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Bob, I'll pop up that way sometime, now if I could remember which road on the reservation I did some work on........lower shoemaker, 47 ave, Hermosa beach road are the ones that seem to ring a bell. Could have been Mission Beach road, but that area does not look right on Google.......I'm thinking it was north of the bay.......but many years ago......

Marty
 
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Brent,

That keel would not be that bad of a design around here, dispite all the kelp beds, crab pots etc. I can think of a few more options that would be WAY the heck worst that that one! Try some of the ones with torpedo bulbs!

Marty
 
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From the origami boats site.

Topic: "Construction Time"

Alex Bar: I think there are quite a lot of people here on this group owning a BS yacht.
Does anybody know the average time spent in building the ruogh hull?

I know it depend's on many items (tools,place,weather,ability...) but just to have an idea.

It would be interesting to know the time splited in this way:

1. cutting the sheets (hull,deck,cabin top,)

2. fixing longitudinals, pulling the two half, joining the two half plus transom

3. deck fixing plus cabin top

4. keel plus rudder

NOT the time for detailing
Who would you believe?

Brentswain38: 100 hours is tacking together the basic shell, hull decks cabin, wheelhouse, cockpit keel and skeg . Trim means finishing details like handrails, lifelines, hatches , chocks and cleats, mast step and support , vents, engine mounts, tankage, stern tube , rudder fittings, self steering, etc etc . all of which can be done for a fraction the cost of buying all that gear at retail prices from the ship swindlers. Welding it down takes a fraction the time of bolting down yachtie gear, and is far tougher , more reliable and with zero chance of it ever leaking .
cnc sales (hanermo): I think it was about that-300 hours a basic brent boat in the 10 m range.
but this assumes fast and furious, skills and tools.
And not going for a yachty look, fit and finish.
And no or minimal systems.

Most people seem to spend a lot longer.

You can spend that, and more, on "systems" if you want to.
Plumbing, waste tanks (these are legally mandatory, in the EU and more and more elsewhere), cabling and wiring, electronics etc.

I am of the opinion somewhere in-between.
Hot and cold pressure water if I will spend long times in the boat.
Creature comforts and hotel loads.
But workboat ie industrial systems.

Its about 30x cheaper per results gained to use industrial stuff than "yachty" stuff.
Things like industrial/farm pumps etc.
They also last in offshore use, unlike anything you find in the overpriced yacht store.

For me, I would also add large PV systems and batteries and inverters.
These are really cheap these days at wholesale prices.
And they are by no means necessary, but will add a huge comfort level.
For relatively minimal cost.
About 3000 for large batteries, PV, inverters and controllers, all-in.
Add a small watermaker and you have unlimited showers, drinking water, electronics, lights, pc, etc.
Radar if you want it.

And it very much depends on wheather you will go cruising for real or just spend some time off in the boat, imo.
And if you have family.
And if you want to or need to work. And what work you do.
 
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And this...

Kim: Brent or anyone ...

It could be that I will set a record for taking the longest time to build a 26-footer! It has now been 3 years since I bought the steel and started construction. But that's OK. Rest assured I will eventually finish and launch my boat!
What's the problem Brent? Wait...let's let your followers explain (they're much more credible)...

Paul: 3 years? I have heard of much worse. That is the way it goes....just
keep at it, enjoy the building and one day you will be sailing.
Tom: Hello Kim
Mine went a couple years before sandblasting and had just minor surface
rust, as long as the water doesn't stand anywhere and just runs off it wont
get to bad for quite a while. If it is going to be a few more years maybe
just shoot some cheap primer on it preferably a white
I thought it was 100 hours! What's going on here?
 
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Marty:
I'm a hell of a cook. If you could give me 24 hours notice I could feed you, Mrs. Marty and other Marties in fine fashion.
If you bring kids they can swim in my pool. I just need 24 hours notice.

I am not the AH that some would like to paint me. But I can be.

Smackers:
I think we need to be planning a week next summer. The boys would be in heaven here. I'd really like to meet them. I'd try to cook their favorite dishes. Let's start planning this.
 
"I thought it was 100 hours! What's going on here?"


Maybe just another pipe dream? I read some of the BS builders blogs and nobody was doing it 100 hours. Likely 100 months would be a closer figure?
 
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Marty:
I'm a hell of a cook. If you could give me 24 hours notice I could feed you, Mrs. Marty and other Marties in fine fashion.
If you bring kids they can swim in my pool. I just need 24 hours notice.

I am not the AH that some would like to paint me. But I can be.

Smackers:
I think we need to be planning a week next summer. The boys would be in heaven here. I'd really like to meet them. I'd try to cook their favorite dishes. Let's start planning this.
You got it, Bob. I'm taking the boys to Europe in March (England and Scotland), then will be doing our first offshore sometime that summer. But we do need to get up to your neck of the woods too. I'll look at our summer sched and we'll make it happen.
 
