[Bruce3966]

I have owned many power and fishing boats but I have had enough. Sold them and the camper and want a sailboat. I have sailed before but never being the sailer, just a ride along. Love the peace and quiet however...here is my dilema. I am about ready to buy a sailboat and it will be less than 18 feet for I need too be able to tow it. I refuse to pay Michigan's unGodly charges for a slip for just 5 months of use plus I want to go to all three of the Great Lakes which are within an hour from me.

Being that I am not a expert sailer and being I need it to be under 18 feet, I am looking at a Com-Pac 16, Precision 16.5 or the P18. After I study both for awhile it seems the Precisions are faster and better in wind but the Com-Pac with it's 400 lb ballast is safer. Have recently read some horror stories on the Precisions easily turtling but the Com-Pac with it's heavy ballast does not. From the exeprienced sailers on here, for a newbie such as me, do you think I should go with a heavier boat such as the Com-Pac 16 that isn't the fastest and doesn't turn that well in the wind or the Precision 16.6 or 18?

 

[westsailpatti]

I would go with the Com-Pac 16 because there is a cabin and a bow sprit . I see that the Precision 16 has no cabin . But you mention you would consider the Precision 18 , it looks nice and 2 more feet is a lot on a boat . Question , what size slip are you talking about and how much is it a month ? When we first started out we were considering a trailer but decided to go with a slip . Reasons were when we were done sailing we didn't want to pack up and go home , we wanted to BBQ and spend the night . Some times we didn't sail at all but we were still on the water . Our first boat was a O'Day 23 . Not under 18 , but it was trailer boat .

 

[Bruce3966]

I should have stated the Com-Pac 16.5 which has a cabin. It just seems like for a newbie the heavier the ballast the more stable the boat in higher winds...am I correct? I am assuming so. I am limited to about 2000lbs total towing capacity however I know auto manufacturers over rate (or at least I think so) their towing capacity and I do understand the issue wth short tow vehicles and long towables. With that said, I love the Precision 16.5 however I have read many capsizing articales in winds just at 15-20knots. The Great Lakes get that all the time.

Slips in Michigan to buy are well over $10,000 for a 20 footer and to rent for the year is about $2500--crazy for 5 months is use. The state of Michigan rents Harbor slips for $700 a year which I would do in a minute however there is a huge waiting list for available slips. The state also has available transient slips at all harbors so what I thought I would do is launch, sail up or down the coast and stay a night here and there in a transient slip. I just need to figure out what boat under 18 feet (or should I say under a displacement weight of about 1300lbs (leaving another 300 lbs for gear etc.--max 1600lbs) would be best for me to tow with a 2000lb tow capacity AND be it a safe boat at least until I have 3-4 years of sailing under my belt.

I also work from home and the transient slips allow for a 14 day stay so I could stay and work from the boat for a few weeks as long as I had wifi. I would just send the wife home to get back to work.

 

[capta]

Though it's a foot longer than you mentioned, the Rhodes 19' is absolutely the best first boat in my opinion.
They can be had fairly inexpensively (or not), have a very roomy cockpit, are very stable and as safe a boat as one could hope for in that size. And they've been around for over 60 years, so it's not like they are going to fall apart if you bang into a dock or a rock as you learn to handle her.
It's an easy sail plan to sail, alone or otherwise, and there may be enough in your area for racing, should you wish.
I believe they are easily trailered, but that is way beyond my expertise, so you may need advice from others on that.
These boats have been standard in sailing schools for many years and are extremely forgiving to newbie mistakes. You could not do much better than having a Phil Rhodes designed boat to sail.

 

[Bruce3966]

I made an offer on a P 16.5 and it was accepted. It's a super clean boat and looks like new in and out. My ONLY concern is the safety on the Great Lakes. Of course I won't be out in gale force winds but we all know how the weather can change in a minute over the Great Lakes and oceans so I don't ever want to be stranded (or worse). Of course I would monitor the weather and I don't plan on sailing 5 miles out. Probably just a mile max out and up and down the coast from harbor to harbor.

Boat details:Halyards have been led back to the cockpit. Several coats of epoxy have been applied to the bottom as well as a ablative last year. The topsides and deck have been waxed regularly and she's been primarily dry sailed. The interior cushions are in excellent condition.

Equipment: She comes with a highway trailer, 3hp motor (professionally serviced in 2013), main, hanked on jib and 150, jib rollers, lazyjacks, Cunningham, line hangers, compass, windex, clinometer, custom teak Harken traveller, 'teak and holly' style cabin sole, solar battery charger, porta potti, paddle/boat hook, life jackets and more. She also has a tiller tamer, tiller cover and sail cover.

 

[Bruce3966]

Cockpit view

 

[PaulinVictoria]

Congratulations on the new tub, have fun

 

[krisscross]

Looks like a nice boat, congratulations!
Safety wise, you need to keep in mind wind strength and waves height. For wind, you need to reef early with this boat (lots of sail area for displacement and shallow keel), and drop the jib quickly if need be. For waves, I would make me a good set of proper boards to secure the companionway. That plexiglass is nor as secure.

 

[jwing]

That looks like a great boat.

I recommend that you install a jib downhaul as one of your first improvements. Going up on that little deck to lower the jib is pretty scary at times. A downhaul is an inexpensive and easy-to-install safety/convenience feature.

 

[Bruce3966]

Looks like a nice boat, congratulations!
Safety wise, you need to keep in mind wind strength and waves height. For wind, you need to reef early with this boat (lots of sail area for displacement and shallow keel), and drop the jib quickly if need be. For waves, I would make me a good set of proper boards to secure the companionway. That plexiglass is nor as secure.

