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Discussion Starter · #21 ·
OP, while we're on the topic of Albergs and seaworthiness, I'd like to mention some other areas you might consider. Chainplates and their gussets is an area to upgrade. The stock ones are anemic at best, and undersized (as you probably know already). I built up all the gussets with glass cloth and epoxy, made them very thick and better adhered to the hull, then made 2" wide by 1/4" thick bronze chainplates. I used big 1/2" bolts and nuts in them (bronze as well of course). They were rock solid and the deck would pull apart before they would. I can post pics if you're interested in seeing them.

Also worth noting is portlights. The A 30 has big windows and we had planned drop boards (never got to it before selling though). We took the original cast aluminum frames and wrapped them in glass cloth and epoxy, then used thicker than stock glass and through bolted everything. Sealed everything including portlights above the waterline with butyl. Never a single leak with that stuff. Also, as you can see in the pics, we added four round opening ports - one in front of the V, two just forward of the main cabins big ports, and one large one on the rear bulkhead. The ventilation they provided was very much needed, as the A 30 interior is a floating basement.

We took the seaworthiness thing (exterior wise) pretty far. We sealed up every through hull except for the scuppers, I made each compartment inside the hull an epoxied water tight bulkhead containment area in case of a holing, etc. I have pics of all this stuff if you're ever interested in seeing it for your own research.

The A 30 is a great boat, but honestly I don't know if I could recommend to anyone to go too far work wise on one. After we finished, I kind of wished I'd just bought a Bristol Channel Cutter and hit the road right away (sea I guess).
Yes I am very interested in seeing pics of the mods you mentioned.
Much appreciated.
 

· Bristol 45.5 - AiniA
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If you are planning the boat for offshore use, i would suggest that places be made up with a particular function in mind. Having dual function often means that neither function is done well. For example, I would make the v-berth into storage only and give up on it being a place to sleep. In this way you can optimize for storage of bulky items like sail bags and spare anchors. You might want to have your chain locker under this area. Having the chain close to the mast is a good thing. Similarly, I would not have a quarter berth. It will be used mainly for storage and will not be terrific for storage or sleeping. Your sleeping accommodation will be just be the settees. Take time figuring out lee cloths, ventilation, and lighting for the the berths.

Use LEDs for the interior (and exterior), the power savings are wonderful. I would not go with either an outboard or electric drive. In five years of cruising I have not seen one electric drive. There are times you need to motor a fair distance. You can live with an Atomic 30 but a diesel is much preferred. Chris's point about the difficulty of installing a particular vane is a good one. We tend to think about how the unit fits on the outside of the transom without considering the inside. We chose a Monitor because it was relatively easy to install on a transom with many hoses and a major reinforcement. We could not have used a Cap Horn for example. BTW, very pleased with the Monitor after 30,000+ miles. It has done well. Also you see more Monitors in isolated places than any other vane - not to say the others aren't up to it. For a boat your size I would not go with an Aries - big and heavy and technology has advanced since it was designed.
 

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I like the low (er) profile as apposed to the Cape horn. some of the other vanes take up the whole stern. Almost looks like enough space for a swim ladder. How well does it steer? Is the cost and spare parts comparable to the Aries or Cape Horn?
you mean like the monitor OIL PLATFORM? aka windvane

even the aries seems smaller out back

whenever I get a boat that needs a windvane again Ill go the norvane route

I became a huge fan when they came out...

im good now with my sayes rig on the islander 36 yet to test it out though:(
 

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im an aries fan true and true and despite what is said about wieght they arent that much different than the monitor...

in any case
 

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Discussion Starter · #26 ·
im an aries fan true and true and despite what is said about wieght they arent that much different than the monitor...

in any case
I guess some designs of wind vanes work better on some boats than others. I would rather have something than inspires confidence in its robustness crashing around the ogie for days on end....
 

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Discussion Starter · #27 ·
Well, here are some pics, hope they help and inspire your Alberg journey!

