[Lemnus]

I have begun my search for a long range bluewater cruiser, but my possession date could be no earlier than April 2017. I am planning on buying a boat that is already substantially ready for off-shore cruising, then hopefully being able to live aboard and take (or put on the hard if I have to) until Nov 2017 to fit out for final west coast departure down south then off to south pacific spring 2018.

This being said, here is my question: does it make sense to buy something I like now and put it in long term dry storage for up to two years, or is it better to wait until I'm closer in? I'm looking to buy in the 32-40 foot range, with sweet spot at 34 feet. Money is not a huge issue if I can store for, say, no more than $500 a month. My main concern is whether storing that long is overly hard on the boat, rigging, and any electronics/cabling, hoses, etc. (I'm assuming proper long term storage protocols are followed).

Is this a common practice to buy and store, or is it simply better to be patient and see some ideal boats pass by and just wait a bit longer? I assume it takes at least three months to find, buy, and take possession of a boat?

Sorry for the long post and questions, but I keep seeing "perfect boats" and wondering whether it makes sense to get something now.

 

[capttb]

I'd wait, all you'd gain is 2 years depreciation and needless expense, save that 500 a month towards purchase
Almost nothing improves with age

 

[Passat]

Buy it now and start working on it. It takes long time to refit the boat. Remember there are no boats cruise ready. I bought year ago and working on the boat getting it ready and it takes long hours, days, weeks to get done things to my standard but I'll get it done. Of course there are project boats and the good ones that needs some attention, the second one is mine but list is going and going on. I have 6-7 years before departure, but the goal is to start sailing in two years and getting more experience. You need to know and go over all of your boat systems to be able fix it in cruise. Boat storage is not much on hard, I have $1750 a year for 42 footer, but I can do all my projects now. When time comes, I don't want to waste it on refit, I'll just go. It's all up to you. Good Luck!

 

[Minnewaska]

Engines, in particular, are not happy with sitting idle for years. At the least, you would want to pickle the motor, by coating the entire interior with an oil designed for storage. Still, it doesn't help keep seals lubricated.

I would only do this, if I found the "perfect" boat and couldn't pass it up. Otherwise, I would wait.

 

[ReefMagnet]

I'd say use the time between now and your deadline to find the "perfect" boat. If it comes along sooner rather than later, so be it. Looking at boats will help establish your baseline of what you think you need and what your really need. The more boats, the better informed you will become.

Oh, and as some above have said... Don't expect to walk onboard, turn the key and vanish into the sunset. Even the best of 'em will need some money and time invested, even if just to add your personal touches.

 

[deniseO30]

Suggestion, spend some real time "out there" find out offshore is what you really want.

 

[Lemnus]

Thanks for the responses. Good feedback. I realized I forgot to include some important information:

I am experienced sailor, so I already know I want to do this, but it is certainly good advice to try something out before committing, so thanks for that.

I live in Colorado now, though, so I cannot realistically gradually work on a boat that I buy now. That's why my plan includes about seven months of fit out time in 2017 prior to my ultimate departure date. I will try to purchase something as "turn key" as possible, then use that window to add/repair/replace what I need for voyaging.

So, if I do buy early, then I really can't do much except just put her on the hard and wait.

This gives rise to another question: is it common for remote owners in my situation to buy a boat, then turn over the fitting out to a third party prior to moving aboard? Obviously, time would need to be made for periodic trips for progress inspections and discussions, which could be arranged. I've read articles about people buying a boat and then having so-and-so fit her out for bluewater cruising. I've assumed that meant they were not present and didn't do the work themselves.

Even if I wait longer (which I probably will), I might still be faced with buying a boat up 3-6 months before being able to move aboard/relocate nearby. So being able to get some things done remotely would still be very helpful.

I wish you could research these kinds of questions better, but unfortunately reviews of hundreds of articles on buying and outfitting always seem to be focused on people who live near their boat if not aboard. The ones that seem to imply remote owners never get into the details of how they accomplished their refits.

Thank you very much for your insights!

