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Discussion Starter #1
Came across this on craigslist, it's a new one by me! Anybody building a cat around Vancouver stealing sails was what got me.
Hope they figure it out.


"Between June 15 - 17th a thief climbed aboard the white catamaran "Shakti" while anchored at Kits and stole the mainsail off the boat's boom. The sail is a Spectra, full batten main, built by Storch sails. The full battens are a light blue fiberglass material with the longest being just under 16 feet. The Storch brand is identified by an approximate 2" X 2" navy blue square, stitched to a piece of Dacron that is then sewn to one corner (tack) of the sail. The approximate measurements of the sail are; foot -15' 6" and the luff - 39'. Note that there are many pictures available of the sail and it was handmade so it can be positively identified even with logo removed. The thief left behind sail ties which are pictured below, given the multihull insignia on one, perhaps the thief is building or out fitting a multihull?

Unfortunately while anchored in Charleson Bay in False Creek approximately two weeks prior, 2 Harken air spinnaker blocks were stolen off the deck, as well the boat was broken into and the hatch over the main sleeping bunk was left wide open during heavy rains. Items stolen included a stainless leatherman knife with bright red lanyard and black case, small 12v power inverter, 300ft of ¾" 3 strand anchor rode, Maui Jim Sunglasses, large chartbook of NW coast.

If you have any information at all that leads to me finding out whom this scallywag pirate is, or just the return of the sail, no questions asked, $500 reward. If you know of someone stealing to outfit their multihull let me know so I can pay them a visit!"

Warning Boat Thief - UPDATE
 

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It sucks to be a victim of theft to be sure. Nothing makes you feel violated like someone going through your stuff! The sail should be easy to spot if the thief uses it around here; there arent many multihulls around these parts!

Unfortunately such theft is the risk you take when you are getting free moorage by "squatting" in our public waterways! It would be pretty easy to board unattended boats anchored on False Creek. Hell, there are even dinghies laying around on the beaches courtesy of other squatters!
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Actually, I don't think the risk any higher for "squatting" though I'd probably call it anchoring... And since there are no moorings here for some reason, and not many other choices when the marina's don't allow liveaboards there aren't any other choices.


So far just on the dock I'm on, that I know of, since April(not including the rest of the marina) we've had 3 thefts, from broken open tool chests(snap-on drawer type) to stolen outboards. However, with any luck within the year I'll go be a "squatter" living at anchor as a boat should properly be. For the two weeks out of five the city allows in the public water way with all their permits and other BS that is.
I'll continue to squat there, and pay for my pump outs, pay for my water, pay for my power, pay to maintain my home, just like any other irresponsible squatter.
 

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It's true that thefts happen in marinas, and even yacht clubs from time to time, but an unattended boat on the hook in an urban area is pretty inviting.

As for squatting, I have no problem with people anchoring for short term, while they are visiting, and doing so within the existing regulations as responsible boaters. I have a problem with people who anchor their boats there for the long term so they don't have to pay for moorage, insurance etc. If someone was living aboard that cat I doubt it would have been stripped in such a brazen way. Perhaps I am wrong?

I am curious though...how do you pay for power and water while you are on the hook?

Anyway the issue of squatter boats is being addressed by all the BS regulations so the problem isn't as bad as it was. Some of them tried to move to Deep Cove once Vancouver cracked down, but fortunately they were moved on pretty quickly leaving the limited space for bonafide cruisers visiting the area. But that is a topic for another thread I guess!

I hope they catch the thieves! hopefully the owner had his boat insured...
 

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I also take offence at the reference to " squatters " . It also scares me to hear someone endorse all the BS regs . I guess it makes some people feel cared for to have BS regs in every part of their life . I don't take offence at people squatting . It's more relevant to concern one's self what people are actually doing as they squat . The one thing that you said that I agree with is that maybe this should be a topic for another thread , however , since you mentioned it in this thread , I responded in this thread .
 

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Discussion Starter #6
It's true that thefts happen in marinas, and even yacht clubs from time to time, but an unattended boat on the hook in an urban area is pretty inviting.

As for squatting, I have no problem with people anchoring for short term, while they are visiting, and doing so within the existing regulations as responsible boaters. I have a problem with people who anchor their boats there for the long term so they don't have to pay for moorage, insurance etc. If someone was living aboard that cat I doubt it would have been stripped in such a brazen way. Perhaps I am wrong?

I am curious though...how do you pay for power and water while you are on the hook?

Anyway the issue of squatter boats is being addressed by all the BS regulations so the problem isn't as bad as it was. Some of them tried to move to Deep Cove once Vancouver cracked down, but fortunately they were moved on pretty quickly leaving the limited space for bonafide cruisers visiting the area. But that is a topic for another thread I guess!