Thansk for the info. The last thing I want to do is capsize or turtle my first time out.

 

[Bruce3966]

That looks like a great boat.

I recommend that you install a jib downhaul as one of your first improvements. Going up on that little deck to lower the jib is pretty scary at times. A downhaul is an inexpensive and easy-to-install safety/convenience feature.

I agree and will start searching for one. Is there a better one to get than others or are they all about the same?

 

[Arioso]

I suggest a Rhodes 19. Best bang for buck, stable and sails nice! Shop around and examine your true current need. Towing can get expensive and setting up a boat every time from a trailer will make you take up golf! whatever it is you better be in LOVE with it. Go to sailing school!

 

[Bruce3966]

Where is a good place to go to purchase sailboat equipment etc.? I would really like to install lifelines on my boat and several other things such as the jib downhaul people speak of.

 

[jwing]

Don't buy a jib downhaul; make one. It's easy, simply search the net to see how it works. You'll need a length of rope (no need to get fancy) tied to the uppermost hank, a pulley attached at the same place your forestay is attached, another pulley somewhere (like at the base of a shroud), and a cleat of some kind near the cockpit or mast. Run the line down through the first pulley, back to the second pulley, then back to the cleat.

At the dock, hank the jib to the forestay, but don't raise the jib. Have the downhaul and both jib sheets cleated tight. That way, the jib will be ready to raise, but not fall over into the water. When you get out in open water and your main is raised, release the downhaul and the sheets from their cleats, raise the jib, trim the lee sheet and you're sailing!

Coming in: point your boat into the wind; center the jib with the sheets, then cleat them; pull on the downhaul and the jib will fall to the deck. Cleat the downhaul and your jib will stay put until you can safely retrieve it.

 

[Bruce3966]

Don't buy a jib downhaul; make one. It's easy, simply search the net to see how it works. You'll need a length of rope (no need to get fancy) tied to the uppermost hank, a pulley attached at the same place your forestay is attached, another pulley somewhere (like at the base of a shroud), and a cleat of some kind near the cockpit or mast. Run the line down through the first pulley, back to the second pulley, then back to the cleat.

At the dock, hank the jib to the forestay, but don't raise the jib. Have the downhaul and both jib sheets cleated tight. That way, the jib will be ready to raise, but not fall over into the water. When you get out in open water and your main is raised, release the downhaul and the sheets from their cleats, raise the jib, trim the lee sheet and you're sailing!

Coming in: point your boat into the wind; center the jib with the sheets, then cleat them; pull on the downhaul and the jib will fall to the deck. Cleat the downhaul and your jib will stay put until you can safely retrieve it.

Half of that I understand and half is greek. I have a lot to learn but love sailing and love learning. I'll be reading every night until May--first sail!

 

[SHNOOL]

Duh just saw this thread... cool picts!

 

[miatapaul]

Looks like a fine little boat. Should be fine on the big lake, just watch your weather forecasts and don't take it too far out till you are comfortable with it. Looks like a great boat to learn on. While the Compac would have been more stable, this one will react to sail trim changes really quickly so you will learn better what does what.

 

[Bruce3966]

Looks like a fine little boat. Should be fine on the big lake, just watch your weather forecasts and don't take it too far out till you are comfortable with it. Looks like a great boat to learn on. While the Compac would have been more stable, this one will react to sail trim changes really quickly so you will learn better what does what.

I was between this and a Com-Pac but after reading reviews, the main complaint on the Com-Pac was sluggish handling and poor response especially to windward. I know the Com-Pac has a 450 lb ballast compared to the P16.5having a 250 lb ballast so hence the faster response. I think half the time I will be floating and just enjoying the water. I just have always needed to be near, on or in water. I love the Great Lakes for their beauty with no salt or sharks!

 

[Siamese]

That'll be a nice little starter boat for you. You've made frequent mention of the great lakes. I've been sailing on Michigan inland lakes and Lake Michigan for around 35 years. From my perspective, your Compac is going to be much more enjoyable on Michigan's many inland lakes than on one of the five great lakes.

You'll be able to take advantage of it's ease of trailering and visit any number of inland lakes, where you'll encounter plenty of variety. And challenges.

Yes, it will sail on the big lakes, but in my opinion, is not entirely appropriate for that purpose. Not saying you shouldn't do it, but as you gain experience, it would be a big surprise to me if you actually found one of the big lakes is more enjoyable than one of the inland lakes.

 

[Bruce3966]

That'll be a nice little starter boat for you. You've made frequent mention of the great lakes. I've been sailing on Michigan inland lakes and Lake Michigan for around 35 years. From my perspective, your Compac is going to be much more enjoyable on Michigan's many inland lakes than on one of the five great lakes.

You'll be able to take advantage of it's ease of trailering and visit any number of inland lakes, where you'll encounter plenty of variety. And challenges.

Yes, it will sail on the big lakes, but in my opinion, is not entirely appropriate for that purpose. Not saying you shouldn't do it, but as you gain experience, it would be a big surprise to me if you actually found one of the big lakes is more enjoyable than one of the inland lakes.

I bought the Precison 16.5, not the Com-Pac. What inland lakes are you referring to--just curious? I know of Burt, Mullett, Torch, Hardy Dam (if you want to call that a lake)--what other lakes with harbor slips for overnight stays or mooring for over night stays? Just curious what I am missing here. Moved here 15 years ago from Minnesota and don't know ALL the inland lakes yet. These would have to be lakes that are deep enough to not have to worry about running into submerged stumps etc.