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I don't know anything of the boat selling/buying world (yet), but if they have a link on their website about requesting a demo sail it seems like they are inviting tire-kickers (intentional or not).
 

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Lake Sailor
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No offense but, why are you ignoring the advice you were given in the thread you started in regards to the Beneteau 30 sailing characteristics? It just doesn't sound like it is going to sail any more different or be any more comfortable for your wife. Maybe she just wants something "pretty" to sit at the dock? As others have said, I think you need to do better research on boats first.
 

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ASA and PSIA Instructor
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First thing is understand there is no general protocol in purchasing a boat for a "test sail". A purchase process will often involve a sea trial, but the stated purpose of the sea trial is to confirm the operation of equipment not otherwise subject to verification. At this point the deal is signed and final, the outcome of the sea trial only affects how any escrow is disbursed.

Looking at a brand new boat is different, as dealers may have a demo, and dealers are somewhat desperate to make a sale. I have unfortunately nil personal experience with buying a brand new boat ('cepting a R19) but would expect a dealer to bend over backwards to accommodate a test sail, especially for a new design like the First 30.

You may be barking up the wrong tree with this model. Want to race seriously with a consistent crew of eight adults - I would say this is the boat. Cruising alone with the wife, maybe not at all.

...I just REALLY like the look of the new Beneteau First 30 and my wife said she would sail with me more if it was better than the S30 in choppy conditions...
The First 30 looks to be a wide boat with a flat bottom, I would expect her to pound in any chop. If you have your test sail in San Diego bay with 6 knots of wind, the First 30 will be dream and you'll all be hot to go; go out on the ocean in 25 knots of wind afterwards you may find your wife will never get on a sailboat again.

That said, I would be very happy to be sailing one...


There are a number of reviews around:
http://www.sailingworld.com/sailboats/the-beneteau-first-30-goes-modern
http://www.cruisingworld.com/sailboats/boat-reviews/best-small-cruiser-30-feet-and-under-beneteau-first-30
 

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HANUMAN
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Find someone who owns one and ask them to take you out.

If I was spending 100K plus, I would charter one for a week first. That's the only way you have a chance to really test it out in a variety of conditions and you might just find something you absolutely hate about the boat that you would not discover unless you spent some time on it.
 

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If you want something more comfortable in the chop you need a bigger boat, not a different 30' boat. In a gale they all seem to shrink like a cheap T-shirt anyway.
Adventura in Dana just started chartering a 2002 Bene 323, rent it for an afternoon, that should sell her ASAP, and answer your questions. However, there's probably no retreating once she gets a taste of some comfort. Don't even let her see a boat with ultra leather upholstery and innerspring mattresses if you don't want them on the "must have" list.;)
 

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Hey,

A 'test sail' isn't going to solve your problem. Any boat will sail nice and smoothly in 10 kts of wind. A real heavy boat will be a dream in 20 kts and a pig in 5 kts. A lightweight racer will be a dream in 5 kts but will make your wife scream in 20 (a bunch of racers would scream too, but with delight).

IMHO, it sounds like your wife would like a more comfortable, more traditional boat. I don't think a First 30 would be the right boat for her. The Oceanus line would be more to her liking than the First line.

Good luck,
Barry
 

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Discussion Starter #27
Thanks guys...First off she won't be on the boat in 20 knots if we can help it...Not doing long cruising, just daysailing...now I might do some longer trips solo or with sailing buddies and I am not bothered by the chop...I don't want a bigger boat at this point as I really like how a boat in the 30 ft range handles. I have found another dealer and the owner has offered to take me out anytime in his personal First 30. Because of the newness of the boat I have not found one I can charter...I'd love that...I also hear that because of the different design, it will sail differently than another Beneteau...so chartering a different boat may not give me the answers I want. I don't sympathize with a sailboat dealer at all...to me its simple...get someone who has the money to like the product...and sell it. If they wanted more info on whether I was serious or not fine...but asking me to do a deal, then write a deposit check before I know if I like it isn't my way of doing business...I have bought 6 figure cars and to me it was a pretty simple transaction. I am not really sure why a boat has to be that different. Maybe I am naive. I am sure they have people looking for free rides all the time...I'll pay for a ride. Not looking for that. I also am not looking fr a long Sunday cruise that will take up their time...but their website says "Email us for a demo". So I did. Maybe I'm spoiled with how I bought this boat...The owners wouldn't take the check until I had been on it MANY times...and had all my questions answered. I actually thought they were going to change their mind because they were not salivating to take my check.

sailingfool...NONE of the reviews talk about racing with a crew. They all say how EASY it is to sail shorthanded and singlehanded and how its a great boat for a FAMILY as its not so hardcore. So you are the first person that says the New First 30 is a hardcore racer. In fact Beneteau says its a Performance Cruiser that you can race, not a Racer that can cruise.