 

[Stumble]

Lemnus,

You certainly can contract out the refit, back in my yard days I did this for a few people. But I wouldntrecommend it. First it's expensive, i billed at $100/hr for decision making work and $50/hr for mechanic work while doing this. And there are a lot of decisions to be made. Where to store what, what to carry, how to set up gear,which deck gear to replace, repair, leave as is. It all adds up. Just as an example the last boat I did this for my bill excluding parts came to around $15,000 for a 26' catamaran powerboat. You also wind up walking on a boat that you don't know. Other than the inventory list I provided of where things were stored the owners had no idea how to find anything.

If you want to hire a yard to install gear that's one thing, but contracting out the fit out is a lot different. It also doesn't take that much time. To do equipment installs you may need to budget 2 months, most of which is just waiting to schedule different contractors, to do a contracted refit I would want at least four months maybe more depending on how complete the wish list was, and if it had been planned yet.

To the take theboat and let it sit for a few years just doesn't make sence to me. Electronics are more expensive today than they will be in a few years, engines sit, seals dry out, and a boat not being used just seems to age faster.

If I was trying to get a jump on leaving I would try and schedule the purchase for 6-9 months before I could meet up with the boat. And expect to spend that time with the boat in the yard fixing stuff. Then you may need to store it for a few months while waiting, but at least if you hit a snag it won't change your departure date.

 

[Lemnus]

Thanks Stumble, thoughtful advice. Appreciate the response!

 

[Silversailor]

Stumble's comments are good advice. I suggest being aboard every day and working alongside any yard employees. Then you will see/understand how things go together, problems encountered in the installation, the workarounds, etc. In addition, test everything that is done... over and over. I had a well thought of yard do some work on my boat last winter and, after a week's sailing, they had to redo two of the projects. They told me that they had "tested" everything. Not true.

 

[Minnewaska]

After any major refit, one should shake her down for months, if not a season in local waters, while you still have access to warranty work.

 

[capecodda]

Lots of good advice in all these posts.

We've refit 4 used boats, and had one built 1 new. In each case, we either did the work or were heavily involved with the yard. Even with the new build, we visited the yard incessantly. No matter how good your plan is, there's nothing that substitutes for moving around in the small 3D environment of the boat your refitting or building.

The cost of yard work is high. Around my neighborhood, nearly $100/hr. The quality is highly variable. You need to know who's doing the work. A major refit also requires that you know what you want, and understand the tradeoffs of different design and system choices to the way you use a boat. The answers here are different for everyone. All refits take 2-3X longer than you think they will in our experience.

If you haven't owned a boat before, IMHO you should buy one that starts in reasonable shape, and wait buy it so you can be close by. Then you should live on it as is for a few months, and cruise it locally. Learn the boat on how you'll use it. Then you should start the refit, using a combination of contracted yard work, from yards you've had time to directly investigate, and do as much as you can yourself to learn systems, etc. Then you can take off for the horizon.

I'd allow a year or so for all this if were me, take my time, do it right, and make the whole process fun.

What an adventure. I hope you get to live your dream.

 

[jzk]

Use the time to search for your perfect boat. I can think of no advantage to buying and storing. When you are ready to move, you will find a boat that someone already re-fit.

 

[TakeFive]

What is your actual sailing experience? Some of the plans you state and questions you ask seem to indicate a lack of experience.

 

[krisscross]

2 years is a long time. Lots of things can change. And there is no shortage of good boats and good deals out there. Put your money set aside for the boat into a good mutual fund and every month keep adding $500 for storage. When you are read to buy, you will have a tidy sum, most likely good enough for a lot better boat then your original choice.
Best of luck with your dream!

 

[chuck5499]

Mike you posted something similar 2 days ago and probably had a bit better idea in that posting. Nice that you have taken ASA through 106 and a bit of bareboat charting but to be honest take it from one who did the same. It takes a bit more than that before you set out to cross an ocean. You really do some research and sail the boat a long while before setting off and right now you can not do that for obvious reasons - you are in Colo and the boat is in the ocean someplace.

Next as for outfitting, I can only tell you what we do. NO ONE and i am yelling on purpose, works on our boat without us being there and we help them. Right now i am recovering from shoulder surgery and am getting the boat ready for the summer sailing season in the Med and I can not do the work so I have hired a guy to work on the boat. Most of it i could do if i had 2 arms but I can not but he never touches the boat without me being here and watching and sometimes learning.

Boats do not like to sit. They are built to be used. I would suggest you wait and see where you are when you retire. In the mean time look at boats and go to boat shows and look and see and touch and kick tires as it is kinda like a marriage. You and the boat must get along and you can kiss a few ugly ducklings before the real princess comes a long.

