far it actually swings down - it would assist in planning the actual install, I'd think.
Sounds like a lot of work.
There are pictures of the bracket in the up and the down position on the internet. It was the actual working of going up and down I wanted to see. I want to see what the handle does also. If nobody can point me to a web link as to how it works I will probably just go ask someone at the dock how theirs works. Knowing the depth that the shaft should be in the water/under the waterline is the real question as it is not stated. All Garelick says to do is measure from the engine bracket to the cavatation/airation plate and subtract 2"s and ad that to the waterline distance. It does not really tell you what to do with different length shafts. If you follow that logic it just raises a 25" shaft up 5"s higher than a 20" shaft mounting spot which I'm thinking that that maybe not what the extra long shaft is for. I might be wrong of course.
There are pictures of the bracket in the up and the down position on the internet. It was the actual working of going up and down I wanted to see. I want to see what the handle does also. If nobody can point me to a web link as to how it works I will probably just go ask someone at the dock how theirs works. Knowing the depth that the shaft should be in the water/under the waterline is the real question as it is not stated. All Garelick says to do is measure from the engine bracket to the cavatation/airation plate and subtract 2"s and ad that to the waterline distance. It does not really tell you what to do with different length shafts. If you follow that logic it just raises a 25" shaft up 5"s higher than a 20" shaft mounting spot which I'm thinking that that maybe not what the extra long shaft is for. I might be wrong of course.
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The business of '2" below the run of the hull' is meant for a planing hull. For a displacement hull subject to pitching in waves you want the prop as deep as you can get it. I'd ignore those guidelines for what you're trying to do.
Like I said before, I'd shoot for the bottom of the bracket a few inches above the static waterline and use a 25" longshaft ..
One other thing about your angled transom.. you need to be sure that there's clearance to fully tilt the motor and latch it in the up position.. it's not unusual for the cowling to hit the back of the boat before the latch can engage, esp when a bracket is mounted lower on the transom.
As far as operation goes, you lift the handle up and aft - it releases the notch, push the engine down or let it drop (depending on springs vs engine weight) The notches allow you to select various bracket drops, usually in this case you want the lowest position in any case. To retract, you do the same, push handle aft and lift and pull.
Like I said before, I'd shoot for the bottom of the bracket a few inches above the static waterline and use a 25" longshaft ..
One other thing about your angled transom.. you need to be sure that there's clearance to fully tilt the motor and latch it in the up position.. it's not unusual for the cowling to hit the back of the boat before the latch can engage, esp when a bracket is mounted lower on the transom.
As far as operation goes, you lift the handle up and aft - it releases the notch, push the engine down or let it drop (depending on springs vs engine weight) The notches allow you to select various bracket drops, usually in this case you want the lowest position in any case. To retract, you do the same, push handle aft and lift and pull.
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This link shows a Fisher 25 with an outboard motor mount. If you feel safe aasuming that it is positioned correctly, you can extrapolate from the pictures where to place the mount. My concern would be the outboard interfering with the rudder...
Fisher 25 Motorsailer
Fisher 25 Motorsailer
Thanks Faster and Ericb.
Faster that is just what I was worried about. Not only the handle hitting the transom when trying to release it but also the cowling. The clearance of the prop from the water in the up position is also a concern. That's why a 20" might be a better fit.
Ericb that is a nice looking Fisher. Wish it was mine! It would be nice to see the engine and what size it was and how well it worked for pushing it.
Ah, the cost of paranoia. It ain't cheap!
Faster that is just what I was worried about. Not only the handle hitting the transom when trying to release it but also the cowling. The clearance of the prop from the water in the up position is also a concern. That's why a 20" might be a better fit.
Ericb that is a nice looking Fisher. Wish it was mine! It would be nice to see the engine and what size it was and how well it worked for pushing it.
Ah, the cost of paranoia. It ain't cheap!
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True. I'd rather spend a little time and money making sure my diesel was well maintained instead of
spending more time and money hanging an unattractive bracket off the boat. Got a dinghy? In case of emergency use the dink, with a small kicker you can maneuver the big boat around.
Heck, you can push a 25' boat, even a Fisher, with a yuloh.
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I'd side with the choir here. The Fisher is a motorsailor? OK, that's already got two engines, one set on the masts, the other set below deck. That should be enough. Three engines counts as slightly beyond borderline paranoia for one small boat, unless you are planning to go someplace terribly dangerous on a regular basis. (In which case, wrong boat.)
So rather than screw up the boat, because putting 100# outboard of the transom will hurt the balance and motion, and investing all the time and money for something you should never need, I'd buy a good VHF, a good prepaid cell phone, a good anchor, and a five year subscription to a towing service. Also, a case of wine or rum so I could drop anchor, sit back, and wait for the tow in comfort.
You'll spend more money and have a better time.
If I can't trust an inboard engine, I don't want it on the boat. They're hot, noisy, smelly, noisy, and take up gobs of space. If they won't perform on command...line 'em up and make 'em walk the plank. And if they won't walk, hell, shoot 'em. There's no excuse for a lazy inboard engine.