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This is probably the most damning thing I've come across on BS' site:

easysoftware99...: Only a small, elite group of people have the thousands of dollars and spare time available to build.
Yahoo Groups

I think that pretty much sums up how BS boats are not at all for the 99% as Brent claims. They are, according to his own customers, only for the small elite...the 1%.

I had such high hopes.
 
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...........Why would they put all those kinks in if ,as "engineer" Mike Johns implies, shape has little or no effect on stiffness?
You will find many such quotes, given and supported by "engineer" Mike Johns, on BD.net, the site Smack quotes as factual.
You were caught out with dishonesty repeatedly on BD net and driven off by (un)popular appeal, dishonesty seems to be your hallmark these days too and it's getting worse.

Do you really believe all your posts or are you aware that you are getting a name throughout the world as a spin artist never to be trusted?

No body ever attacked you ever for being part aboriginal. BD net is strictly moderated and nothing racist is tolerated. You are simply lying.

The coast guard were never attacked on BD net for supporting you. In fact you tried to imply that a safety check once by the coastguard amounted to vindication of your design. It was simply pointed out that a safety gear check is just that.

Lets come back to shape and stiffness since you have been trying to mock me with that.

It was your contention that shape adds stiffness and therefore no framing was/is necessary on your metal foldup boats. You suggested up to variously 50, 60 and even once 65 feet.

Now read this slowly ……I and others spent some time and effort trying to show you the different between tensile, shear and buckling strength. How a framed thin panel is in tension under load, and is much stronger than a shaped unframed thin panel and why, and how a sheet of steel or stiffener that's bent and fixed under a lot of stress buckles very easily from external loads. The last is a little harder to understand and it appears the whole lot went completely over your head.
The corollary you took from this is that because I said you were misinformed I am therefore saying shape doesn't add stiffness ! That's fairly typical of your level of understanding of engineering.

As an illustration; why did your initial designs buckle and rotate their keels up into the boat on relatively gentle grounding for example?
The answer is that the imagined strength from shape didn't exist and a pre stressed shaped panel has two stable states and the transition is known as 'snap through'.

The solution to this initial design flaw was to add 'framing' by using an inbuilt tank end to strengthen that area. Other parts of your boat designs still apparently damage easily from grounding. So what passes for a 36 footer will not pass for a 60 footer. I also offered to help you ( and consequently your future clients) to alter the design and put a small amount of material in a few strategic places to improve the design considerably. Your response was complete disinterest and a spate of very ignorant attacks on the process of load based design.

I think a lot of this bluster is because you are completely compromised by your past, misinformed advice, posts and publications. Now you are too entrenched in a stinking mire. So you throw lots of mud. But seems everyone is on to you here too.

But lets come back to the fact that if you can't link to anything it's just a complete fabrication. As I gave examples above.
 
I did the steel Tayan 37 for a guy I met at a party. He was an ex pro football player, big. We got to talking and he mentioned he was going to build a steel boat. He said he had the plans in the car. I asked to see them. He produced a set of plans that were so bad I said, " I'll design you a boat for free just to prevent you from building that boat." I think those were my exact words. He said, "Fine, let's do it." I designed the boat.
If I round up some ugly plans, show them to you and threaten to build it, will you design ME a boat for free too? :D
 
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I had a correspondence with Dick Newick about amature building.He said there is absolutley no reason to build an ugly boat,It take takes just as much effort and time to build a boxy ugly boat than one that is well designed from the start, maybe longer because of having to fix all the bad designers crap.
 
Jak:
That has been my point all along. With the exact same materials and same amount of time cutting and welding, armed witha decent set of plans the home builder can build a good looking boat. But if the plans are lacking in detail and care you will have no idea what shapes will arise. If the designer wants to control the design elelemnts of the boat he MUST design!
 
Smack,

showup during August if you can, 2nd or 3rd weekend is the Perry roundezvous at Port Ludlow! I've heard it is a PHun time. I was doing a Pink Boat Regatta so could not make it. Sorry Bob, boobs won out over you! Did raise 1800 or so for breast cancer research!

any way, off to take mrs to breakfast, then meet one of my sons to put a star on the top of the mast, and decorate the boat for the coming best decorated boat contest at the club. Have won 3 yrs in a row! Hopefully someone or two or three will step up and try to out do me. That would be good for ALL the folks that come to the marina to look at the lit up boats in the guest moorage area.

Marty
 
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100 hrs to build a brent boat?!?!?!?! I find that hard to believe. I've heard 40 hrs for a typical 8' pram depending upon how detailed you go with paint etc on one of them. 3 yrs start to finish, thats nothing. took my step dad 30 some years to get a B Garden boat finished! Probably because when building a boat, you can not spend 8-10 hrs a day 5-7 days a week working on it. You do 2-3 hrs here, and there and anywhere, and sooner or later you get finished. Took me a year in 6th grade to build an 8' pram.........

Marty
 
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A former colleague is building a Brentboat... he used the metalworking/welding shop in the college where we worked to 'pull' the hull together... 15-20 years ago. It's still in his shed. I suppose he may well have pulled the hull and had it welded it up in 100 hours - but not 100 manhours...
 
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