I would never go out on the Great Lakes without a ship-to-shore radio. My new sailboat does have a battery and a solar charger but I am thinking about getting a hand held radio but not sure how strong they are. I will never be past 2 miles from shore if that. Any thoughts from experience on the two?
Ship-to-Shore radio (handheld or wired)
-
SailNet is a forum community dedicated to Sailing enthusiasts. Come join the discussion about sailing, modifications, classifieds, troubleshooting, repairs, reviews, maintenance, and more!
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
- Reaction score
- 9,138
A full size mounted VHF is cheaper than a hand held VHF
Also:
It transmits at 25 watts instead of 6 watts
Range is dramatically further
Is DSC so has a distress button
Much more robust, will last for years.
A hand held is fine for crew to talk to each other along the dock but stuff all use at 2 nm range.
Finally, you say you will be up to 2 nms from the coast. But the coast station may be miles away along the coast.... Or the vessel you are trying to call.
Also:
It transmits at 25 watts instead of 6 watts
Range is dramatically further
Is DSC so has a distress button
Much more robust, will last for years.
A hand held is fine for crew to talk to each other along the dock but stuff all use at 2 nm range.
Finally, you say you will be up to 2 nms from the coast. But the coast station may be miles away along the coast.... Or the vessel you are trying to call.
Thanks for the advise. I was looking at a mountable one with 25 watts for about $150. I didn't think that was too bad. As in all past motor boats I have owned, I always carried an extra deep cycle battery with me so I guess with having that I won't have to worry about having power to run the radio.
I assume all wired radios are 12 volts correct (or at least molst of them)?
I assume all wired radios are 12 volts correct (or at least molst of them)?
Joined
·
1,480 Posts
- Reaction score
- 585
Might depend on where you are buying it, but in the USA, yes, you'd have to put some effort into finding anything other than 12 volts.
My understanding is that talking to each other along the dock with a marine VHF is illegal. They are for boat to boat use, only.
- Reaction score
- 9,138
No doubt you are correct, strictly speaking. But who would be the radio nazi competent enough to work out if its a boat calling a shore party?
Indeed I dunno anyone who has been caught fir just about any missuse of a VHF... There must be some for false Maydays, but anything menial?
Ships use them on docks often.
Mind you, in the USA you probably have more enforced rules so I think the best option is to buy 2 handhelds, one for the dinghy trip, and a land legal handheld for when you get to shore
I agree but your cell is what you are likely to use in a real emergency.There are also two way text and call epirbs that are getting cheaper.I think Practical Sailor had a thing about them a few months ago. Technology is zooming so shop around but if your batteries go down think , what's the option?
Joined
·
5,936 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,965
In a real emergency on the water my cell is not my first choice. Marine radio is. Whatever a "real" emergency is.
Joined
·
3,345 Posts
- Reaction score
- 1,280
It must be VHF buying time...
I've been on both sides of the coin. Have had my fixed VHF crap out because my house battery smoked, and have had my portable smoked for the same reason.
I bought a cheapo portable at one of those "overstock" hint, locations for $50 with charger and batteries. It also took regular AAs... So I'd use the rechargables, but kept spare AAs on the boat if I needed them. I've used both the VHF AND my cellphone for "emergencies."
I define emergencies as not just issues I have with my own boat, but also those that others around me have had, and I've needed to relay info to authorities.
I'd say if you already have a house bank, to get a decent fixed VHF as your first line of defense, but then when you get some more $$ (ha!), buy a cheapo portable for a ditch bag (as a backup).
Oh and for Pete's sake don't use the portable for ship to crew communications. If you have to have that kind of communications then get a GMRS, or FRS pair of radios, also can get those cheap at those overstocked stores.
I've been on both sides of the coin. Have had my fixed VHF crap out because my house battery smoked, and have had my portable smoked for the same reason.
I bought a cheapo portable at one of those "overstock" hint, locations for $50 with charger and batteries. It also took regular AAs... So I'd use the rechargables, but kept spare AAs on the boat if I needed them. I've used both the VHF AND my cellphone for "emergencies."
I define emergencies as not just issues I have with my own boat, but also those that others around me have had, and I've needed to relay info to authorities.
I'd say if you already have a house bank, to get a decent fixed VHF as your first line of defense, but then when you get some more $$ (ha!), buy a cheapo portable for a ditch bag (as a backup).
Oh and for Pete's sake don't use the portable for ship to crew communications. If you have to have that kind of communications then get a GMRS, or FRS pair of radios, also can get those cheap at those overstocked stores.
