[chall03]

What boat and why for family of 4 to do a circumnavigation on a moderate budget?

I am leaving the question somewhat ambiguous as in part my curiosity is philosophical as well as pragmatic.

I know there are several boats that could and have done it. I have read the 'Bluewater' lists and gone a round or two in a few of the threads but what I am trying to figure out is what is the best fit for us.

We currently sail a Martzcraft/Roberts 35. It could do it.

While we have cruised thousands of miles mostly coastal and like alot about her however for world sailing we are starting to consider whether she is perhaps not right for a trip around the globe. She is perhaps a tad small, as racers in a former life we also have to confess that she is not quick.

We would still prefer to go as small and simple as possible, but what is small, simple yet comfortable for living aboard for 3-5 years with school aged children?

Our plan is a'standard' circumnavigation but with the current Gulf of Aden situation it would most likely be via the Cape of Good Hope.

For the sake of a guide let's say 40 - 55ft.

Budget is very variable. In reality we will spend what we have to get the right boat. Say loosely 150k-400k.

Boats we have considered

Peterson 44/46
Stevens 47
Amel Super Maramu
Bristol 45.5
Hallberg Rassy 42/46
Brewer 42
Saga 43
Montecarlo 43

All advise and thoughts welcome.

 

[ScottUK]

Catalina Morgan 41 12.6m 1987 | Trade Me

This might do you. It's less expensive and should be fairly well kitted out already. The drawback is that it's across the Tasman.

 

[chall03]

Thanks Scott. Across the Tasman does not worry me, if anything it gives us better angles on the Pacific islands.

Is this the same boat as the Morgan Out Island?? If so is there some concerns about build quality on these?

I ask as I do not know. Otherwise, it would look to be a slightly larger version of our current boat, which is perhaps where we are heading. Maybe not great sailing performance either?

 

[SVAuspicious]

Hallberg Rassy 42/46

Look at the Frers HRs - they are much quicker, higher pointing boats than the Enderlein boats: 40, 43, 48.

 

[chall03]

Look at the Frers HRs - they are much quicker, higher pointing boats than the Enderlein boats: 40, 43, 48.

Thanks.

I had heard that and so we have been restricting our search to 90s/early 2000s (by reason of budget) Frers models.

 

[pcmm]

You should add the whitby 42 to your list. Long keel for stability and safety. Center cockpit with generous aft cabin ( refuge from the kids!) lots of tankage! The only down side for me is the ketch rig, I never really liked the ketch rig very much. And on the whitby, the mizzenmast is too big, contributing to weather helm. Whitby made lots of them and they are generally considered better built than the fort Myers Brewer 12.8 (42).

 

[ScottUK]

Is this the same boat as the Morgan Out Island?? If so is there some concerns about build quality on these?

I think it might be a later type model but I think a lot of the OI are ketch rigged. I have never heard of issues with them but could never be 100%. Don't think it would ever be considered a racer given its design. I think it does have an encapsulated keel which I think is a plus. Just thought it might be servicable for your goals and save a bit of money at the outset.

 

[christian.hess]

although heavy it is similiar to a couple of the boats you posted

I think the westail 42 is a hefty and comfortable familiy cruiser...many of them have an enclosed cockpit(center cockipt)

center cockpits are ofteh preffered for families because they are usually dried and less exposed cockpit wise but most importantly you have an aft cabin that can be used for the kids...

separating adults from kids is sometimes needed jajaja

 

[TQA]

If I was thinking fibreglass then the Amel would be my choice, comes with a front bulkhead and Henri knew what he was doing when he made those as circumnavigators.

However a steel boat would give me a more secure feeling when things go bump in the night.

Something like this. 1990 Southern 50 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

 

[JonEisberg]

I wouldn't be too quick to add that Morgan OI to your list, if I were you...

Of course some have gotten around, and Earl Hinz sailed his all over the Pacific for years... But they are all getting pretty long in the tooth, and 2 have been abandoned off the US East coast recentlly - one in the Salty Dawg rally last fall (after reportedly having a bulkhead come adrift, and hull to deck joint 'issues'), and another 350 miles E of Norfolk just a few weeks ago, in conditions that were not reported to be all that extreme... Don't write off Morgans entirely, however, I've always thought that boat of Andre's is a pretty sweet boat, and could suit your needs very well... Finding one in your part of the world, however, could be a bit of a challenge...

Of your list, I might be tempted by the Saga 43, but that's largely due to my preference for an aft cockpit... But Auspicious is right, you couldn't go wrong with a Frers-designed H-R, I think those are wonderful boats, and one of the few center-cockpit boats I would care to own, and I was really impressed by the overall quality and performance of the 43 I delivered last year...

Not to mention, I haven't heard of any H-Rs being abandoned when the going got tough, lately...

 

[MedSailor]

An experienced friend of mine who has been part-way 'round the world and has done many deliveries up and down the US west coast with friends says that the Morgan OI with the shoal draft off the Oregon/Washington coast was the "scariest experience of his life." He's been in worse conditions, but he found the boat unstable and unsteerable [edit] in anything above moderate conditions. YMMV.

