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Moody 376
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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I guess this post could go to either engines or plumbing.

Going to overwinter in the water this year in Deale, I know I have to winterize. boat will be plugged into shore power

Thinking that I could put a small oil filled radiator set the thermostat to low and also leave a small fan on a timer. gets cold. heater kicks on separate fan circulates air. boat stays warm.

I was thinking that I'll empty my water tanks, open all the taps and then use a pancake compressor and blow air through the lines to make them dry or go with the pink stuff... if I let it dry out, will this be a problem with a hot water heater?

Genset close seacock and fill the raw water strainer with pink a/f and run until its full or blow the lines out with same compressor?

Engine this is a dilemma as I'm thinking that i might use it from time to time up until January... figure jan and feb are likley two months it wont see much use. so blow, it out fill with pink a/f or leave the engine room open so it get the warm air from the oil filled radiator space heater. that way there not any added maintenance/work to do if I get the one nice day and go out.

heads. turn off sea cock for intake, pump water in to bowl to drain the fill pipe. fill head with pink a/f and pump out then drain the holding tanks.

hvac use compressor and blow out the lines or fill with pink a/f.

top off batteries with distilled water let automatic charger do its thing.

Ikown that on my raw water strainers I will need to get the water thats between the strainer and sea cock either out (vacuum/ turkey baster etc) or get some a/f into that line.

thoughts comments etc...
 

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I prefer blown out lines, to those with antifreeze. I've read that -100 antifreeze is also a bacteria-cide (but can't confirm). If true, I'd prefer that in the water lines, if they can't be blown out (which take much more effort than it sounds). Hot water tanks usually have a drain, which gets that job done quickly. I always prefer -100 in the engine and generator, as it will inevitably mix with some water and become less effective. Winters are bit more harsh up here, though. But it only takes a few rough days to do damage.

I've never known a marina that will allow a portable heater of any kind to be left plugged in. More often, they ban them entirely, even with you aboard. The latter rule frequently broken. Understand, if you warm the air, it can hold more moisture. When that moist air comes in contact with the cold hull, it can condensate out. Best ideas are to run dehumidifiers, rather than heaters, and/or ventilated with dry winter cold air.
 

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Unattended heaters have been known to start fires on boats. Also, they will fail just when you need them most. It seems a thermostat malfunctioning or the power going out will happen just when there's a run of below freezing days.
 

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Don't count on a heater as part of your winterization strategy. Winterize with the plan that the boat WILL get freezing cold. Winterize the engine, head and fresh waterlines properly. Remember power failures happen in the winter as well as summer! If the water at your slip freezes, then you want to add an "ice -eater" to your strategy to keep the water around the boat ice free as much as possible.
 

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Moody 376
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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
all good points didn't think about the condensation.

i think my neighbor is gonna pull out this winter, and they have a bubbler. So I might be able get it on the cheap. the Ches is brackish, and not aware of any solid freezes in herring bay area.

But from one year to the next ya never know..
 

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I store in water in Stamford. Stored in water in New Rochelle, Greenport, North Port.
The marina uses some sort of water agitation system. Haven't seen dangerous ice.
I use more dock lines and check/adjust them at each visit
Visit at least every 2 weeks
remove head sail and send to sail maker for laundering and repair as needed
remove mainsail and send to sail maker for laundering and repair as needed or leave on covered
remove most running rigging, horseshoe, and solar panels
plug into 30 amp shore connection - Use 20 amp charger... 2 8D AGMs
drain all water from fresh water system, open connections at pump, remove spout strainers
We don't drink tanked water, but don't add pink antifreeze to tanks
foot pump until no water. Repeat next visit.
close sea cocks
add pink antifreeze to head, engine bilge water, sink drains
remove food staples... sugar, salt, coffee, oil, pasts etc
remove stowed clothing
remove sheets, and towels
sometimes send oriental rugs for cleaning
top off fuel.. often by jerry can
winterize engine... pink antifreeze
change oil and filter
 

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I've seen ice inches thick in the southern Chesapeake up on the Rappahannock. Meanwhile we haul every year cuz don't wanna think about her in the winter (we love our winter sports!). We still go down a couple times to check on her though. We clearly winterize and also open seacocks once hauled to drain water from them and then close them again as don't wish to risk the yard putting her back in her slip with them open. Leave batteries aboard and simply plug her in on the trips down to top them off. Have never had a problem.

Our marina also forbids heaters if boat is left unattended either in yard or slip. They are fine if staying aboard.
 

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I've seen ice inches thick in the southern Chesapeake up on the Rappahannock. Meanwhile we haul every year cuz don't wanna think about her in the winter (we love our winter sports!). We still go down a couple times to check on her though. We clearly winterize and also open seacocks once hauled to drain water from them and then close them again as don't wish to risk the yard putting her back in her slip with them open. Leave batteries aboard and simply plug her in on the trips down to top them off. Have never had a problem.

Our marina also forbids heaters if boat is left unattended either in yard or slip. They are fine if staying aboard.
I also do projects onboard in winter. In water is more accessible and warmer than on the hard. When I am there I can run the heater and another electric one if I want. I do not leave heat on when I am not on board. Projects include... things like painting engine, interior varnish, sole varnishing... re upholstering... deep cleaning... renewing wiring... Boat yard doesn't permit a shore power connection to a battery charger on the hard during the winter.
 

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Definitely easier in water for many projects , though not all. We simply have other interests for the winter. We plug her in just for the couple days we may be down, as mentioned, to top off the batteries. Our marina has no problems for such, just can't/shouldnt leave her plugged in. Also leave a small solar trickle charger hooked up. Again never had problems.
 

