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Discussion Starter · #1 · (Edited)
...someone needs to tell everyone that there's a recession going on because it looks like an awful lot of folks missed the email.

Much shopping and spending of money occurring.

Not a lot of sailboats exhibiting (nothing new about that) but a couple that weren't there last year. There was a Lagoon catamaran available for boarding and inspection - somewhere around 37 feet or so and selling for just north of $500K (Cdn) sailaway.

I think that the buyers for these boats must be limited to the neophyte trade. The boat was constructed of fibreglass that flexed under my weight and copious amounts of particle board or some such thing covered with a very unprepossessing 'wood look' plastic laminate. There is no place for particle board on a boat. The overall effect was half RV and half cheap motel.

Incredible to think that there is a market for this.

Jeanneau was on show - like a Catalina but not as well made. C&C, Hunter, Beneteau, etc. Looked like there were more dinghies this year. There was a brand from Eastern Europe - TES - that had a 28 footer there. Didn't look too closely at it but it looked like a better sailer than the 24 foot model they were showing last year.

Hunter is producing a MacGregor knock-off. 'Breeding will out' as my mother was fond of saying. :)

Island Packet was showing a boat for what I believe is the first time in Toronto - or at least it is the first time in my memory. This is a well-built boat. Not too taken with the berth arrangements but this is the first offshore-worthy boat I have seen at the boat show in a long, long time. I will think seriously about buying an Island Packet when the time comes.

Priced at just over $400 (Cdn) - a far, far better value than the Lagoon.
 

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Toronto Boat Show..

I was thinking of driving up for the show. I can't seem to find any information about what boats are there.

Can you tell me what Sailboats are there in the 30-34 range...

Thanks
 

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Show impressions: Lots of people looking but then again it was the first day. I saw lots of people doing the finance thing on 14-20' power boats. Lots of people buying those Shamwow towels (They do work, Mom bought them at the show 10 years ago). Lots of people buying bits and pieces.

The admiral and I went on board the Delphia 37. Nice boat and oddly enough the only one without a huge line to step on board. Nice systems installation. Lots of real wood - not laminate. The electrical installation was absolutely stunning. Deck and cockpit were laid out really nicely.

J105 and 115 were on display as well as the Tartan 3700 and a couple of Beneteaus. I liked the lines on the Jeanneau. Overall I found the sail section MUCH smaller than last year. Lots of gear on display. A good selection of dinghys. Lots of clubs trying for memberships. Discovered a club I will stay away from based on the 2 members at the show (Lakeshore). Met 1 club that had really (REALLY) nice people representing (Etobicoke Yacht Club).

NASA instruments are available now in Canada under the name VMG Marine. Nice looking stuff and a steal compared to the Raymarine stuff. The wind indicator, transducer and cable at CDN$370!?!?! A combo depth/ speed for CDN$315!?!? I am headed back to put down a $100 deposit on those and then I get the delivery in April.

Lots of big huge gorgeous power boats that will need a second mortgage to fuel up. Lots of Bass boats and wakeboard boats. Chris Craft had a very nice runabout. Hunt (As in C Raymond Hunt) had a very nice boat on display. As then owner of a Bertram (Also a Hunt design) I was happy to see it. The

Engine Manufacturers were trully represented. Right up front with huge displays. How often do they think people need to repower? My Bertram is on its 2nd engine since 1964 (replaced an in-line 6 130hp with a 260hp 5.7 litre V-8 beast), my Atomic 4 is 30 years old. I did blow a 20hp Merc outboard a few years ago but it was 20 years old and had been abused by 3 teenagers its entire life (Brother, sister and I - Georgian bay rocks and fishing).

All in all, not a bad show but not a great one.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
I was thinking of driving up for the show. I can't seem to find any information about what boats are there.

Can you tell me what Sailboats are there in the 30-34 range...
This is the exhibitors' list.
Exhibitors List
In the 30 to 34 range I know that there are Beneteau's, Hunters, Jeanneau, C&C and a Sunyacht there. I believe that there are others - probably a Catalina but I didn't spend a lot of time looking at that particular dealer's booth as we were there to look at the Island Packet and it was crowded...
 