Bronze CP's, cut not drilled yet. Old ones in pic for perspective:



Installed, G10 for backing plates:



Glassing/epoxying portlights:



Faired out, painted and installed:



I laminated the scupper through hull mounts this way, then epoxy coated them. Thought being if it ever cracked or got compromised, it'd be unlikely that both pieces would crack as the grains were opposing (plus it just looks cool):



5200, the one application of such dastardly stuff:




Laying down the Kiwi Grip, we love that stuff and can't say enough good things about it:








Pic are great!:) I never thought of using bronze. good plan. I scrounged up some thick ss though. Thicker and go with longer bases for the lower front shrouds. Saw a pic on the alberg site. I lolve the windlass. nice piece of kit...She has a nice air of elegance to her....
 

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I guess some designs of wind vanes work better on some boats than others. I would rather have something than inspires confidence in its robustness crashing around the ogie for days on end....
this is very true...a barn door rudder or deep attached rudder needs and is best with a trim tab

a sayes for example has been known to work well with skeg inboard rudders

on a spade choose your poison

beleive me Im not knocking the monitor...however they do have some flaws revealed as usual in heavy weather sailing...mostly to do with welds and strength here and there

the aries before the monitor was the golden standard

I loved the 2 I have had...they are very very strong, just be careful and oil them and dont crack the castings...this is were an aries suffers...as its harder to fix than an all stainless vane like the monitor or norvane for that matter.

there are many nice windvanes these days to choose from

there are many threads on here where the models have been refferenced.:)
 

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Discussion Starter · #29 ·
If you are planning the boat for offshore use, i would suggest that places be made up with a particular function in mind. Having dual function often means that neither function is done well. For example, I would make the v-berth into storage only and give up on it being a place to sleep. In this way you can optimize for storage of bulky items like sail bags and spare anchors. You might want to have your chain locker under this area. Having the chain close to the mast is a good thing. Similarly, I would not have a quarter berth. It will be used mainly for storage and will not be terrific for storage or sleeping. Your sleeping accommodation will be just be the settees. Take time figuring out lee cloths, ventilation, and lighting for the the berths.

Use LEDs for the interior (and exterior), the power savings are wonderful. I would not go with either an outboard or electric drive. In five years of cruising I have not seen one electric drive. There are times you need to motor a fair distance. You can live with an Atomic 30 but a diesel is much preferred. Chris's point about the difficulty of installing a particular vane is a good one. We tend to think about how the unit fits on the outside of the transom without considering the inside. We chose a Monitor because it was relatively easy to install on a transom with many hoses and a major reinforcement. We could not have used a Cap Horn for example. BTW, very pleased with the Monitor after 30,000+ miles. It has done well. Also you see more Monitors in isolated places than any other vane - not to say the others aren't up to it. For a boat your size I would not go with an Aries - big and heavy and technology has advanced since it was designed.
I concur with having a diesel powerplant. lucky for me the boat came with a yanmar 2gm20. I had to make it fit. pretty easy actually. need to change the prop as the 6 pitch for the old atomic 4 is a little weak she goes but slow.(a pals boat not mine) I do have a preference for norvane and capehorn vanes but you bring up a good point with monitors. If these are more common then I surmise, parts might be easy to come by in remote places either by hook or by crook, facilitating faster reparability if necessary. Thank you for comments
 

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Discussion Starter · #30 ·
this is very true...a barn door rudder or deep attached rudder needs and is best with a trim tab

a sayes for example has been known to work well with skeg inboard rudders

on a spade choose your poison

beleive me Im not knocking the monitor...however they do have some flaws revealed as usual in heavy weather sailing...mostly to do with welds and strength here and there

the aries before the monitor was the golden standard

I loved the 2 I have had...they are very very strong, just be careful and oil them and dont crack the castings...this is were an aries suffers...as its harder to fix than an all stainless vane like the monitor or norvane for that matter.

there are many nice windvanes these days to choose from

there are many threads on here where the models have been refferenced.:)
Yes. Stainless can be welded fairly easily. cast not so much. Although I have my favorites I am still doing my homework on windvanes but first gotta get the darn boat together..:D
 

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Discussion Starter · #31 ·
I never liked the Cape Horn on an Alberg, only for the fact that you lose the entire rear locker to house it's bits and pieces. Looks amazing and probably works amazing, but an entire locker being lost on such a small boat? Just for a clean looking vane? Nah.

The Norvane (imo) is a great bang for the buck. The monitor is great, but IIRC about twice the price.
It is a noble piece of kit but a boat with limited space storage is a premium, I have to consider the options...
 