If you want i can meet you in person as i will be in Denver from March 18 to Apr 12 visit family and will have time. And I can give you my thoughts.

 

[Caribbeachbum]

Same spot, shorter time limit. Started looking almost two years ago. I've been treating the passing months as opportunity to bargain hunt. We have the cash to write a check for the boat, which is a good spot to be in. So if we find a bargain, we'll buy it and store it for a few months (up to a year), going to visit, sail, and work on it from time to time, of course.

Here are some things I've noted:

Many sellers appear to pricing their boats extra high in anticipation of low-ball offers. Most (not all) of the brokers I've talked to hinted that the boat might go for a dramatic discount on the ask price.

There are no bargains. At least, not that I've found ... if a boat is listed for say $50K under what I'd expect, it will typically need MORE than $50K in upgrades and repairs. The old adage that "all boats cost the same" seems to be true.

Shopping for boats is fun.

 

[Lemnus]

Thanks for the continued replies, which are insightful. Special thanks to Chuck who has kindly offered to meet with me in Denver when he visits. Please PM me with your travel details, I'd like to have a cup of coffee (or a beer - lots of breweries here now!) and get some more detail from you on your experiences.

The plan I articulated in my "welcome yourself" post and the one articulated above is the same. I am only asking about whether it makes any sense to buy a boat I like now, or wait. My concern was only whether when I get closer, there may be a dearth of boats in my price range and with the features I need. I cannot do a project boat. I do not really have the time. My outfit will be only for the things that I'm missing. My intention is to buy a boat that has been well maintained but actually cruised and has most of the essential equipment for off-shore voyaging already, then repair/replace/install the last remaining items and shake it down on local sails for about seven months until November 2017 (beginning of cruising season in Mexico, then head down into that area to stage for a March 2018 departure for south pacific locales. My plan seems to be in line with what many have done. The twist for me this that I'm presently landlocked so I can't spend two years gradually getting a boat fitted out while I live on her or nearby. I can spend about seven months doing that. But hey, if I can't get it together and miss the season, okay, so I will have to do that. But I'm no spring chicken so losing a year isn't an exciting prospect.

All this said, my own instincts and research were indicating I should just wait until closer in, and that having work done by a yard is possible, but a risky proposition unless you can be present to monitor the work (or have a special, trusted relationship with a particular party). There should always be a decent selection of boats that would fulfill my needs (I've been tracking this for two years now and there are always good boats out there). Thanks for the replies, the majority of which are confirming my own suspicions. But getting input from others, especially those who have faced similar transitions, can be invaluable to my planning process.

Thanks again to all for the advice.

 

[TakeFive]

...There should always be a decent selection of boats that would fulfill my needs (I've been tracking this for two years now and there are always good boats out there)...

I agree that the supply of suitable boats should not fluctuate wildly from year to year. And people here will tell you how much of a buyer's market it is, and that "there are always great boats out there."

However, I urge you not to conclude that any boat is the "perfect boat" from online listings without going to see it first. 80-90% of the boats that you see online will be in significantly worse shape than the listing and pictures show.

This is especially true in your case, because you're not just looking for a serviceable cruising boat. You're looking to cross oceans with only a few months for refit and shakedown. The odds of finding such a near-turnkey boat are considerably longer, and you're going to visit a lot of junkers before you find one. You may want to plan some travels to the coast over the next couple of years to get a true idea of what is really out there. Online shopping is not going to be sufficient.

 

[Stumble]

Lemnus,

The one exception I can see is if there is a specific boat you want,and it's rare, and there happens to be a good one for sale now... But honestly without a lot of experience cruising it would be hard imagining creating such a specific wish list.

When Beowulf went up for sale for instance it might have been worth it to snatch her up since she is unique and quite special. If Estar hit the market... And I am sure there are more. But note I am thinking of specific hulls, not serial produced boats. And frankly putting either of these on the hard for two years might break some international laws on the usage of exceptional cruisers.

Otherwise just give yourself enough time to refit once you are there, then shakedown before leaving. Seven months may be a little tight but doable. It depends on the condition of the boat when you get her. Major system issues like replacing tanks or engines takes some time, refitting deck gear takes a lot less.