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I doubt there is a Jeanneau there in the 30-34' range, unless the sunfast 3200 is in Toronto. They do build boats under 36', which the SO36i is usually the smallest they bring into NA. The 30 and 32 are nice boats, they also have a 21 and 25' boat that look good, but the cost to ship is the problem for the smaller boats.

Marty
 

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There was a sunfast 3200 at the show. It was ok but I would call it a race,race,race/cruiser. Around Toronto if I was spending that kind of money a J105 would be my choice.
As for the show I would say it was the same as last year with no GREAT deals to be had in the line of equipment.
 

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Discussion Starter · #7 · (Edited)
Guess things aren't too bad after all...


*****************************

From the Toronto Star - January 10, 2009:

...won't cast a shadow on the 2009 Toronto boat show, promises Linda Waddell, vice-president of Northern Shows for the National Marine Manufacturers Association and former manager of the Toronto show.

"We're in a sold-out situation as always," she says, "with product in every square foot of space that we're allowed to sell product in. And we have the same number of exhibitors as last year, with over 1,500 boats."...

...According to the monthly report of marine industry analyst Mike Derrett in December, "industry business in the U.S. is probably down to at least 50 per cent of 2007 levels."

He quotes a colleague who visited the Fort Lauderdale Boat Show in October: "The U.S. boating industry is in a state of shock at the severity and speed of the downturn in sales. Most current reports from the Fort Lauderdale show were of year-to-date sales down by 40 per cent to 50 per cent."

...Adelkind, of Angus Yachts, says that by October, people were saying, "it's going to be a bloodbath in the U.S. By next spring of '09, 40 per cent of all dealerships will be gone."

A major part of the problem, he says, is that "the wholesale commercial lending business," the so-called "floor planning" business that underwrites the inventory, is in dire straits.

Here in Canada, however, there's no doom and gloom, says Waddell. The banks are still lending, she says, and "dealers are smart about watching their inventory levels and smart about cutting expenses. As with most industries, boat manufacturers and dealers are adjusting to the economic environment."

But there's another factor that may keep the boating industry afloat in Canada, at least in Ontario.

"Boaters here are very passionate about being on the water," Waddell says, hopefully.

Al Donaldson, executive director of the Ontario Marine Operators Association, agrees.

"People continue to boat," he says, "and to keep their boats at marinas. Overall, we don't see a major disaster area in marinas. Slips will be occupied and operators probably expect to hold their own."

He adds, "Now, 2008 is not 2009. Operators are aware of the economy and most are holding their prices where they were before."

As for the dealers, he predicts, "Dealers will see some decline. But I don't think they're going to be the disaster that's in the U.S. No doubt that credit is going to be tighter and more difficult to get, but good operators continue to get credit. GE Capital and several of the banks have confirmed that they're still open for business and looking for business."
 

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The new dealer for Hunter has a 33, 38, 46 and 49, down from 6-8 boats last year but different dealer.

Bene and Jenneau had 2-3 boats in the 34 - 40 something range.

MacGregor and Hunter had their power / sailboat.
tartan I thought was a 34 but did not go on board.
Lagoon 380 catamaran

Island Packet 36 +/-

I'm guessing at what I remember from the sizes etc. as I went through them all but didn't take care to note each brand / size.

Nothing really below 33 ft. from anyone, but you could get a feel for the smaller boats from the 33 / 34 's ?

I did find a new dinghy for our boat a 28 ft. RIB with a Yamaha 350 going for $ 120 K :eek:

Bought some boat "stuff" but not too much. Wanted mostly to tallk to the new Hunter dealer and check out the bigger boats.
 

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Yeah, we had a boat show in New Orleans this weekend too...it was crap. First off, only powerboats. Now, I knew this before I went but there are usually a lot of vendors there (when it was in the Superdome anyway) so it makes browsing the booths pretty interesting. Well, there were maybe twenty this year. Granted, I went on the last day and in the evening at that, but the feel of the place and word around there was that the show overall was not a success. So, while you don't feel it in Toronto, we feel it in New Orleans...or maybe it is just because we are New Orleans... :(
 

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Didn't see the Angus booth but then again I wasn't looking for it as I got an email back in mid-december informing me of them being in bankruptcy, taken down by the interest costs on their new boat inventory.