Joined
·
2,634 Posts
- Reaction score
- 1,047
Hey,
What gave you that idea? You are allowed to contact the coast guard station, that is certainly not a boat. What about when you need to hail a bridge tender or lock operator? What about when you contact a marina to get a slip assignment? Those are all legal and legitimate uses of a VHF radio.
You can also use a VHF radio to contact passengers and crew to arrange pick up and drop off points. You should not use the radio like a telephone to just have idle chit chat, but it's not just for boat to boat use. Don't use channel 16 for those items, switch to a working channel.
Lastly, I think that for the original poster, a hand held radio makes far more sense than a fixed mount. True, the fixed mount radio may be cheaper, but when you add in the cost of an antenna, cable, connector, and all that, a good handheld will be cheaper and easier. If your 5watt handheld doesn't have at least a 2nm range something is wrong!
Barry
Joined
·
13,619 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,046
A $150 "base" VHF radio will probably require another $150 in cable, antenna, and going aloft to install it. I would hate to count how many times I have pulled my h/t out of my bag and used it when someone's base mounted radio was fubar.
The SH HX851 is being clearance at ridiculous low prices on Amazon and even lower at thegpsstore.com who also advertises on Amazon. It would be a not totally illogical consideration.
"My understanding is that talking to each other along the dock with a marine VHF is illegal. They are for boat to boat use, only. "
Generally. But in the US the FCC allows for a (shh!) secret "Multiple Use" VHF portable license. Similar to the "portable" ships station license, which allows use from any "ship", the multiple use portable license is for dockhands, bridge tenders, chandlers who may be asking "Yeah, but WHICH big white boat are you?" and others. Of course that means BUYING a license at the normal exorbitant rates, but they do exist.
The SH HX851 is being clearance at ridiculous low prices on Amazon and even lower at thegpsstore.com who also advertises on Amazon. It would be a not totally illogical consideration.
"My understanding is that talking to each other along the dock with a marine VHF is illegal. They are for boat to boat use, only. "
Generally. But in the US the FCC allows for a (shh!) secret "Multiple Use" VHF portable license. Similar to the "portable" ships station license, which allows use from any "ship", the multiple use portable license is for dockhands, bridge tenders, chandlers who may be asking "Yeah, but WHICH big white boat are you?" and others. Of course that means BUYING a license at the normal exorbitant rates, but they do exist.
The FCC did. You are right that it is OK to call land from a boat, with a ship-station license. However, it is not legal to operate a marine VHF from land, without a marine utility station license. I quote :
"Using Hand-Held Marine VHF Radios on Land
You must have a special license, called a marine utility station license, to operate a hand-held marine radio from land -- a ship station license IS NOT sufficient. You may apply for this license by filing FCC Forms 159 and 605 with the FCC. To be eligible for a marine utility station license, you must generally provide some sort of service to ships or have control over a bridge or waterway. Additionally, you must show a need to communicate using hand-held portable equipment from both a ship and from coast locations. Each unit must be capable of operation while being hand-carried by an individual. The station operates under the rules applicable to ship stations when the unit is aboard a ship, and under the rules applicable to private coast stations when the unit is on land."
Joined
·
2,634 Posts
- Reaction score
- 1,047
Joined
·
5,666 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,423
"I just got to Bobbies - anything else I need to pick up that isn't on the list?"
*grin*
Donna is spot on. Cell phones are not a good answer for marine emergency communication.
MarkSF got this spot on. I have a marine private coast station license that I am responsible for and am working on a second. The FCC does pay attention.
With respect to handheld radios the USCG GMDSS Task Force (on which I sit) and the FCC have been discussing the value of allowing VHF communications within a limited distance of the licensed vessel. There are a lot of technical issues including secondary users. I would not expect any relief in the near future. If I recall correctly (not my area of principal concern) there is ITU coordination necessary as well so it won't move fast.
A couple of thoughts.
First great on the cell phone if someone answers and you are close enough to a tower and that someone who answers can then call someone close to you to get help in a timely basis. Probably not a good choice for the 1st line of defense.
Second how do you know you will be only 2nm off? Sometimes you may be a bit farther off and you little hand held will not work as if you have an emergency the CG does not have a station every few miles down the coast just for your convenience and emergency. You will need more power. I read a few of the comments above and find most are from folks who sail in sheltered waters and not off shore.
If cost is the main criteria then you need to access the cost of your life and those on board. How cheap do you want to go? In an emergency is it worth punching the DSC button and getting the message out there that you got a major problem or not. For me safety is first, second and third and after that everything else comes in 4th and beyond.
