[captain jack]

This is interesting Propane is not now, nor has it ever been unsafe on boats. People are unsafe and do stupid things every day. Maintain your stuff and it will serve you.

care to expound on that? if there are things that ca be done to make sure nothing like that ever happens on my boat, i will think about the propane option a bit more before i totally rule it out. however, i have read a lot f posts that really don't support propane being a 'safe' fuel and after seeing that burnt out husk at the marina ( and picturing having been my boat ) that sinched it for me. but i'm always willing to listen to the voice of reason.

 

[captain jack]

One word:

kerosene!

wouldn't a kero cook stove stink like a kero heater? and what about the fumes? kero heaters can kill you. kero is safer to handle than, say, gas.

 

[christian.hess]

Aye, there's the rub --- "when done correctly."

It only takes forgetting, or being distracted, or a leak in the line filling you bilge while you are cooking, ONCE to make for a really bad day.

so you can run an inboard and maintain it but not a line(hose)?

I mean there are installations here and I use tanks down here that are plastic hose, 2 stainless clamps and a valve...they last for years and years and years with absolutely no issues if you have a little grey matter between your ears...

what is hard about replacing a line every 2 years?

you can have a leak in the propane and be cooking and still nothing happens at all...I have done it when cooking at the beach house and you smell it...all you do is replace the valve or line next time you cook

on a boat having fan in the bige is stupidity and you are making something SO SIMPLE so complicated

its the potential sparks of said fan(especially if not a brushlessmotor) that would ignite propane

all you would need to do if you smell gas is simply open bilge and wave a pillow and the gas will flow out

I mean come on guys

 

[Puddin'_Tain]

...
failure cause of dumbass installations or bad useage was what caused problems

...

Even the best equipment, installed correctly, can fail. Beyond that, even the smartest people do dumb things from time to time; particularly when tired, or distracted. Now, can you honestly tell us that you've never been tired or distracted while sailing?

 

[christian.hess]

care to expound on that? if there are things that ca be done to make sure nothing like that ever happens on my boat, i will think about the propane option a bit more before i totally rule it out. however, i have read a lot f posts that really don't support propane being a 'safe' fuel and after seeing that burnt out husk at the marina ( and picturing having been my boat ) that sinched it for me. but i'm always willing to listen to the voice of reason.

captain

its a shame you saw that but please do some reseacrh and see what caused it...ask him if need be...or the police report or whatever

propane is not unsafe...by any means and its one of the simplest installations and jobs to do on a boat

its just hose, clamps some tubing...and a valve or solenoid if you want

KISS

 

[christian.hess]

Even the best equipment, installed correctly, can fail. Beyond that, even the smartest people do dumb things from time to time; particularly when tired, or distracted. Now, can you honestly tell us that you've never been tired or distracted while sailing?

im not saying that man

geeze

 

[Puddin'_Tain]

so you can run an inboard and maintain it but not a line(hose)?

I mean there are installations here and I use tanks down here that are plastic hose, 2 stainless clamps and a valve...they last for years and years and years with absolutely no issues if you have a little grey matter between your ears...

what is hard about replacing a line every 2 years?

you can have a leak in the propane and be cooking and still nothing happens at all...I have done it when cooking at the beach house and you smell it...all you do is replace the valve or line next time you cook

on a boat having fan in the bige is stupidity and you are making something SO SIMPLE so complicated

its the potential sparks of said fan(especially if not a brushlessmotor) that would ignite propane

all you would need to do if you smell gas is simply open bilge and wave a pillow and the gas will flow out

I mean come on guys

Sigh.....

Do what you want. I'll just use a stove that that is safe without relying on anything else.

 

[barefootnavigator]

First off lets look at safety. You have a better chance of dying from brushing your teeth "fluoride" or dying in your car "read statistics" than you do from being blown up from a properly maintained system. If you are not comfortable with any fuel definitely don't use it. Life is too short to live it having doubts about the safety of your boat. I'm not a fan of anything electric on a boat but thats just me. Kill those batteries and you don't get your mooring coffee, half way to Hawaii and this could cause a mutiny. Once you leave the states you will not find alcohol as Hess commented or CNG, you will however find propane in the most BFE places on the planet and its cheap. I housed my entire line in PVC tubing to protect it from me being an idiot at the throwing my knive collection... at it. I plumbed it fasted to the underside of my deck so it was as safe and out of the way as possible. If the tank valve fails, It can happen. You still have the stove valve. Blow through a straw and you will create 100 times more pressure that is coming through the regulator, very low pressure system. It stinks to holy heaven, I can't imagine how anyone could miss a leak. One last note just because you get a leak doesn't mean your boat will blow up. You have to be an extra special type of moron to blow your boat up with propane.

 

[Puddin'_Tain]

im not saying that man

geeze

But that is the point. Propane is only "safe" if everything works correctly and/or the operator does everything he/she should. While the latter is true for all fuels, the chances of screwing up with a non-pressurized stove are FAR less, and even if you do the fumes are far less likely to cause an explosion and/or fire.

 

[bljones]

I like the simplicity of my non- pressurized alcohol stove. Yeah, lower energy potential than Porpane, but unless you do all of your cooking on high flame, the actual difference is pretty negligible on a small burner, small footprint marine stove. An over or a large footprint burner would be a different story.

another advantage of a small alcohol stove is the "hoseless" portability. want to do a fondue or grill night with friends in the cockpit? Bring the alcohol stove outside, put it on the cockpit table, and you are good to go.

Another "safe" alternative is small butane ranges. 2-Burner Butane Countertop Range / Portable Stove with Brass Burners

Not as durable as a stainless steel alcohol range, but at the price, you could buy one a year for 10 years before the cost difference is eaten up.