Was very impressed at the Volvo-Penta power boat display, whilst waiting for the admiral to visit the heads had a little chat about a lovely little 25 ft with a 5L engine that cruises ALL DAY (7-8hrs) at 35kph on ONLY one tank of fuel, tank is ONLY 55gal.
I am amazed that they quote speed in KPH to make it sound as fast as possible, that a whole day is only 7hrs long and best of all the tank is quoted in Imp gals to sound as small as possible.
My math tells me that is like $50/hour just for fuel. OUCH!

Hacker crafts were stunningly beautiful, but with an entry fee of $220,000 (base) I would hope so.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
The new Hunter dealer? Is this in addition to Angus Yachts or their replacement?
From the Toronto Star...

Angus Yachts, which merged in June with Clift's Marine, Canada's largest yacht brokerage, quietly closed its doors on Dec. 1 after 36 years.

The company had offices in Mississauga, Orillia and Penetanguishene and employed 55 people. In 2005, Angus sold more Hunter sailboats than any other dealer in the world.

In 2006, they started selling powerboats. Last year, they were the largest dealers of Cruisers Yachts in the world. They were about to launch the Prestige line from France.

"We had huge growth, doubling every year from '03 to '07," says Alan Adelkind, former vice-president of Angus Yachts.

"We were touted all through North America as the darlings of the boat business. We turned down one brand a month."

But by autumn, says Adelkind, it was no longer smooth sailing. Instead, it was "the perfect storm," he says, citing the high Canadian dollar that made boat purchases in the U.S. a bargain, comparison shopping on the Internet, the company's investment in expanded staff and costly service software programs, a swollen inventory of "big huge powerboats," and consumer pessimism about the economy.

Mainly, he explains, "We grew too fast. We were spending huge dollars but not taking in enough to keep the thing going"...

...Even Adelkind, who watched his own Angus Yachts sink out of sight last month, is cautiously optimistic.

He's opening a new boat brokerage business, Yacht Pro, and will be at the boat show, "showing my face, handing out cards."...


...
 

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I think the new Hunter dealer is going by the name True North, or something like that. They are taking over the old Angus offices at Port Credit Harbour Marina.
 

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Are you looking for new or brokerage. Don't know what happened with the transition.

Why not give them a call.
True North Yachts Inc.
1 Port Street East,
Mississauga, ON L5G 4N1
905-274-8001


They may be down at the show all this week.


Edit: just found this link, looks like they picked up most of the brokerage boats from Angus.

True North Yachts Inc (Mississauga, ON)
 

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Are they taking over their Hunter inventory as well? They have a boat I might make a lowball offer on depending on how the dollar is.
I was at the boat show today and yes they have picked up the Hunter inventory from Angus including the 49 and 45. Navy Point out of Sacket's Harbor in NY state picked up the Jeanneau's

There seems to be pretty good deals on these boats as they were purchased when the CND $ was close to par.

PJB
 

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Ace, are you talking resale or new. The new 33 Boat Show "Sailaway" price is $ 170, last year it was $ 130 - 140 with the CDN $ being higher than the US$.
 

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Ace, are you talking resale or new. The new 33 Boat Show "Sailaway" price is $ 170, last year it was $ 130 - 140 with the CDN $ being higher than the US$.
Sorry I didn't look at the 33. Anything that Angus still had in stock at the time they went into receivership seems to be discounted.

PJB
 

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Ace, are you talking resale or new. The new 33 Boat Show "Sailaway" price is $ 170, last year it was $ 130 - 140 with the CDN $ being higher than the US$.
At today's exchange rate 140K USD is approx 170K CND, last year at this time it was around par or 140K CND. So.. the 33 must be new inventory

PJB
 

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i shouldnt complain because the tickets were free but i thought this years show in toronto was kinda lame.
they never really have too many sailboats and this year there was even less.
as mentioned there were a couple new power-sailboat disasters on display which i just cant understand why people buy.
most vendors were selling items with sale price stickers which are no lower than in their stores on any regular day although i found a good deal on the prop i want to get this spring.
i really liked the new hanse models and was surprised on their price being low as they were.
very impressed by the tartan 34 however they ruined the v-birth on the boat by making undersized sleeeping area due to oversized closet space,otherwise a beautiful boat.
i found love with the new c&c 110 (same as last year) but not the $340k price tag.
 
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