I hope they catch the thieves! hopefully the owner had his boat insured...


The thefts are actually more common in the marinas since it is guranteed that the boats have have no one aboard almost all the time, as you can't live-aboard and any idiot can walk down to them. I'd say most of the boats in the marina where I have my boat stored and where I work see an owner every 3-4 months if they're lucky.

Power and water and sewage cost far more on the hook. Water must be bought and transported out. Either you buy a generator and pay for fuel, repairs etc(all of which help the economy as you are concerned about since they're taxed so highly :)) Per liter of water, and per watt of power used, and liter of sewage produced you pay paying far more than on land.

I think most liveaboards would happily pay for a mooring assuming it was:
1. Available, not with waitlists measured in years or decades as with liveaboard slips.

2. Affordable, aka the costs associated with it were in line with the costs of maintaining it and a reasonable profit.

3. Safe, well maintained. I know my anchor is oversized, modern and well built. So is my chain. I don't know that about something someone else set up.
4. Come and go freely, so if I go cruising it could be designated as transient moorage without me losing my spot, or paying exorbitant fees. For example, if I go for a 2 month cruise in the summer, I would pay 1240$ for my slip. Can't rent it out, can't cancel the moorage. 1 year leases only, due every april 1st.

The single largest expense for my boat right now is the slip fees, and I still can't live on the damn thing.

I'm all for getting rid of the derelict boats, ones that are so unsafe as to pose a menace that sort of thing, but there should be some way to live on a boat, I'm not looking for a free lunch, there isn't any such thing. I do want to live aboard, but there is no way to do so legally here except to anchor out.
 

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Let's see--gov't creates so many regulations that you can't build a new marina except for the very rich (Victoria's just approved one). A little slip in a marina for a 20' boat--i.e. leased public ocean surrounded by some rotting dock infrastructure (why maintain it if you can rent it out anyways without doing so)--becomes so expensive it now costs 30% to 50% of the value of the boat every year. Hmmm. What do you think the waterfront owners pay for that leased public ocean? I'd be happy to lease my own little circle of ocean to put a buoy in, but I can't. So we have public property reserved for the wealthy. Is boating only for the wealthy? If you're not wealthy, we resent you and call you names--like "Squatter"--because we don't want you in "our" personal waterfront view.
 

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As for squatting, I have no problem with people anchoring for short term, while they are visiting, and doing so within the existing regulations as responsible boaters. I have a problem with people who anchor their boats there for the long term so they don't have to pay for moorage, insurance etc.
Schock - I assume you haven't had to look for a berth in quite some time.

Simply put - There aren't any. If you're a broker or otherwise in the business you have access to some - the new boats all seem to magically find berths but otherwise? Good luck.

For example - Fisherman's wharf in the Creek? 400 boat waiting list.

Of course there is a 60' berth for sale in the creek for 1 $million plus. :eek:
 

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Discussion Starter #9
insurance, pump outs, power generation, transport all cost money at anchor. I would like a system that encourages pump out usage, and compliance with safety standards and maintenance.

Ironically, my boat is cleaner, safer and puts more of my money into the economy than my terrible rat infested illegal suite ever did, and if I have a problem I can take action without a slumlord involved.

A simple sticker could solve a lot, similar to current permits, but no time limit, just that sticker is valid for 2 weeks, and only available each time you pump out.
Safety inspections would solve a lot of the remaining issues.

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk
 

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Let's see--gov't creates so many regulations that you can't build a new marina except for the very rich (Victoria's just approved one). A little slip in a marina for a 20' boat--i.e. leased public ocean surrounded by some rotting dock infrastructure (why maintain it if you can rent it out anyways without doing so)--becomes so expensive it now costs 30% to 50% of the value of the boat every year. Hmmm. What do you think the waterfront owners pay for that leased public ocean? I'd be happy to lease my own little circle of ocean to put a buoy in, but I can't. So we have public property reserved for the wealthy. Is boating only for the wealthy? If you're not wealthy, we resent you and call you names--like "Squatter"--because we don't want you in "our" personal waterfront view.
Setting aside the poster's laughable conclusion that the BC government is looking out for the wealthy, the problem isn't responsible boaters who maintain their homes- it is the derelicts. The wealthy waterfront owner views pretty boats at anchor as picturesque- a neglected, ill maintained, direct discharging kelp and crap covered hovel on a hull that hasn't moved under it's own power in years? Not so much. If you don;t like the "squatter" tag, ask yourself what you are doing about it, and if your boat is part of the solution or part of the problem.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
As a live aboard, that's my point exactly bl. Clean well maintained and safe boats yes, derelict no. Rules exist for that, but are not used, in fact it often seems that only derelict boats are allowed to remain, even then there are only a few(only two actually in the most contested area).