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a. Be careful about relying on shore power for winterization. I've had many power failures in Deale, some due to ice storms.

b. Add valves to head and other systems to add glycol at the right location. For example, you want to suck it through the head, from the intake hose, or the pump will freeze. It is really, really worth it.

c. Some systems have piping to complex to reliably blow out. Your call.

d. There is very little ice movement in Deale. You probably don't need an ice eater. I have used one a few years, but not always.

I've wintered in in Deale for 31 years (one year out). Winters vary.
 

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I’ve wintered my boat in the water in Maine for 4 years and Annapolis for one year and most of the comments above seem more appropriate for Maine or if you planned to store on the hard in Deale where your whole boat would assume something close to the ambient air temperature. But storing in the water is a whole different story.

Even if there’s ice on the waters surface due to exposure to below freezing air temps, the water just beneath the ice is above freezing. Your boat, from an inch or two beneath the waterline, is immersed in a heat sink. So your engine and anything else that’s in contact with the hull below the waterline won’t freeze unless you leave things open so lots of freezing air can flow inside. In Maine, there was liquid water in my bilge all winter. Even inside the boat above the waterline it’s unlikely to freeze because of heat rising from below the waterline and absorbed energy from sun shining on your topsides and deck. In Annapolis all I did was to put a few 100W lightbulbs around in areas I thought might freeze such as in the lazarette where my refrigeration water pump was located and under the galley sink but at different times they all burned out when I was away. Nothing was damaged though. On my current boat the only places I’d worry about is an area just below deck level where 4 pumps are located, my wash down pump spigot, and my deck shower, so I’d probably either blow them out or put antifreeze in them.

If you use pink antifreeze, read the label because some brands have alcohol in them that’s hard on pump seals. Make sure it says propylene glycol and not ethanol.

For occasional visits it’s not necessary but if you plan to stay aboard for part of the winter, condensation on port lights and hatches can be a problem. But if you wrap your screens in plastic wrap and put them in place it helps a lot to keep the warmer moist air away from the hatch’s surface.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
thanks all. boat was on the hard for in deal for 8 years or so before I bought it and all the pipes were blown out and left dry. so that why i was thinking about blowing or sucking all the water out of the lines.

no screens on the portlights, and hatches have velcro screens. I guess I could make up some plastic to cover the inside of the hatches and velcro to the inside of the cabin.

nice idea on the incandescent bulb..

I'm sure I'll spend a night or two as projects dictate...
 

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After 2 years of uneventful storing in water in Maine, I actually read the fine print on my BoatUS insurance policy and found that it said they require that you have a bubbler or agitator of some kind. I’d never seen more than just a thin skim of ice that lasted for only a week or so where I stored but dutifully bought a bubbler and hung it off my transom so it was pointing at the rudder and prop area. I didn’t see any practical need for it but just in case a freak accident sunk my boat I didn’t want them to be able to use my lack of a bubbler as an excuse to deny payment. I hate having to think that way though. Probably not required in Chesapeake area but worth taking a look at your policy regarding winter storage.
 

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Mostly in water winter storage where the marine has some sort of "agitation system" to prevent ice. Haven't seen a really long deep freeze with a thick ice sheet forms in salt water. One year I needed fuel and motored to a open fuel dock... South Norwalk harbor was iced or filled with slush. I waited for a tug going to sea and followed his no ice wake. When I got close the the fuel dock I had to be a but of an ice breaker... but conditions permitted it. But is was weird. It was not really hard solid thick ice however..
 

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bought a bubbler and hung it off my transom so it was pointing at the rudder and prop area.
Assuming these are a foot, maybe more, below the waterline, I'm not sure they are the risk. It's squeezing or carving into the hull or expanding inside waterline thru-hulls that don't have anti-freeze past the closed ball, if any.
 

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Assuming these are a foot, maybe more, below the waterline, I'm not sure they are the risk. It's squeezing or carving into the hull or expanding inside waterline thru-hulls that don't have anti-freeze past the closed ball, if any.
The hull will not be squeezed, cut of crushed... the geometry prevents that.
Anyone who has a pic of a hull squeezed or cut by ice please post it.
 

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Wasn’t Shackleton‘s boat crushed by ice?

I think it’s well established that this isn’t a risk at thin ice marinas, but I don‘t think it’s physically impossible no matter what. Moving ice is a bigger risk of damage.
 

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all good points didn't think about the condensation.

i think my neighbor is gonna pull out this winter, and they have a bubbler. So I might be able get it on the cheap. the Ches is brackish, and not aware of any solid freezes in herring bay area.

But from one year to the next ya never know..
I have walked across the harbor (30years ago).

The harbor freezes in every few years. Last year was a warm exception, but 2018 was quite severe, with most marinas frozzen tight and the Bay closed to recreational navigation for 3 weeks (ice floes). The channel and fairways at HHN would have been solid if not for DAILY ice breaking efforts.

Rockhold Creek Frozen Solid

Yes, it does freeze solid.
 

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That said, damamge is rare. The danger is moving floes blown in by the wind. I've seen 6" ice blown into the harbor (2018).
 

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Oh we have definitely had ice crushing problems on our boat before...it was totally solved with a thick towel and a hammer. Drinks were then served as they should be...over crushed ice!

Sorry couldn't help it! I personally wouldn't worry about ice issues in our latitude other than the above. 😊
 
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