[captain jack]

A safe diesel stove has not been mentioned. The Wallas diesel cooktop will cook totally odorless as well as provide thermostatically controlled heat. No exposed flame. There is a kerosene single burner and the 2 burners are diesel. They use very little fuel and are push button start. The electrical draw is minimal. With the lid up you can cook. With the lid down they heat the boat.

another option appears. very little fuel. minimal electric draw. multi purpose. safe. i will have to check that one out, too.

 

[captain jack]

the wallas cook top is a great option, if i had that kind of money. can you find those used?

over 2k for a new wallas set up. around 300 for a new origo. big difference. although the wallas has some serious benefits, incuding boat heat, the price is out of my range unless i found a good used set up.

cookmate sells an origo knock off for 230. single burner for 176.

 

[captain jack]

http://www.sailnet.com/forums/gear-maintenance/130737-safe-cooking-new-post.html

here is an interesting GOB article. getting ready to read it now.

http://duckworksmagazine.com/12/howto/stoves/index.html

one from duckworks. not very applicable to my situation but interesting.

 

[captain jack]

after reading farther into it, CNG doesn't sound that much safer than propane. after reading all of the posts and everything i have found on the web, i am no closer to making a decision. no wonder there has been such contention in this thread.

 

[captain jack]

CNG does have the major advantage that, being lighter than air, it can't settle in the bilge.

true

 

[captain jack]

It was just another suggestion - or fuel to the fire. The gimbaled kerosene stoves would be a better choice, like Atom's. Atom Voyages - The Atom Kerosene Stove

Anyway, back to cooking my chicken dinner in my force 10 propane stove.

that's cool. $535 for one burner is a bit much. at that rate, if you add the burners up, i could afford te wallace kero cook top.

 

[captain jack]

Just talking about Safe cooking is not safe! How much are YOU going to cook ? Do you have refrigeration ? Is most of cooking heating canned food, Or fish you catch ?
Is a Coleman type propane or the Gimbaled one burner above enough ?
How about an all portable Stainless two burner propane camping stove ?
You & loved ones gonna bake cookies & cornbread ? How about a Breadmaker ?

simple meals would be nice. the icebox should keep stuff for a weekend, especially if the meat starts out frozen. canned stuff for longer periods, i would assume. not much of a fisherman, since i grew up, but i guess that's an option. don't need an oven. just a few burners.

something for dinner or lunch or breakfast for a day on the water, a weekend, a week, a time period living on board. i have the galley space so i'd like to be able to cook real meals, if i like; by which i mean meat and a side dish.

 

[captain jack]

These cooking stove discussions seem to produce enough "heat" to brown up some croissants. (sigh...)

One little fact that is missing from several replies is the amount of heat one can get from a burner for any given fuel source. Note that a 5250 BTU burner (in my Origo 6000 range) heats your food the same as any other burner rated for about the same BTU's.
Matters not whether it burns alcohol, Kero, diesel, or electrons.


I have used our Origo Non-Pressurized range for almost 20 years, and before that a propane system for about 9 years.

Prior to that I tried to learn to get along with the Primus kero stove in our prior boat, but was not able to learn enough Swedish swear words to make it behave (?). It was the legendary "Chichester" Model. My abilities were less than legendary, and a liveaboard friend eagerly bought it from me. He loved it!


I have been on a lot of deliveries over the decades with pressure alcohol and would not want it on our boat. Too dangerous.
While ANY fuel and system can be mastered and made safe (except maybe that contrary Primus!), and I do confess to liking a well-maintained LPG system, the simplicity of the Origo is just wonderful.

*Sidebar: there is actually an extremely easy way to refill the canisters. No spills and no hassle.
It's been mentioned on these forums elsewhere, and if someone wants, I can put it in a reply again.

Regards,
Loren

yes please. the more i learn the closer i get to deciding that path.