There are many simple ways constructive ways to solve the problem, but the least beneficial solution seems to be the preferred choice, which leads people who do care for their boats to question the motives.

The 8500$ a year for my non live aboard slip is part of the reason to want to anchor out, along with the rampant theft, loud drunk charter boat parties at the dock etc, but mostly I just like the idea of a boat being a boat, not just a floating rv at a dock.

Sent from my SGH-I747M using Tapatalk
 

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Setting aside the poster's laughable conclusion that the BC government is looking out for the wealthy, the problem isn't responsible boaters who maintain their homes- it is the derelicts. The wealthy waterfront owner views pretty boats at anchor as picturesque- a neglected, ill maintained, direct discharging kelp and crap covered hovel on a hull that hasn't moved under it's own power in years? Not so much. If you don;t like the "squatter" tag, ask yourself what you are doing about it, and if your boat is part of the solution or part of the problem.
Not here BL - the mouthiest people here want all the waters edge and the view from it to be untouched, witness False Creek - great stretches of the seawall face nothing but empty water. It looks like a huge swimming pool with no children in it. There are a handful of people walking & cycling but otherwise it's barren. The vital parts are where the boats are - all the restaurants, shops, markets etc. cluster around the marina sections.

Guess who wins though when a new marina is suggested.
 

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I'm not to worried about people breaking into my boat i got a lock on everything but besides that my boat looks like when i got it abandoned just a little more cleaned up. So my boats pretty much in boating cammo from theifs
 

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I haven't seen too many marinas with slips on private property. It seems they are always in the water. Just saying....

I stay in a marina and have my reasons for not using a mooring, free or paid. However, I can also see reasons for limiting marina development. Sometimes a good anchorage is thus destroyed for cruisers; both the atmosphere and the space is destroyed. The effects on wildlife are real, particularly when wetlands are drained, but even when they simple build around them with elevated walkways. And some fool is always building a marina in an exposed place, just waiting for the next 20-year storm.

And I know of a few junk boats people live on that I would like to see move along. Others, well kept, don't bother me.

Not simple.
 

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Schock - I assume you haven't had to look for a berth in quite some time.

Simply put - There aren't any. If you're a broker or otherwise in the business you have access to some - the new boats all seem to magically find berths but otherwise? Good luck.

For example - Fisherman's wharf in the Creek? 400 boat waiting list.

Of course there is a 60' berth for sale in the creek for 1 $million plus. :eek:
It is true that I haven't had to look for a slip for many years. It is one of the benefits of having been in a yacht club for many years! I realize that moorage is a challenge, but I don't believe that there is none available. For example,a conversation on another site yesterday revealed that there are multiple 40ft spots vacant at VRC at the moment. There also seems to be a fair turnover at Deep Cove Marina, and some new members of DCYC have recently bought boats and had no problem getting slips there while they wait for a club slip.
Granted, these aren't liveaboard slips, and they may not be prime downtown locations but the space is there. I suspect in some cases it is not lack of available space as much as an unwillingness to pay for the slip. Moorage is a cost of boat ownership. If you can't afford it then you can't afford a boat!
 

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It is true that I haven't had to look for a slip for many years. It is one of the benefits of having been in a yacht club for many years! I realize that moorage is a challenge, but I don't believe that there is none available. For example,a conversation on another site yesterday revealed that there are multiple 40ft spots vacant at VRC at the moment. There also seems to be a fair turnover at Deep Cove Marina, and some new members of DCYC have recently bought boats and had no problem getting slips there while they wait for a club slip.
Granted, these aren't liveaboard slips, and they may not be prime downtown locations but the space is there. I suspect in some cases it is not lack of available space as much as an unwillingness to pay for the slip. Moorage is a cost of boat ownership. If you can't afford it then you can't afford a boat!
P.S. Thanks for the tip about the VRC - I'll have to call them about a membership.

Just out of curiosity, how long does it take you to get to English Bay? I've always felt that keeping a sailboat in Deep Cove would restrict you to Indian Arm or to multi-day cruises.
 

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P.S. Thanks for the tip about the VRC - I'll have to call them about a membership.

Just out of curiosity, how long does it take you to get to English Bay? I've always felt that keeping a sailboat in Deep Cove would restrict you to Indian Arm or to multi-day cruises.
The Rowing Club is surprisingly inexpensive to join too! Apparently they don't even have an initiation fee! Not bad for a prime location like Coal Harbour!

Keeping a boat in Deep Cove is definitely not as convenient as some other locations, but it isn't that bad. With favorable tides I can be in English Bay in 2 hours. It is a bit far for a daysail, but I quite enjoy Indian Arm for that purpose. We often go to the top of the Arm for regular weekends, and save the trips to Howe Sound or the Strait for the long weekends.
 
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