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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Seeking assistance..
I'm old school but NMEA 2000 is healpful to me. I'm in the midst of installing Garmin products: 800 AIS, GPSMAP 922xs, VHF 215i Marin Radio, GNX wind and DST log instruments all NMEA 2000. So far no problem.

Q: I've been given a RayMarine st2000 autopilot/tiller. And my boat is of perfect size for this pilot. However, before I brake the box is it possible to mix OEMs? Will st2000 play with wind info from my Garmin in this simple NMEA2000 environment?

I have had some generic responses from good sailors like "birds of the same feather play best".. But with my thin wallet I'd love to hear real facts.
 

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Don't know the specs on the Ray ST2000 but if it does NMEA2000 then, with one minor issue, it will work and share data pretty well with other brands.

I have a very old Ray speed and depth display that only works with the old RM proprietary Seatalk system. But you can get a Seatalk to SeatalkNG converter and the SeatalkNG is the RM version of NMEA2000. BUT RM uses a proprietary plug instead of the more standard Devicenet plug that is used by Garmin, B&G, Simrad and most other companies. BUT you can buy or easily make an adapter cable that will go from the hub that comes with the RM adapter to the NMEA backbone cable.

I can now see my RM speed and depth data on my Garmin plotter and the B&G data display. There are a few incompatibilities but I am reasonably sure that any RM device connected onto an NMEA2000 network will see and share at least all the basic data.
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thank you!
It sounds like I dare to brake the box. I May have additional work but doable. Thanks again mate.
 

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Hello,

As mentioned, the Ray gear will work quite nicely with NMEA 2000. You can do it the easy way or the easier way. If the St2000 tiller pilot is newer and supports Raymarine SeatalkNG then all you need is an adapter cable. It the tiller pilot is older and supports Seatalk then you need the seatalk to Seatalkng converter kit (and possibly the adapter cable). Either way, all components should work well together.

Barry
 

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We just threw out our Raymarine e series MFDs and replaced it with Garmin. Still have the Raymarine autopilot. The Garmin has no trouble giving track offsets to the autopilot. The only thing I "lost" was the Raymarine e MFD's allowed me to start and stop the autopilot from the MFD. Now I have to reach over and press the button the the autopilot to start/stop it. No biggie, but my guess is mixing and matching you loose this "little stuff" that IMHO doesn't really matter that much. The important feature I think is the tracking to a waypoint...... Not sure this will apply in your situation, good luck!
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Good Morning, Barry & Capecodda
Nice boat! Barry. Capecodda if from the cape, I use to live in Marblehead & Boston and were part of the original crew on Schooner Sprit of Massachusetts, b4 moving back to Sweden.
Both thank you very much!
Auto tiller is brand new so I will install and get the adapter cable to start with.
Will pay forward
Göran
 

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Mixing OEMs on the same protocol should work. The problem is when you have a problem. As a DIY, which do you call? When you explain your setup, OEMs naturally want to blame the other.
 

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Per the Raymarine website: ST1000 & ST2000 Cockpit Autopilot Tiller Pilots | Marine Electronics by Raymarine

ConnectionsNMEA 0183 input | SeaTalk

SeaTalk = NMEA0183. SeaTalkNG = Raymarine's proprietary implementation of NMEA 2000 (the connectors are smaller, and this helps to fish wires through the boat). SeaTalk IS NOT THE SAME AS SeaTalkNG.

So the answer is that you will NOT be able to integrate this into a NMEA 2000 network without also purchasing something to bridge (gateway) the NMEA 0183 to NMEA 2000 networks (ex. Actisense NGW-1-ISO-STNG, Actisense NGW-1-ISO-Vesper Marine AIS Transceiver, etc.). You can learn more about Raymarine networking here: Networking | Raymarine
 
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Mixing OEMs on the same protocol should work. The problem is when you have a problem. As a DIY, which do you call? When you explain your setup, OEMs naturally want to blame the other.
We have had mixed vender systems from 9 different vendors on two different boats. The few times where we needed a vendor's technical support, none of them have ever blamed the others. In fact, they appear to accept this mixed system as the norm rather than the exception. They do require one to isolate the problem to the specific unit, but this is basic troubleshooting regardless.

It is limiting to confine ones self with a single vendor for all things. None of them have best in class gear in all departments. Some vendors don't even make gear for some things.

Mark
 

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So the answer is that you will NOT be able to integrate this into a NMEA 2000 network without also purchasing something to bridge (gateway) the NMEA 0183 to NMEA 2000 networks (ex. Actisense NGW-1-ISO-STNG, Actisense NGW-1-ISO-Vesper Marine AIS Transceiver, etc.). You can learn more about Raymarine networking here: Networking | Raymarine
Raymarine sells a small inexpensive converter for Seatalk to STng/NMEA2000.

