SailNet Community banner
1 - 19 of 19 Posts

·
Splashed
Joined
·
572 Posts
Kinda interesting in a historical perspective: The gold that the Spanish stole from Native Americans (all over America, not just the US) should now be returned to....? The Spanish :)
Hey' I want my money back too, the Vikings sailed to north America around 800, and they may have taken some gold too.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,940 Posts
what ever happened to the law of salvage. they should be able to keep it or get a good % of its value, like 50 %.
I've only read a tiny bit of the judge's argument, but I did learn something new: Odyssey, the exploration company, is making a claim under the law of finds, not the law of salvage. Whereas the latter entitles salvers a fee for bringing the wreck up, the former is the one that actually grants ownership. The latter is the one you're supposed to worry about when getting help from another boat -- that entitles them to claim salvage against you, but not finds. I.e., a fee for helping out, but not ownership of your vessel.

Anyway I don't know much about international martime law but it seems unjust unless Spain had been actively engaged in recovering this wreckage for the past two hundred years. If you abandon a vessel (or any property) for that long, I don't think you should get to claim ownership over it, especially if you're a "sovereign" and not a natural person.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,006 Posts
What a rip off.

So the lesson learned here is what ? If you find a valuable treasure full of interesting artifacts, history, etc, you should tell ... nobody ... or they'll steal it from you .. instead you should just quietly recover it, melt it down, and sell the bricks to the highest bidder, is that the message here ?
 

·
Glad I found Sailnet
Joined
·
3,841 Posts
For the law of finds, it looks like they lost the easiest answer, in court. They still have to apeal, which will probably not be overturned, In My Amatuer Opinion (IMAO?).

For the law of salvage, they still have a good shot. That would give them a percentage, perhaps 50% of the find. Again IMAO.
 

·
AEOLUS II
Joined
·
2,937 Posts
What a rip off.

So the lesson learned here is what ? If you find a valuable treasure full of interesting artifacts, history, etc, you should tell ... nobody ... or they'll steal it from you .. instead you should just quietly recover it, melt it down, and sell the bricks to the highest bidder, is that the message here ?
Yep.

No point in preserving antiquities and history.

Just plunder, baby, plunder!!
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
987 Posts
Kinda interesting in a historical perspective: The gold that the Spanish stole from Native Americans (all over America, not just the US) should now be returned to....? The Spanish :)
Hey' I want my money back too, the Vikings sailed to north America around 800, and they may have taken some gold too.
Totally correct. The people of Central and South America, have far more claim to this than the Spanish do. If a judge is going to come down against the finders using modern laws, then he should look at the theft of the gold in the first place.

Totally Mad
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
515 Posts
The ruling was made by a magistrate, who is not a full fledged federal judge. That is why it is couched as a recommendation. Before it becomes effective it must be approved by the judge who has jurisdiction over the case, and he could overrule it. So there are several layers of appeal left. That being said, the issue in the case is a jurisdictional one and the magistrate's decision appears to apply the law as it is, not necessarily as we would like it.
 

·
Banned
Joined
·
5,006 Posts
I'd be looking for some gold pieces in Pizzo's personal (hidden) accounts :)
I think he should put them back where he found them. Or, like, not exactly where he found them, but kinda sorta close, you know, within 30 miles of where he found them. Then let the Spanish government go search for it themselves.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
6,707 Posts
Discussion Starter · #15 ·
What I don't get is, this was claimed to be found in international waters and they are not even sure if it is the Mercedes.

Common sence would dictate that Spain provide proof that it's indeed the Mercedes and that it is in territorial waters, short of that, I'd say they can pound sand and the loot stays here.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
991 Posts
Wow...

I hate government. Government is like a big bully, they see that you found money on the bottom of the ocean, then lay claim to it, and intimidate you with prison. The world needs to change!
 

·
Glad I found Sailnet
Joined
·
3,841 Posts
I think he should put them back where he found them. Or, like, not exactly where he found them, but kinda sorta close, you know, within 30 miles of where he found them. Then let the Spanish government go search for it themselves.
Good idea. Or maybe spread it around a bit - like 1 gold coin every square mile. That should do it.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,940 Posts
I think he should put them back where he found them. Or, like, not exactly where he found them, but kinda sorta close, you know, within 30 miles of where he found them. Then let the Spanish government go search for it themselves.
Actually I think this is a great idea. Better than handing over the product of your labors to the People's State of Spain.
 
1 - 19 of 19 Posts
Top