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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Need help:
I am looking at two Morgan 41 O/I sailboats both around the same age and one is in great shape very clean has great service records looks new but is a bare bones has no electronics just a depth sounder and hand help GPS and VHF radio the other one has a chart plotter autopilot wind direction wind speed GPS but it need a lot of clean up and some work before I would take it out.

My question is would you buy a boat that was in great shape and then add the equipment you want and need or get the other one and spend the time and money cleaning and fixing it up??

I have been looking at putting a autopilot 4kv radar and chart plotter and full instruments on and it is a pretty penny. The bare bones boat could sail away today and the other one would need about 3 grand to be ready. Any help on what you would do would be great.

Thanks and fair wind to you all

Knights Dream
 

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My question is would you buy a boat that was in great shape and then add the equipment you want and need or get the other one and spend the time and money cleaning and fixing it up??
At the same price, that's easy. Take the boat that's in the best condition and add what you want/need to it. Don't over-value electronics -- they are relatively cheap, and quickly obsolete.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
The one in better shape is 6 thousand more than the one needing all of the work. I am sorry I did not make that clear
 

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Telstar 28
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I would go with the one that is in better physical shape and better maintained, even if it has less in the way of electronics. Adding what you want to have for the way you're going to use the boat is often easier than fixing what they have to do what you want. Also, you don't have as much to worry about with fewer electronics, since electrical and electronics work is one area that POs often get very creative, often in a really bad way.

The sweat equity and labor of cleaning up the other boat may well cost more than putting in all new electronics in the better looking boat, especially if you are handy and can do most of the installation work yourself.

BTW, most work on a boat is easily done by anyone with half a brain, and the common sense God gave a monkey, since most of the knowledge and skills you need to do the work on a boat are 95% common sense, and about 5% esoteric knowledge, most of which can be gained from books, the internet and with a little trial and error. I'd also point out that if you're planning on going cruising, having done the installations of the electronics yourself will often make troubleshooting any problems far easier than trying to figure out what the PO or the electrician the PO hired did—especially in an emergency situation.

I'd also recommend you read the Boat Inspection Trip Tips thread I started. :)
 

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Aquaholic
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What Dog Said...............

Also, for every two things you can see neglected on the less cared-for boat, there will be 4.367 things neglected that will not be obvious ;-)
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Sailing dog thank you I feel the same way I have sold my house and business and plan to cruse for the next few years so I want a few things that make life better. I have had a bare bones boat before and lost it in Galveston this past storm so this time i want to have the things I want and will need and I thought it would be better to get the clean well taken care of boat.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
AjariBonten Yes I know that there will be so many things I don't see right at first and spend more time and money then I would care to. I like both boats and would not mind ether one that is why I am having such a hard time.

Thanks
 

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Seattle Sailor
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I agree with Sailingdog. Usually the better cared-for boat is also in better shape structually, either because it had not been used as hard, or has been maintained well. I would get a survey, however. Sometimes the owner may do the cosmetic upkeep without ever touching the chainplate he keeps cleaning the rust off of, or keeps the engine spotless but never changes the oil or transmission fluid. Electronic equipment is very easy to add to the boat, and you may end up changing the electronics in a few years on the boat that already has them anyway.
 

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The one in better shape is 6 thousand more than the one needing all of the work. I am sorry I did not make that clear
Even at that spread, I'd take the better maintained boat. More than likely you can narrow the spread in negotiations.;) Good luck!
 

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Telstar 28
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Glad to help...let us know how it all goes.
 

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The LIST prices are $6000 apart. Hard to evaluate your description of the cheaper boat. Is it truly cosmetics or is there much more that is in bad shape? You haven't mentioned the sails or rigging. That could cost a lot more than the electronics. The nice looking boat might have a new coat of paint hiding soft decks and delam!

My point of highliting the LIST price is that if the cheaper boat is truly just in need of cosmetics you might get a much bigger price reduction that might make it a better bargain. Impossible to judge here.
If you do not want to do ANY cosmetic work then the premium might be worth it to you. If the cheaper boat is just in poor COSMETIC condition, I'd low ball offer to see if I could get it well under market value (whatever that is in today's crazy market). You might save $25,000, not $6,000. Add in some elbow grease and you're set to go at a cheaper price.
But all this is speculative without seeing the boats.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
xort:

The boat is in sound shape it has sails that are 3 years old and are stored in bags the rigging is good it does need a lot of cleaning and tlc I went over both boats and found the the cheaper on needs paint and all the storage inside needs a good cleaning and the heads look like they were never cleaned the boat is not in the shape I would like it to be. I know it is a no brainer but like I said they both are a great deal and I will have to spend just about the same on each boat to get the things I want on both.

I just don't know if I want to spend 6 or 7 or 10 grand on electronics and next year they are obsolete I guess that is the part I am having a hard time with.
 

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The obsolescence is often only perceived, and is usually based on poor decision-making up front. If you make decisions on gear based on price versus value, or make choices inappropriate for the type of sailing you plan to do, then yeah, you're going to be shelling out more clams in the future. Buy the right gear, for the right reasons, and it will do what you want it to, as long as you need it to. Will there be a brighter, shinier newer model of GPS (radar, radio, microwave oven, pick your gizmo)with more bells and whistles next year? Sure. BUT, if you buy gear to suit your needs, and your needs don't change, then your gear will not be obsolete.
 

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Knight... I assume neither of these boats has been professionally surveyed yet. My own experience is that on a poorly maintained vessel, a surveyor will find much more than you can see that is wrong. This may allow you to purchase the cheap boat even more cheaply...but it also means a lot of work and time AND even the best surveyors can leave you with some expensive surprises.

I will join the others and say to put your offer in on the more expensive boat...get as good a price as you can...then the survey will allow you to negotiate an even lower price. You may be able to get the boat AND the electronics you want for the price you want. Most Morgan OI's have LOT's of problems at this stage whether they ae visible or not. Hire a local diesel guy for the sea trial with you in addition to the survey.
 

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Discussion Starter · #16 ·
No both of have not been surveyed yet and I do know that I don't know everything and where to look for the hard to find problems. I do like the boat that has been taken care of and know that I can purchase the right equipment for my needs and it will last me the years I plan to use the boat. It is overwhelming that I should get the well taken care of boat and go from there. I knew that deep inside and I guess I just wanted to be told what I was thinking.

Thank you all for the help

Knights Dream
 

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Buy the one in good shape. Listen to Sailing Dog. You are going to have to replace the electronics frequently anyway.

If you're smart - you'll learn how to use a sextant.
 

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Knight's..visited your website to see your intended plans. Was surprised by this:

Building the dream sailboat
I have always wanted to sail around the world and I think I am about to get just that chance. I have just purchased a 41 foot Morgan out Island sailboat and it is in Fort Myers Florida right now and I plan as soon as I can fly down and start working on it and then head off into the sunset.
Sailboat
************

What's the deal??
 

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Discussion Starter · #19 · (Edited)
I made an offer on that boat and was very happy with it then I found the other one and all of the questions started in my head. I just want to make sure I am doing the right thing. I feel that the better one is the clean one and is the right choice.

Like I said before I was asking for some help on if i was making the best choice. I will be headed down on the 4th and have the boat surveyed and go from there.
 

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A boat spartanly equipped with electronics, rigging, and other updates is also a boat with 12,726 less holes drilled into it by PO's with 1,275 different ideas of what would be best - than the boat filled with gadgets and lines.

It's a blank canvas for YOU to decide what is "best".

That's what drew me to my boat. It was well maintained, with few to no add ons from the day it came from the factory.
 
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