 

[captain jack]

The thread starter (captain jack, right?) has a Cal 2-27. I don't think he'll be doing a lot of international offshore cruising on that boat.

almost right. it's a cal 27 but not a 2-27. mine was the first incarnation of the cal 27; the pop top version. all three cal 27s are completely different.

 

[captain jack]

ok

dont see what the boat has to do with cooking fuel type

you win I guess

i would suppose that he is saying the fact that alcohol is not readily available or economically prudent outside of the U.S. is unimportant as i probably wouldn't be blue water sailing in this boat.

 

[captain jack]

Did you know that water can cause drowning? Nope, won't have that on my boat. Too dangerous.

i kind of thought the purpose of a boat was to keep water out. otherwise, you'd be swimming ( or drowning ).

 

[captain jack]

I guess the point becomes that there are a variety of safety hazards onboard. You could sink, catch fire, receive a blow to the head, inhale toxic gases or choke on a olive. I think the danger of propane is very low compared to the other dangers onboard. Propane has a distinctive indicating smell and with certain precautions can be handled safely. An accidental jibe because of a wind shift has more potential to injure myself or my guests. If the world scares you, stay home.

a person could use that argument against a person that thinks a motor is a necessary piece of safety equipment on a sailboat. do you happen to have a motor?

and, i'm willing to bet you have the usual boat load of technological gadgets on your boat. sailing without GPS and all the rest just wouldn't be safe, would it?

but, because i want to choose the safest fuel to use in my bloody stove that means i am too scared to sail so i better pack up and go home?

to quote don casey: "On a boat, LPG is also, by far, the most dangerous cooking fuel. "

check it out:
i built my own chopper. it has no front brakes. no rear shocks. a rake of 50 degrees. and a right hand suicide shifter. i love to ride at beak neck speed on twisty roads. i'm not exactly a timid guy. however, i'm not dumb enough to stick a hand grenade up my butt, with the pin pulled, and ride down the road hoping my sphincter can hold the lever in so it doesn't blow my a*# off.

give me a break.

 

[captain jack]

I get that bud...sprry if it sounded like a snip

get whatever fuel you have best access too and enjoy the most...you have options up there so that is great for you

I just didnt see what the boat model had to do with anything but obviously if youre not ever going to travel with the boat at least overseas then yeah no issues with alcohol

having said that I posted before that even when I was in berkeley not every place had alcohol...and west marine was way expensive and it was more of a hassle than simple propane

for whatever thats worth

hope you find a cooking method that suits and pleases you

its very apparent that you have OPTIONS

i wouldn't say you sounded snippy. just like you were feeling a bit attacked annd it's no wonder. this thread has, like so many threads, gotten a bit hostile from time to time. i know we all have a passion for sailing but i'm not quite sure why that almost always has to turn into conflict and hoatility any time there is more than one opinion voiced.

everyone has an opinion and the purpose of threads like this is to hear as many of those opinions as possible to help in making an educaed decision. not sure why the multitude of opinions means hurt feelings or hurled insults( you know, because i'm obviously too chicken s%$# to sail because i want the safest fuel possible so it's not my boat i find burned up at the marina).

anyhow, you are right. i have learned i have a number of options to choose from....and that is good.

 

[captain jack]

Outbound... I'll take it you've never been around or exposed to induction stoves or ovens... let's just say I can place my hand directly on the stove surface while it is running about the only thing that will happen is smearing the black onyx surface with my hand oils... try that with a regular electric stove and I understand how your second shift crew would be burnt. Doesn't and will never happen on the surface of an induction stove... So in reality your rant doesn't apply here. As I mentioned my next boat will be entirely induction stove/oven and I see marine units are already hitting the market... but why wait? As mentioned I have my Honda 2000 but never ever ran it to make a meal using the induction stove. This is after all on a 25 foot boat... why the criticism if it should plainly work on a much larger boat with generators charging the batteries and hefty solar panels charging, and Torquedoes up the rear charging away?

that's one heck of a safety feature.