So rather than screw up the boat, because putting 100# outboard of the transom will hurt the balance and motion, and investing all the time and money for something you should never need, I'd buy a good VHF, a good prepaid cell phone, a good anchor, and a five year subscription to a towing service. Also, a case of wine or rum so I could drop anchor, sit back, and wait for the tow in comfort.
You'll spend more money and have a better time.
If I can't trust an inboard engine, I don't want it on the boat. They're hot, noisy, smelly, noisy, and take up gobs of space. If they won't perform on command...line 'em up and make 'em walk the plank. And if they won't walk, hell, shoot 'em. There's no excuse for a lazy inboard engine.
Soooo, great feedback.
But the choir has started to sing a different song.
Has anyone had experiance with mounting an outboard on the transom of a sailboat?
How far should the prop be below the waterline/hull.
On adjustable outboard bracket is the "swing" for the distance from the cowling to the transom or for how far to lower the shaft into the water? Or a combination of both?
I really think that Faster has answered my questions but anymore input would be helpful. Thank you.
But the choir has started to sing a different song.
Has anyone had experiance with mounting an outboard on the transom of a sailboat?
How far should the prop be below the waterline/hull.
On adjustable outboard bracket is the "swing" for the distance from the cowling to the transom or for how far to lower the shaft into the water? Or a combination of both?
I really think that Faster has answered my questions but anymore input would be helpful. Thank you.
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"How far should the prop be below the waterline/hull."
Below the HULL regardless of the waterline. If the prop can't draw in clean (unrestricted) water from in front of it, it won't work well.
Props in aperatures or mounted below the hull...offhand I think the rule of thumb is that they need to be clear below the hull by at least 10% of the prop diameter. So it is not "how far" in inches but "how far" as a percent of the prop diameter. This to keep the water flowing smoothly and make the prop work correctly.
That might be problematic since even with a long shaft outboard, there will be a cavitation plate on the shaft, intended to be submerged at a certain depth, and the prop may or may not be sufficiently clear of the hull, depending on hull depth. IOW if the boat wasn't intended to be driven by an outboard, it is possible you'll just have to ignore the outboard maker's advice and just get what you can out of it.
The amount of lift, what you call "swing", is simply how far up/down the mount is going to shift the engine. Here again, it just may not work well for you. If the engine needs to be submerged "this far" and when you lift it up it is still two feet below the transom...you can throw out your back trying to bend over and reach it.
So the question becomes, what's the draft at your transom? Is it shallow enough to properly it a long shaft engine, at all? Or are you simply so set on having a third engine that you don't care if it can work well at all?
You'd be better off with a dingy and outboard, stowed when not used. Tied alongside and used as a pusher when or if needed. That's pretty much the standard way of 'emergency' use of an outboard on an auxiliary sailboat, and it works very well.
Below the HULL regardless of the waterline. If the prop can't draw in clean (unrestricted) water from in front of it, it won't work well.
Props in aperatures or mounted below the hull...offhand I think the rule of thumb is that they need to be clear below the hull by at least 10% of the prop diameter. So it is not "how far" in inches but "how far" as a percent of the prop diameter. This to keep the water flowing smoothly and make the prop work correctly.
That might be problematic since even with a long shaft outboard, there will be a cavitation plate on the shaft, intended to be submerged at a certain depth, and the prop may or may not be sufficiently clear of the hull, depending on hull depth. IOW if the boat wasn't intended to be driven by an outboard, it is possible you'll just have to ignore the outboard maker's advice and just get what you can out of it.
The amount of lift, what you call "swing", is simply how far up/down the mount is going to shift the engine. Here again, it just may not work well for you. If the engine needs to be submerged "this far" and when you lift it up it is still two feet below the transom...you can throw out your back trying to bend over and reach it.
So the question becomes, what's the draft at your transom? Is it shallow enough to properly it a long shaft engine, at all? Or are you simply so set on having a third engine that you don't care if it can work well at all?
You'd be better off with a dingy and outboard, stowed when not used. Tied alongside and used as a pusher when or if needed. That's pretty much the standard way of 'emergency' use of an outboard on an auxiliary sailboat, and it works very well.
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8 inches below(minimum) is a standard for the prop to get decent flow
Ill be using an outboard on my "big boat"...some testing soon but honestly its just for on off moorings and the like everything else will be sailing
Ill be using an outboard on my "big boat"...some testing soon but honestly its just for on off moorings and the like everything else will be sailing
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I am doing the Garalick process right now as a matter of fact and I am confused by your issue you note in the OP. The instructions are specific to shaft length and in mention the difference in mounting the sailboat aux vs a planning hull. The reason for different length shafts in outboards is for different hight transoms and the desired depth of the prop. Mine mentioned somewhere the need for sailboats in high seas to have a deeper mounting. Sound almost like we have different instructions.
Funny about the 3 sources of power though. We have had the same conversation here at our house with our 25' boat. We will be sailing somewhere this summer that is often mirror calm (or raging of course) and we started heading down the backup to the backup plan. In the end we are going with better maintenance on the main aux, and having a small dingy instead (or maybe just a second inflatable kayak and we wait till the wind comes back
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