Another reason I like this boat is the tiller...I like a tiller and prefer it to a wheel...especially for singlehanded sailing...not many cruising boats have tillers...

So the real question is...will my wife like another boat MORE than the current boat so she sails more with me? Thats the question and I think the only way to answer that is to put her on another boat. Anyway its my day off..and I am off to go sailing!
 

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.... In fact Beneteau says its a Performance Cruiser that you can race, not a Racer that can cruise. ....
Can you spell M-A-R-K-E-T-I-N-G??;)

.....Another reason I like this boat is the tiller...I like a tiller and prefer it to a wheel...especially for singlehanded sailing...not many cruising boats have tillers...
I think a tiller is only easier singlehanding of all the sail controls and winches are within reach so that you can steer with the tiller between your knees.. Not sure that applies here..

With a wheel and a wheel brake you can lock the helm much easier with a wheel and attend to these various chores more easily - even without an autohelm.

I think the First 30 is probably a really fun ride and a tolerable cruiser.. but I'm not so sure it's going to be THAT much different in 20 knots from a comfort perspective.. You're smart to want to get a ride, and hopefully you can arrange that before you multiply your investment by a factor of 5 or 6 and still end up sailing alone....
 

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Yes, a deposit is standard. That is what I did on my last buy.

That said, not always. I have taken and given test drives before; if the seller like to sail and the boat is in the water, it's a matter of convincing the seller it's not a "boat ride." In my case the test sails always seem to be in challenging conditions and out of season, which proves everyone is serious.

As for "good conditions", you are better off with a nice small craft advisory. You'll learn more. Every boat is smooth and dependable in the calms; that's just an engine test.
 

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Sailing on your day off, that's the spirit. You'll find your answers on the water, not so much here.

If you come back to consider more, then consider what your wife doesn't like about chop and whether it's really the boat that is the problem. She may never be okay with chop, if you don't solve the right problem.


I don't presume to know at all. Does she simply fear sinking? Being thrown overboard? Do you seem more stressed by the conditions as they boil up? (we all do to some degree). Anyway, that may be the place to start here.

All the best.
 

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Discussion Starter #32
Sailing on your day off, that's the spirit. You'll find your answers on the water, not so much here.

If you come back to consider more, then consider what your wife doesn't like about chop and whether it's really the boat that is the problem. She may never be okay with chop, if you don't solve the right problem.


I don't presume to know at all. Does she simply fear sinking? Being thrown overboard? Do you seem more stressed by the conditions as they boil up? (we all do to some degree). Anyway, that may be the place to start here.

All the best.
Great questions....In the one time she was in chop...I wasn't stressed...had a 30 year experienced sailor on board as well and he wasn't stressed...What she didn't like was where to sit...she was in the way of the tiller so I asked her to move...when she moved to in front of me...wave hit her...she moved to behind the tiller and had to hold on for dear life. I think it was just she wasn't used to it and that was it....I was nervous as well at one point...now i am not nervous...always cautious...but not worried. I keep telling her the boat can take more than we can...so trust the boat. She says she does, but I think when its that rough, she is nervous and just doesn't have fun being nervous. So I try and take her on calm days...which works out.
 

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Great questions....In the one time she was in chop...I wasn't stressed...had a 30 year experienced sailor on board as well and he wasn't stressed...What she didn't like was where to sit...she was in the way of the tiller so I asked her to move...when she moved to in front of me...wave hit her...she moved to behind the tiller and had to hold on for dear life. I think it was just she wasn't used to it and that was it....I was nervous as well at one point...now i am not nervous...always cautious...but not worried. I keep telling her the boat can take more than we can...so trust the boat. She says she does, but I think when its that rough, she is nervous and just doesn't have fun being nervous. So I try and take her on calm days...which works out.
Good plan. I dare say a new boat won't be the answer. Although, if you just want a fellow addict to support your habit, I'm fine with encouraging you. :)

Aren't you supposed to be out sailing on your day off. Have fun.
 
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