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Yes. Stainless can be welded fairly easily. cast not so much. Although I have my favorites I am still doing my homework on windvanes but first gotta get the darn boat together..:D
let me know if you need any help with the 2gm20

is it the f? fresh water?

we loved ours on my h28 back in the day

most reliable diesel I have ever had the pleasure of working on

bang bang bang bang all day long
 

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... I do have a preference for norvane and capehorn vanes but you bring up a good point with monitors. If these are more common then I surmise, parts might be easy to come by in remote places either by hook or by crook, facilitating faster reparability if necessary. Thank you for comments
Don't get any vane based on the assumption that you can get parts anywhere, other than from the manufacturer. In less remote places you might be able to find a machine shop to fabricate something, but the standard routine is to have a spare parts kit from the manufacturer. BTW, Monitor parts are not cheap but you can't go down the street to find replacements for custom bits so they got you. On the other hand, the company is there and very responsive with help.

Before you get too far into your choice look to see where you would run the control lines.
 

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Discussion Starter · #34 ·
let me know if you need any help with the 2gm20

is it the f? fresh water?

we loved ours on my h28 back in the day

most reliable diesel I have ever had the pleasure of working on

bang bang bang bang all day long
Thanks for the offer. I shall. The engine is not the F model it uses coolant. The engine has not been fitted yet. I have made some initial test trails with a mockup of the engine I made out of cardboard. The forward mounts were the issue so I lag bolted thick aluminum to enlarge the mount point. Basically replicating what I have read on the alberg site. I was concerned about space but the engine will fit nicely. She will get a new prop shaft and I plan to re-bed the stern tube just to be safe.
 

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Discussion Starter · #35 ·
Don't get any vane based on the assumption that you can get parts anywhere, other than from the manufacturer. In less remote places you might be able to find a machine shop to fabricate something, but the standard routine is to have a spare parts kit from the manufacturer. BTW, Monitor parts are not cheap but you can't go down the street to find replacements for custom bits so they got you. On the other hand, the company is there and very responsive with help.

Before you get too far into your choice look to see where you would run the control lines.
So true. no substitute for the right parts. at this stage of the game I am assessing the virtues of the various designs, pros and cons and so forth. eventually I will make an informed decision, I have lots of time so no point in rushing. This project won't be in the water for at least a year. Still have to sell my Hinterhoeller 28 yet....
 

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Thanks for the offer. I shall. The engine is not the F model it uses coolant. The engine has not been fitted yet. I have made some initial test trails with a mockup of the engine I made out of cardboard. The forward mounts were the issue so I lag bolted thick aluminum to enlarge the mount point. Basically replicating what I have read on the alberg site. I was concerned about space but the engine will fit nicely. She will get a new prop shaft and I plan to re-bed the stern tube just to be safe.
thats the engine the f stands for freshwater running off a heat exchanger
 

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I would start with a couple of assumptions. One is that all boat design is a series of compromises. And, two, that a whole lot of the design of the interior may already be optimized. What it is optimized for is the question. Take the tankage for example. Having tankage under the V-berth may increase hobby-horsing, however, moving it under the settees will reduce easily accessible storage space. There are some good books about offshore sailboat considerations by Beth Evans, or Nigel Calder. However, a lot of the recommendations they make are based on much bigger boats.
 

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Personally I think the biggest mistake made with 30 odd foot boats is the v-berth. My old 28'er, a variation on an H28, had the v-berth pushed so far forward it was all but impossible for two people to get comfortable unless one was a compete runt. Even our later 34'er was not terribly comfortable up front, especially in summer.

Were I to go back to something in that size range i'd settle for two really comfortable saloon berths. Not much good if you wish to indulge in a bit of rumpy pumpy but in my old 28'er I found that the companionway boards across the cockpit made for excellent al fresco amusement.
 

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these recent posts are spot on, some boat ARE maximized and optimized for what they were intended to do interior wise...one such boat that comes to mind is the cal 40 with various bunks, another is the westsail 32

my h28 like tdw says had a vberth that was good for storage, and that was it

on small boats I have seen the triple berth setup where the interior going in basically becomes a queen bed across the girth...jajajaja

not bad for late night fun I guess
 
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