 

[captain jack]

Or does this have to do with your girlfriend again? Scared she is going to blow up the boat? Come to think of it, there are a lot of hard surfaces around too, better get out the foam padding.....

oh, yes. that's right. because i was thinking of fabricating a jib boom and going self tacking i was just destined to be a powerboater before long. funny. it's been 18 years, sailing, so far and i've never even used a motor on a boat, before.

i'd love to know why you are so easily offended with how i consider outfitting my own boat? what's it to you? i'm not telling you how you should set your boat up. you don't hear me implying that you are a non-sailing pansy if you use a motor to leave and return to a dock. i figure it's your business. but, obviously, anything i consider about my boat IS enough of your business for you to take offense and fling fairly blatant insults about my fitness to sail.

no. it has nothing to do with safety while i am on the boat. i figure i am competent enough to handle that. i am worried about getting that phone call from the marina. i already saw one black and burned out shell of a boat at the marina, this year. i don't want them to call and tell me that mine has met that fate.

again, i think it's foolish to totally ignore the fact that propane is the most dangerous cooking fuel on a boat. i think it's just a point of wisdom to explore the options. you know...not just be a sheep and do the same thing everyone else does because everyone else is doing it.

i have to wonder, are you threatened by people who consider different options than you or just easily butthurt if everyone doesn't automatically do things the way you do?

loads of boats have used, and do use, jib booms and self tacking jibs. that's a fairly traditional set up. lots of people use fuels other than propane. does it also bother you that there are people converting their 'perfectly good' bermuda sloops to junk rigs? do facts like these keep you awake at night? is that why keep popping up in my threads telling me i don't have gonads enough to sail?

i can't tell you how many times sailors in bigger boats have told me they thought i was crazy to be sailing my little dinghy out in wind as heavy as i often do....just think what they'd think if they knew that i don't know how to swim. but, you're right. i'm too timid to sail. i better sell all three of my sailboats.

 

[captain jack]

Jack, given your boat, budget, and aspirations, I'd say go with the alcohol stove. Why go through the expense and space to put in propane? All fuel is dangerous to one degree or another and as you can see by this discussion, the differences are getting down to hair splitting. Boatus says propane is safe as evidenced through the claims they payout. I have owned boats with alcohol for 13 years and propane for 15. I had one fire with alcohol and so far, none with the propane. My experience may not be everybody's. But I don't see it as the fuel for you. Nor do I see coal as your fuel (the cooking fuel of choice for over a hundred years before kero took over).

coal. boy that would take up some space on board and cause some real soot.

actually, if i was to decide to go propane i'd want an outside tank locker and i really don't see the room for that, on my boat. it would just take up too much space. i do think that pressurized alcohol will be my best bet, as you said.

 

[captain jack]

There is one gimbaled Wallas but you lose the heat function. There is no blower lid as when the lid is up the stove tips back. Pot holders are available for all Wallas stovetops.

i have to say that i really liked the wallace diesel stove. if it was affordable, for me, i'd have gone that route. i could have put the tank where the old gas tank is, now.

 

[captain jack]

I'm not telling anybody to do anything, I'm just suggesting this level of paranoia is absurd and if you can't handle a little risk maybe having a boat is a bad idea. Maybe stick to stuffed animals and saftey scissors.

paranoia? it's a simple question about cook fuel options and safety. there are a lot of articles and threads on the web about the cooking fuel safety issue. that would indicate a lot of other people are also 'paranoid' about that issue, i suppose.

 

[captain jack]

With a Wallas you can either draw from the main tank on a diesel powered boat or use a portable tank. Most often the portable is in a locker below the stove. It is sealed and safe.

i definately thought it sounded cool. especially the fact that it cooks and provides heat. multipurpose. plus, diesel is easy to come by. but don't have 2K to spend on a cook top. if i did, though....