We have a base station on the boat and 2 handhelds. We have used the handhelds when one of us is ashore and needs to talk with the other and obviously not on channel 16. We also have taken both ashore as sometimes we split up to run various chores and use the radios to meet up again someplace down the line.
So is your life worth a radio, antenna and cable or do you want to go cheap and take the risk? Your call.
First great on the cell phone if someone answers and you are close enough to a tower and that someone who answers can then call someone close to you to get help in a timely basis. Probably not a good choice for the 1st line of defense.
Second how do you know you will be only 2nm off? Sometimes you may be a bit farther off and you little hand held will not work as if you have an emergency the CG does not have a station every few miles down the coast just for your convenience and emergency. You will need more power. I read a few of the comments above and find most are from folks who sail in sheltered waters and not off shore.
If cost is the main criteria then you need to access the cost of your life and those on board. How cheap do you want to go? In an emergency is it worth punching the DSC button and getting the message out there that you got a major problem or not. For me safety is first, second and third and after that everything else comes in 4th and beyond.
We have a base station on the boat and 2 handhelds. We have used the handhelds when one of us is ashore and needs to talk with the other and obviously not on channel 16. We also have taken both ashore as sometimes we split up to run various chores and use the radios to meet up again someplace down the line.
So is your life worth a radio, antenna and cable or do you want to go cheap and take the risk? Your call.
Some of these posts make it sound like only fixed units have DSC. My Standard Horizon 851 has DSC and GPS, and it's properly programmed.
BTW, The USCG says that most DSC messages they receive are missing vital info, like position. It's no use if you don't fill in the website properly, program the radio with your code, and hook the radio up to GPS.
BTW, The USCG says that most DSC messages they receive are missing vital info, like position. It's no use if you don't fill in the website properly, program the radio with your code, and hook the radio up to GPS.
Joined
·
13,619 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,046
Mark- WRT a marine utility station license...
The general web site says to use Form 605. Except 605 still requires a vessel name, which a shoreside portable won't have. And it makes absolutely NO mention of marine utility station as a classification.
A call to the FCC's licensing division got the advice to use Form 601 since the radio would be a coastal station when used on shore. (Don't think so, Form 601 doesn't provide for it either.) And of course, using one portable radio under both a coastal license (feet dry) and a ships license (feet wet) would be a most grotesque way to get things done.
So, has anyone actually FILED for one of these? And does anyone know which FCC Form to use?? Amount of payment??
It might seem easier to just ask the Pope for a writ authorizing the special use of an aetherial speech aide....
The general web site says to use Form 605. Except 605 still requires a vessel name, which a shoreside portable won't have. And it makes absolutely NO mention of marine utility station as a classification.
A call to the FCC's licensing division got the advice to use Form 601 since the radio would be a coastal station when used on shore. (Don't think so, Form 601 doesn't provide for it either.) And of course, using one portable radio under both a coastal license (feet dry) and a ships license (feet wet) would be a most grotesque way to get things done.
So, has anyone actually FILED for one of these? And does anyone know which FCC Form to use?? Amount of payment??
It might seem easier to just ask the Pope for a writ authorizing the special use of an aetherial speech aide....
Joined
·
5,666 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,423
I think marine utility station license is old vocabulary. Now they are public (which FCC also refers to as marine utility in some documentation) or private coast stations (the difference appears to be whether you charge for communication services or not.
I use online filing through the FCC Universal Licensing Service - no paper forms.
I use online filing through the FCC Universal Licensing Service - no paper forms.
Joined
·
13,619 Posts
- Reaction score
- 2,046
Supposedly it is still a current license type, suitable for, say, a guy from a chandlery trying to call out to an incoming vessel, i.e. from the docks to say "Hey, you're heading to the west pier, we're on the east pier" and then five minutes later "Hey, we're in the launch, drop your boarding ladder."
Once on land, once on sea, both situations covered by one portable license.
Same thing for a non-commercial user, i.e. "Hey, come back, you left me n the dock" from a guest crew who will later be taking a dink over to the next ride. One by land, one by sea, the use on land typically incidental but otherwise illegal.
This is very definitely NOT a coast station in any usual sense.
Once on land, once on sea, both situations covered by one portable license.
Same thing for a non-commercial user, i.e. "Hey, come back, you left me n the dock" from a guest crew who will later be taking a dink over to the next ride. One by land, one by sea, the use on land typically incidental but otherwise illegal.
This is very definitely NOT a coast station in any usual sense.
1 - 20 of 30 Posts