 

[captain jack]

My Boat came with CNG. I like it so I've never converted to propane. I know it's not readily available, but I have had no difficulty filling up here in the Northeast U.S. Perhaps with the resurgence of Natural Gas, CNG may become more readily available in the future. Who knows.

that's an option i hadn't heard of. one question. since it's compressed under high pressure do you have to worry about someone dropping the cannister and it becoming a missile, like an oxygen tank?

 

[christian.hess]

Sigh.....

Do what you want. I'll just use a stove that that is safe without relying on anything else.

Im not being argumentative here but what is your ARGUMENT?

electric is the simplest but they do have thier issues if that what you have good for you...

I can say the same to you sigh do what you want

I just dont see what your argument is

I mean I can argue if you have an electric stove that your chances of death by electrocution are much higher or that shorts are more dangerous etc...

same for electric inboard installations when people accidently short the 48, 72, or 96 battery bank it can be deadly but thats not an argument AGAINST electric is it?

you can die there...so what is the argument?

is it that propane is unsafe?
if that is your argument than simply put you are wrong...

if you want to argue that there are better fuels including eletric then I would say you are right up to a point....

practicallity, installation, cost are all issues needed to be considered

what captain jack was asking was based on a recent event regarding propane and an explosion or fire...

if that is enough to scare him off than that is his issue...it would be interesting though to see the cause of the fire...

anyways

whatever method you use be smart and prudent thats all I can advise at this point

 

[barefootnavigator]

BJ I'm currently using this system as I rebuild my galley and they are great but also VERY dangerous and have a history of blowing to high hell. We have a ten minute max before we enter the danger zone. That being said when we took a knock down this summer "captains fault" we taco'd the stove, our second lost stove to date "captain needs to install reef lines" and it was about 24 bucks to replace. Finding fuel can be a challenge. I would guess I have used these about 1500 meals to date and love it minus fear of early entrance to heaven

 

[christian.hess]

that's an option i hadn't heard of. one question. since it's compressed under high pressure do you have to worry about someone dropping the cannister and it becoming a missile, like an oxygen tank?

hows this for an example

at my restaraunt(small) we use 25 lb and 35 lb propane tanks with simple valves bougt at the hardware store

we had a tank that failed...the internal seal of the tank failed NOT the valve or connector...

yes it was scary for my female cooks who went bezerk and screamed out of the kitchen

I grabbed the tank and took it outside to leak away

you want to know what the propane dealer did to stop the leak?

he grabbed the tank and held it up high over his head and procedeed to smack the top of the tank straight down into the concrete

and bingo the leak stopped...

no jaws type flying oxygen tanks exploding in mouths type stuff

if that were to happen on a boat just let the tank leak till it stops...

 

[captain jack]

The option that I chose, and that nobody here has mentioned so far, is an electric galley. I have a Ceran 4 burner stove and oven aboard which is quite energy efficient. Baking bread or other things in the oven takes a lot of power to warm up, but once at temperature the electrical use is miserly indeed.

An electric galley requires a hefty inverter and a good sized battery bank if one doesn't want to fire up a generator in order to bake or cook, but I'm glad I went that way and have no propane in the cabin (I kept the propane tanks and they are hooked up to the BBQ outside and all of the interior tubing is in place but not connected.

Electric Galley on Zanshin

i was wondering if electric was an option. at home, i prefer electric stoves. natural gas can kill you.

i won't be needing an oven, just a stove top. heck, i never could get bread to rise when i have tried baking it, anyway.

i wonder how bad a draw electric stove tops are....

 

[captain jack]

CNG (compressed natural gas) is another good option because it is lighter than air and can't accumulate in the bilge. However, it can be difficult to find outside of the US.

that probably won't be an problem here in the chesapeake. i will definately have to look into that further. i googled it and wiki says it's being used to fuel transportation on a growing basis around the world so maybe he is right about CNG being a fuel for the future.

 

[barefootnavigator]

I should ad that I cruised the west coast for three years in my Flicka using a double burner non pressurized alcohol stove with zero complaints other than finding fuel. Not trying to say propane is best choice, just not a bad one.

 

[TQA]

Just for info there has been a tragic accident where a long term cruiser has been found with severe injuries next to a burning yacht off the coast of St Vincent. He died.

A propane gas explosion is the likely cause.

Diving instructor believes British yachtsman John Garner's death was an accident | Mail Online

 

[captain jack]

On my Allegra 24 I had no sniffer and no cylinoid. I plumbed it myself so I knew it was good. I had one continues fuel line from stern mounted tank to oven. When I wanted to cook I turned it on half turn open. When I was done cooking I shut it off and let fuel burn out of line. These are very low pressure systems and 100% infallible when done correctly.

that makes that option sound a lot safer. trouble is, i have interior storage space but very little outside. where to put the tank might be an issue. although i don't consider myself an idiot and i am always safety minded when i do stuff, things happen. if there are fuels to use that have less of a chance of things happening, then those are better options. murphy's law is always a consideration.

 

[captain jack]

captain

its a shame you saw that but please do some reseacrh and see what caused it...ask him if need be...or the police report or whatever

propane is not unsafe...by any means and its one of the simplest installations and jobs to do on a boat

its just hose, clamps some tubing...and a valve or solenoid if you want

KISS

you are right. i should check on that. i don't know the details. all i know is that he uses propane and it went up because of the propane. i don't know what he was doing at the time and i don't know the condition of his system. he used it all the time, thougj, because he was a live aboard. it wasn't a case of a boat that sits developing an issue that just didn't get caught.

i admit, freely, the sight of that completely burnrd out boat was a bit shocking and made me think more than twice about the issue of cooking fuel. it's an issue i never had to consider on a boat, before. there wasn't really anything that could be saved on that boat. it was, quite litterally, toast.