My recommendation? A Nauticat 40. Even the motor-sailor line of Nauticats can be found sailing all over the world. The motor-sailors are usually much more affordable than their S&S designed cousins (though mine was a rare exception of a very motivated seller), and even the 33footer would do very well for a family of 4 with it's layout. The pilothouse doors and windows of the older models can be a liability, but the windows can be replaced/reinforced and plexiglass storm shutters can be made cheaply.

MedSailor

 

[christian.hess]

I hate to be biased but the morgan oi 41 is one of my least favourite boats and I second the same comments

other boats that Im biased about are those weird schooner bowed bucanneers and similar boats they made in the 80s

anywhoo

pleeeeeenty of boats to chose from

of course dependant on market, where are you planning on buying?

 

[christian.hess]

PASSPORT 40

modified fin full keel and skeg...I liked them..saw a few out there

 

[SVAuspicious]

Of your list, I might be tempted by the Saga 43, but that's largely due to my preference for an aft cockpit... But Auspicious is right, you couldn't go wrong with a Frers-designed H-R, I think those are wonderful boats, and one of the few center-cockpit boats I would care to own, and I was really impressed by the overall quality and performance of the 43 I delivered last year...

I like the Saga also. Buying a center cockpit was something of a surprise for me. HR, Moody, and some of the Najads have managed to avoid the wedding cake aesthetic. The aft cabin sure is nice, as is the aft deck.

I don't know all the boats on the OP list from personal experience. The Peterson 44, Stevens 47, and Amel are, in my opinion, good cruisers.

Every boat design has its strengths and weaknesses. A purchasing decision comes down to many small decisions. It is all about priorities. Not all are subject to rational discussion. For example, I can make a very good case for why a head at the base of the companionway is a good idea. I'm not sure I could make a case for not having a head there as a deal-breaker, but it would be for me.

I'll sail nearly anything. A boat I own has to speak to me.

 

[christian.hess]

I'll sail nearly anything. A boat I own has to speak to me.


wise wise wise

 

[ScottUK]

Just to clarify I don't believe the boat I linked is an OI.

 

[MedSailor]

Here ya' go mate.

Used 38' Nauticat Ketch for Sale | Yachts For Sale | Yachthub
A Nauticat 38 in your neck of the woods under 100K. The NC38 is the boat we were originally going to buy. It is a FANTASTIC family boat. Selling points include having 2 big separate seating areas with tables so the kids can spread out projects on one, and you can eat on the other. Separation of space is good too with kids up front and parents in the aft cabin (2 heads). The teak rail all the way around helps keep the kiddos aboard.

Other Nauticats in your area including a NC40 (which doesn't have a sauna. I checked. ):
Used Nauticat Boats for Sale | Yachthub

MedSailor (Nauticat evangelist)

 

[killarney_sailor]

Peterson 44/46
Stevens 47
Amel Super Maramu
Bristol 45.5
Hallberg Rassy 42/46
Brewer 42
Saga 43
Montecarlo 43

All advise and thoughts welcome.

I don't know the Montecarlo so cannot comment on it. We have a Bristol 45.5 and has served us well. Tough as can be and reasonably quick for its age and purpose. We looked at Petersons and I think the Bristol is better. Quite impressed with the Stevens 47 and various HRs we have seen. Very big fan of Amel. if we were doing it over and with more money to spend and if we were staying with a mono (answer big question), the admiral has said it would an Amel.

Final comment, the boats you are comparing here are quite different in both size and cost. I like the Saga but it seems much smaller to me. I don't think the Brewer/Whitby 42 (made in my home port of Brewer (I mean Whitby)) are in the same class as the others. Passport 40 is also not close in size to boats like the Stevens and Bristol. There are other boats in the 45' +/- range as well.

Final comment, I have never even done an overnight on cat but there are families out there doing circumnavigations in them quite happily.

 

[SVAuspicious]

Passport 40 is also not close in size to boats like the Stevens and Bristol.

I think the biggest issue with the Passport 40 is that it is not a good fit for racers, even retired racers gone cruising. It just stops in a sea.

 

[MedSailor]

For the sake of a guide let's say 40 - 55ft.
.

Oops, didn't read close enough what your size range was, nor did I see the Amel Super Maru. That's a big budget boat. In that case, in my role as "Nauticat Evangalist" I shall point you towards the S&S designed NC 521. It's the bigger brother to my boat.

Used Nauticat 521 for Sale | Yachts For Sale | Yachthub

Though, it'd be hard to pass up the Super Maru, especially if you don't desire a true pilothouse. I like what they did with the Super Maru though, where they located the wheel tucked well under the integral hard dodger. Check out the youtube videos for S/V Delos. I believe their boat used to be my slip neighbor in Seattle and now they've left Australia and are cruising SE Asia.

MedSailor