Mark
 

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I have a ST2000 wired to my NMEA 2000 to NMEA 0183 converter (from yacht devices) and the ST2000 can read wind data fine. It does not send any NMEA 0183 data so nothing on the network knows it is there, thus no control of the ST2000 from the network. Maybe it is better using the old SeaTalk but I haven't tried it (the ST2000 does either old SeaTalk or NMEA 0183). The ST2000 wind mode is really compass mode with the course updated every 30 sec or so. It does not respond quickly to wind changes, but it is OK as long as you keep an eye on it.
 

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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
Thx, I have a weathervane so the auto pilor is for short approaches and other short instances. Sojnds like I can manage with some sort of bridge.. Thx again
 

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The few times where we needed a vendor's technical support
Would you say you have more than the average understanding of these systems? Perhaps more than the average DIY to know which component is really the problem and be able to discuss your reasoning, with the OEM tech, in a convincing manner. If so, I’m sure all will work fine. If not, and one just calls and says it doesn’t work, repair experiences are likely to be much more frustrating and when the tech can’t help the novice, blaming another system to get off the line is in their bag of tricks.
 

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Would you say you have more than the average understanding of these systems? Perhaps more than the average DIY to know which component is really the problem and be able to discuss your reasoning, with the OEM tech, in a convincing manner. If so, I’m sure all will work fine. If not, and one just calls and says it doesn’t work, repair experiences are likely to be much more frustrating and when the tech can’t help the novice, blaming another system to get off the line is in their bag of tricks.
It doesn't really work that way. These systems are pretty much discreet component blocks consisting of an entire instrument. So the troubleshooting just involves isolating the problem to a single unit by taking things off-line systematically. If a DIY'er can't do that, then tech support will suggest how to do it.

The process of installing a DIY system is the exact same thing as troubleshooting one - so anyone who can successfully DIY install has all the skills and knowledge already for troubleshooting.

When I call tech support I actually do just say "it doesn't work", because the one thing tech support hates is someone calling and telling them what they think is wrong. Any good tech support wants to methodically walk the problem down, even if the customer thinks they have already done that.

I would be more concerned about hiring a company to do an entire install blind to me, and then go cruising with it. What happens if something goes wrong, and now you know nothing about the system or how it was put together? You certainly aren't going to be able to rely on that installer anymore outside the immediate area they work in.

Again, I have actual experience and not just presumptions with using tech support on mixed systems, and they do not blame anyone else just to get off the line. It is not their bag of tricks, and I imagine they would be offended by that characterization. All of them have vested interests in helping customers - they are under intense competition for those customers and, because it is so easy now to mix and match, tech support becomes the make or break criteria from a customer's POV. Lose them on tech support, and you've lost them for all the product line, and probably for life.

Mark
 

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As do I. The OP is just going to have to understand these experiences vary.
If your experience is in the past 5-7yrs, then you have a point, or chose a vendor that isn't worth your business. If not, things have changed.

You have stated several times in the past that you prefer single vendor systems, and use professional installers. I'm surprised to hear now that you have a mixed system you installed yourself.

Mark
 

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You have stated several times in the past that you prefer single vendor systems, and use professional installers. I'm surprised to hear now that you have a mixed system you installed yourself.
You really are a dog on a bone, when someone disagrees with your opinion. Your personal anecdotal experience does not prove a case for everyone. It just forms your opinion. I've been boating for over 40 years and you don't know me. I never said I installed the systems where I experienced mixed vendor issues, nor did I say I paid to have them installed. Figure it out what you're missing, if you're so inclined.

Yes, I think there is merit to a professional installer and single vendors, for reasons I've stated. I have no objection to others going DIY or mixing it up, I'm just offering my opinion. If you can't accept that, or simply object to a differing opinion, you'll just have to seethe.
 

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stop bickering please...

Electronics are easy peasy to install. Setting up network communications can be tricky.

A chart plotter / MFD should display (in addition to GPS position on chart):
AIS
radar
data related to selected waypoint
data from wind, speed and depth transducers
data from fluxgate compass

It can / should output data to multiple "4x4" MFDs

N2K is intended to allow interoperability between instruments / devices from different manufacturers,
 

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Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Mates!

Thank you for all support. I will go ahead with mixed system. The auto tiller is a nice to have, been sailing 55yrs without one. The NEMA 2000 is invented for us DIY non tech types and it is dead easy. The tiller has NEMA in and output so advise is to get an adapter for the plug to fit into my new backbone T connector.
Greatful for your help, and once installed and working I will make an update.

Your help will be payed forward

Sincerely, Göran
An old schooner bum:cool:
 
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