[bll30148]

I'm thinking about changing both my main and jib halyard to line from the original wire/line mix. I'm thinking about replacing them with 5/16" line. Does anyone know if the sheaves at the mast head will take 5/16" line?

Thanks.

1971 Columbia 26 MKII

 

[Minnesail]

I am contemplating the same switch on my Catalina 22. In my case the sheaves need to be changed to accommodate 5/16" line.

 

[christian.hess]

you do not need to change sheaves out...unless you really want to

new line is quite a bit stronger and less stretchy for the same diamater, SOOOOOOOOO

if you want to save some $$ especially on smaller boats, switch out the wire rope halyards to a 1 size down all line halyard...

cheers

 

[socal c25]

I am going to do the same on my Coronado 25 BUT I am going with 3/8 as its easier on the hands AND I have the lines ready to come back to the cockpit, cabin top winch and rope clutches. I do have to change the sheaves cause I don't want my lines ruined by the grooves, I am also going internal and coming out the bottom of the mast. The red line in the pics is a fake just to line things up.

 

[hriehl1]

I considered the same change, but then realized that when the sails are raised, the entire run under stress is all wire except for the final 18 inches at the mast cleat... and 18 inches of line, no matter how old, can't stretch nearly as much as a full-run of new all-rope halyards will. Yes, my lines are old and a bit dirty, but the wire portions are still fine and in the final analysis I could come up with better ways of spending boat money.

If you race, wire has less wind-resistance too.

I'm not trying to challenge your thinking... but just share a conclusion I reached from the same circumstances.

 

[RichH]

Use non-stretch modern polymer line such as 'dyneema', or 'am-steel' etc. Typical daron polyester is simply too 'stretchy' to be used for halyards, especially if you heavily load-up your halyards to affect good sail shape and to hold that shape during 'heavy' wind conditions to prevent the sail(s) from 'power-ups'.

The only problem in replacing with polymer is if your current wire-rope halyard has a 'ball' swaged to the wire and the 'ball' fits into into a special 'ball cleat' to hold the wire tension (instead of a horned cleat).

 

[SloopJonB]

I despise wire running rigging. Unless your halyard is all wire, the sheaves are configured to handle both wire and line. Changing to all line the same size as your existing tails is a matter of joining the tail of the old to the head of the new and hauling them up & over. I've done it many times.

 

[Minnesail]

I despise wire running rigging.

What are the minuses to wire running rigging? What do you gain by changing it out?

 

[christian.hess]

you dont gain anything...only reason to replace is if they are fraying.

if you do replace I would recomend going 1 size down...no need to go same size since line today is much stronger per same size

thats just me though

 

[JimsCAL]

Just replaced the wire/line main halyard on my Cal 33 with all line. Went with New England VPC which is a "mid tech" line. The cover on the old halyard was in bad shape in several spots, so it was time. Never considered staying with wire/line.

 

[SloopJonB]

What are the minuses to wire running rigging? What do you gain by changing it out?

The minuses are that it is too thin to get a grip on, you can't clearly see crossed lines at the top of the mast and it has meathooks that tear sails and your hands. On top of all that it requires rope to wire splices that you will almost certainly have to pay for since few owners can do them.

You gain the loss of all those things by changing to all line.

 

[socal c25]

All rope halyards are good enough for me, I just cruise and I am not looking to squeek out an extra quarter knot. If the halyards stretch it was probably cause I had em too tight to began with (bad habit). With the lines aft to the cockpit I can always adjust them as needed.

 

[Zarathu]

Dynema is stronger than steel, with about the same stretch, and so much easier to use, if you have to have something at least equivalent....

 

[Sonofasailor1760]

My SeaScouts Tanzer 26 jenny halyard is wire line combo. To change out headsails crew must reaqch up s to 4 feet to hold halyard shackle. We sail her int he winter and it can blow. Safety concern is reason for switch. Youth overboard in winter is not good. The mast head sheaves are for wire and are VERY thin. Impossible to run line. The Mastehead separations between halyard sheaves makes in a machine shop task to change out the diamer/width. We do not race and sail her maybe 20 times a year. I was thinking about rigging a yoke under the forestay and attaching a very strong block. Presently we end up with about 3 feet of wire to deal with once we raise the jennys. Any ideas that wound necessitate $$$$$$

 

[Stumble]

Change over to line instead of wire. I know you said the sheave is too small, but it isn't. Even if you don't want to change the sheave just replace the halyard with the same size dyneema line with a larger piece of some cheap line as a tail spliced in.

It will end up being at least as strong as the wire it replaces, with less stretch and less weight.

 

[WoobaGooba]

Just replaced the wire/line main halyard on my Cal 33 with all line. Went with New England VPC which is a "mid tech" line. The cover on the old halyard was in bad shape in several spots, so it was time. Never considered staying with wire/line.

Same here. Same boat. Replaced aging main and jib wire/rope halyards with VPC. Several years now, no regrets.

 

[hriehl1]

Stumble. Are you saying wire stretches more than the typical line one might use for a cruising boat halyard? I find that hard to accept.

I would also question line having a weight advantage, and there is no question wire has the windage advantage.

Just mark me down as one who is fully satisfied with my old wire/rope halyards.

 

[Stumble]

Stumble. Are you saying wire stretches more than the typical line one might use for a cruising boat halyard? I find that hard to accept.

I would also question line having a weight advantage, and there is no question wire has the windage advantage.

Just mark me down as one who is fully satisfied with my old wire/rope halyards.

Then you need to take a look at modern lines.

Just some quick numbers...

..................Size......MBL (lbs)........weight.........price/ft
7x19ss wire..1/8".....1,600........... .0304lbs/ft.... $.32
Dyneema......7/64....1,600........... .003lbs/ft...... $.21
Dyneema......1/8".....2,300........... .005lbs/ft..... $.34

Stretch is a little complicated to figure for wire, but in the size we are worried about dyneema has about 95% the stretch of 7x19wire.

So it's lighter, stronger, has less stretch, and costs less. Plus it will never meat hook. If you want to use wire feel free, but it really doesn't work anymore.

 

[christian.hess]

both have benefits...new rope stretches as little as wire back in the day

however both types have advantages I for one dont mind wire rope at all and find them easier to use in some cases...

the weight of wire in very windy scenarios makes it easier to grab a lone stray halyard, it also free falls faster...

the very thick end rope or tailing rope feels great in the hands

wire up against the mast has less windage, of course it can and will scratch a nice paint job...

in most cases wires are less likely to kink and get stuck, again because of weight and the difference in flexibility.

anywhoo

meathooks suck big time...but if you dont have a meathook enjoy it till it does! jajaja

 

[hriehl1]

Comparing wire to 1/8 Dyneema, I will grant your point. But I don't wanna raise my main and jib hauling on 1/8 inch line... ouch.

Comparing weight, windage and stretch of wire-rope to something like all-line VPC (cited here a couple times) and the comparison is less favorable. And Sta-Setx would be even worse.

I will concede that wire-rope halyard's days have passed, but while mine are still intact I am fine with them.